GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 1

[Cardinal47]

You are absolutely right. Or if someone at the funeral home or a friend gave the information, they might not of even known about the other son.

Funeral homes are very thorough and that is a question that would have been asked. They have a form that covers...everything. Step by step...

It's my opinion that son was left out intentionally.

 

[mck16]

My guess is that LE asked them to give as little as possible about family.

There are no grandchildrens names and no spouses of the two sons or daughter.

It's a very light obit for a man that was so successful and I think that was the intention. To honor him but not give out too much information.

It is very strange to me that the deceased son was not mentioned. I wonder if it was to protect any family links he might have???

I really think LE is trying hard not to give out much family information also to protect them from whatever is going on. Are they in danger? We surely don't know. We do know their Mother is missing and that has to be a huge concern eating at their hearts.

Weren't the spouses names listed in parenthesis beside the other spouse. I thought that was strange. jmo

 

[mck16]

Funeral homes are very thorough and that is a question that would have been asked. They have a form that covers...everything. Step by step...

It's my opinion that son was left out intentionally.

When my mother died the funeral director and I wrote the obit together like an interview. No forms. But, I think he may have been left out intentionally and if so that is sad. Does no good to speculate as it doesn't really matter. jmo

 

[Cardinal47]

Weren't the spouses names listed in parenthesis beside the other spouse. I thought that was strange. jmo

I had to go back and look. You are correct they are listed in parenthesis.

Honestly I am surprised they gave out as much information as they did.

 

[Treelights]

http://recorder.maricopa.gov/recdoc...enddt=5/13/2014&doc1=&doc2=&doc3=&doc4=&doc5=

http://recorder.maricopa.gov/recdocdata/GetRecDataDetail.aspx?rec=19700002226
http://recorder.maricopa.gov/recdocdata/GetRecDataDetail.aspx?rec=19760046600

I have a question on some documents, and I looked up what joint tenants with right of survivorship means, and I found this link:
http://financial-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Joint+Tenants+with+Rights+of+Survivorship
"The ownership of property for which the co-owners have right of survivorship. In other words, if two or more persons jointly own a property with right of survivorship and one of them dies, the property does not become part of a decedent's estate; rather, the other owner(s) continue to own the property."

Anyway:
http://recorder.maricopa.gov/recdocdata/GetRecDataDetail.aspx?rec=19760046600
Recording date and time 2/27/1976, Docket 11563 pg. 628
http://156.42.40.50/UnOfficialDocs2/pdf/19760046600.pdf
"Joint Tenancy Deed"
"For the consideration of ten dollars and other valuable considerations, I or we
Russell J. Dermond and Shirley W. Dermond, his wife, do herby convey to
"JRC" and "LC", his wife not as tenants in common and not as community property estate but as joint tenants with right of survivorship, the following described property situated in the county of Maricopa, State of Arizona Lot Seventeen (17) Arroyo Heights
according to the plat of record in the office of the County Recorder of Maricopa County,
Arizona in Book 110 of Maps, pg. 50."
Previous to this back in 1970,(docket 7942, page 764) the same was done for Russell and Shirley by other people to lot 17.

The people here listed I am NOT questioning.
My Drawn Out POINT to all of this is, I found this information for Maricopa County in Arizona.
My question and thought process is, could there have been other properties perhaps with joint tenants with right of survivorship not with family members, but with other people, and with Russell deceased, and Shirley kidnapped, maybe deceased, could others then have sole ownership of property if Russell and Shirley were accustomed to transactions with joint tenancy with right of survivorship?
Could those deeds be a motive, if there are such deeds like this?
Just throwing out questions, ideas, thoughts.....

IMOO.

 

[mck16]

I had to go back and look. You are correct they are listed in parenthesis.

Honestly I am surprised they gave out as much information as they did.

I was surprised they published an obit this soon. Seems very fast to me. jmo

 

[tlcya]

I find the spouse of the surviving children listed in parenthesis to be normal as that is how it is done in my area.

 

[tlcya]

interesting angle treelights. I am familiar with deed transfers and conveyances as a part of estate planning to avoid the need for probate.

joint tenancy with right of survivorship is very commonly used in my area to accomplish this type of estate plan, particularly when there are multiple real properties.

I do not think a motivation could be for an unnamed/unknown third party to expect to benefit from the death of one spouse and the disappearance of the other in this way.

With the Mrs missing, she is not considered deceased and would need to be "declared" dead at some future date to accomplish this sort of convoluted manuever. And to declare someone dead requires time to pass and a court process.

If someone wanted property and they were the beneficiary of that property it would be much more easily accomplished to have both the Dermonds deceased in a very definitive way.

 

[Plumeria5]

Well, you guys have sure been busy! I just stepped out to do some yard work, came in to check the thread, and trying to catch up!

Call it just intuition but I really think Mr. D went outside for whatever reason, was accosted, Mrs. D went out to check on him because he had been gone too long, (I'm back to the "went out to get the newspaper" idea.) and she too was taken to the garage. I wish we knew how early the paper came. The Dermonds seemed like go-getters for their age so I would think they were early risers. Another reason I think the monster/s never entered the house is everything was immaculate. Surely something would be out of place. As gruesome as this murder was, I doubt the murderer would have had time to try to clean up the house.

 

[Cardinal47]

This murder was dimensional in many ways.

1. The gruesomeness of having somebody beheaded.
2. The head missing.
3. The spouse missing.
4. Lack of evidence
5. Nothing disturbed
6. Affluent community with security
7. Security cameras not working


Was this the plan for it to be much more than just a murder? What kind of person would do such a thing and so far get away with it.

Can you imagine the sorrow this poor family of sons and daughter is going through thinking of their Fathers last moments and wondering where their Mother might be.

This is truly a heinous crime!

 

[Treelights]

Well, you guys have sure been busy! I just stepped out to do some yard work, came in to check the thread, and trying to catch up!

Call it just intuition but I really think Mr. D went outside for whatever reason, was accosted, Mrs. D went out to check on him because he had been gone too long, (I'm back to the "went out to get the newspaper" idea.) and she too was taken to the garage. I wish we knew how early the paper came. The Dermonds seemed like go-getters for their age so I would think they were early risers. Another reason I think the monster/s never entered the house is everything was immaculate. Surely something would be out of place. As gruesome as this murder was, I doubt the murderer would have had time to try to clean up the house.

Thing is, if Russell was killed on Friday night or Saturday morning, the police did not come out until Tuesday, so there was time to do clean-up, maybe the perp did not know how much time they had, but evidently they did have time.
IMOO.

 

[tomkat]

I am not familiar with the areas so can you tell me how far away from the Dermonds this would be? TIA

aprrox 3 hours to ridgeland from eatonton, then 30 minutes to bluffton from ridgeland

serial killer? this is also too coincidental, he's moving south it seems

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If Mr. Dermond was in his pajamas I am wondering who they would allow in their home dressed like that?

Mrs. Dermond must have been home because her purse and cell phone were on the table.

They were probably more like dorm pants. Heck I not only see the elderly going down the driveway to their mailbox to get their mail in their dorm pants (PJs), but I see young men doing it as well. As long as they are covered up I don't think people think it is a big deal anymore.

I find it more interesting that he opened his door still in his robe. This tells me he may have already gone to bed when awoken in the middle of the night by the door bell or banging on the door. The person could have said they were having car trouble or told him they needed his help. Unfortunately, I think the Dermonds felt extremely safe in their community. They had lived there for many years and were never harmed. So I think they would open the door to anyone whether it was a stranger wanting help or someone they knew well. That is all it would take. Then there would be no forced entry.

What alarms me more is the blogger who told all this also knew the decapitation was a clean cut. How would they know such intimate details? I don't think even the neighbor that found him would be casually standing there sizing up the decapitation wound. It just seems very odd to me.:scared:

While most nurses and doctors pick this profession to help others it isn't unheard of for some to commit crimes. Several doctors have been accused of serious crimes including murders and even rapes. Like in all professions there are very good ones and then a few bad apples thrown in the mix. So if it was a neat clean cut the person doing the decapitating could be in the medical field. If the cut had been jagged/uneven and had a sawing motion then this would show they didn't have any knowledge of the human body to separate the head from the torso. I suppose they could have also had experience as a meat cutter or perhaps a deer hunter as well.

I bet the FBI is thinking the way the decapitation was done gives them a glimpse into who this suspect may be in general.

IMO

 

[gngr~snap]

http://m.homesnap.com/GA/Atlanta/9671-Huntcliff-Trace

https://maps.google.com/?q=GA/Atlanta/9671+Huntcliff+Trace@33.979954,-84.368217

This is what I have on record as the home the Dermond's left in Atlanta in 1999.
Very similar,waterside, golf course...
*It could be wrong.
I am not convinced they ever lived in Arizona. I think the sons did. I deleted that address not sure it's correct.
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[Eileen730]

This murder was dimensional in many ways.

1. The gruesomeness of having somebody beheaded.
2. The head missing.
3. The spouse missing.
4. Lack of evidence
5. Nothing disturbed
6. Affluent community with security
7. Security cameras not working


Was this the plan for it to be much more than just a murder? What kind of person would do such a thing and so far get away with it.

Can you imagine the sorrow this poor family of sons and daughter is going through thinking of their Fathers last moments and wondering where their Mother might be.

This is truly a heinous crime!

Why take the head?

DiD he bite the person and DNA is in his mouth of the person responsible.
Took the wife because she can identify the person responsible.
Nothing disturbed because it was not a stranger? They were not startled
Not caught off guard.
JMO

 

[Treelights]

http://m.homesnap.com/GA/Atlanta/9671-Huntcliff-Trace
* not aerial view.
This is what I have on record as the home the Dermond's left in Atlanta in 1999.
Very similar,waterside, golf course...
*It could be wrong.
I am not convinced they ever lived in Arizona. I believe perhaps the boys may have lived in Phoenix together.
IMO the Dermond's would not have lived in this home. It looks like it might be a duplex.
If the Dermond's bought it for their son or sons would the ownership/ survivorship apply in the event a son should die?
I am not saying he was an addict, but I would expect to protect their bottom dollar especially if the eldest had drug issues etc.
http://m.homesnap.com/AZ/Phoenix/1950-E-Harvard-Street
*Not aerial view.
1950 East Harvard Street
Phoenix Arizona 85006
Moo
https://maps.google.com/?q=AZ/Phoenix/1950+E+Harvard+Street@33.474174,-112.039185

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Do you mean kind of like these documents and in 1970 it does list a Woodbury, CT. home for the documents to be mailed to after being recorded,
and there is also a year of 1976 listed on this document?
http://recorder.maricopa.gov/recdocdata/GetRecDataDetail.aspx?rec=19760046599
http://156.42.40.50/UnOfficialDocs2/pdf/19760046599.pdf

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Why take the head?

DiD he bite the person and DNA is in his mouth of the person responsible.
Took the wife because she can identify the person responsible.
Nothing disturbed because it was not a stranger? They were not startled
Not caught off guard.
JMO

I think it could go either way. Someone they knew perhaps inside their own community or opened the door to a stranger who told them they needed assistance with something.

I think they both felt very safe there but I do think they were caught off guard whether it was a stranger or someone they knew. Neither one had a clue this was going to happen no matter who the perp is. IMO

I don't think they had to enter the home because I feel Russ came out into the garage after opening the door and if Shirley heard him scream even a muffled scream she would have rushed out to see what was happening to him. Then the murderer would have them both in the garage.

Takes the head and Shirley to terrorize the entire community. Sociopaths love to shock people and feel the power they have when they know they can frighten others and gives them sleepless nights. It is part of the thrill they feel. Power and domination over other lives. This way he not only murderers the Dermonds but he knows he has the entire community scared to death like puppets on a string. I bet he is loving every moment of this.

 

[tomkat]

Sheriff Sills dismisses rumors of mob involvement.

He is not optimistic Shirley Dermond will be found alive.

On Tuesday, they enlisted the aid of a Department of Natural Resources submarine robot to scour the deep peninsula off Lake Oconee outside the couple’s Reynolds Plantation home. So far, they’ve turned up nothing but a ladder and some discarded lumber.

Deputies are searching a wooded area near the crime scene.

http://www.ajc.com/news/news/report-robot-to-be-used-in-search-for-reynolds-pla/nft3h/

seems like the missing is always righ there under the noses of the investigators, dead in the nearby woods, only to be found YEARS later, I thought of this earlier, that she's probably in the woods if she's not in the lake

so sad

 

[oceanblueeyes]

seems like the missing is always righ there under the noses of the investigators, dead in the nearby woods, only to be found YEARS later, I thought of this earlier, that she's probably in the woods if she's not in the lake

so sad

I think 'left by boat' is a red herring and I think Sills knows it too.

They wouldn't carry her that far so she would have to walk and if she walked her hormones would be working overtime due to the stress she was enduring at the time. If that had really been the case the dogs would have picked up her scent all the way down to the boat ramp. Evidently it wasn't because Sills seems to have no clue how they really left the area.

It makes much more sense to me that they had their own vehicle parked close to the garage and after murdering Russ they immediately made her step into their vehicle and then left with her right away and she was most likely put in the trunk. That is why there is no strong scent smell trailing down to the boat ramp. She wasn't ever led down there.IMO Her scent ended right at the house because she left there in a vehicle and not by boat.

Most criminals like this leave the scene with the victim and will discarded their remains in about a 20 mile radius from where they were abducted.

It is worse than looking for a needle in a haystack. They don't even know which haystack to start looking in.

 

[gngr~snap]

seems like the missing is always righ there under the noses of the investigators, dead in the nearby woods, only to be found YEARS later, I thought of this earlier, that she's probably in the woods if she's not in the lake

so sad

I would think she's in the lake. Perhaps in a duffle bag weighed down. (With the head)

I didn't realize Lake Oconee was the 2nd largest lake in Ga with Lake Lanier being first.
There is no telling where she might be if the perp was in a boat.
If on foot I would think near the dock. Even if weighed down she still could surface if the perp didn't put her in something sturdy.
Where I live the lake is pulled back every fall, bodies are sometimes found as the water level recedes.

Tangled on shore etc...

The lake just makes the most sense to me. There are also a LOT of fish in the lake! 433# Of fish PER ACRE!
The fishing limit is 50 per day!
http://www.fishoconee.com/pages/oconee/about.html
I feel so bad or them!

Then again hiding or burying her makes sense too, knowing LE will be searching the water....
Moo
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