GA GA - Shirley, 87, & Russell Dermond, 88, Putnam County, 2 May 2014 - # 4

[2Hope4]

Maybe LE is watching how folks are responding to the holiday as well. Are they attending BBQs or are they staying to themselves? Are they traveling to meet family, or family coming to see them? Changes in behaviors? Things of that sort. I bet they have their eyes on several folks, and trying to gather more as they await the forensic results.

 

[Nuvolari]

I’ll try my best to avoid becoming (too) murky…

Regarding the sinking and rising of a body immersed in water, a body will sink almost immediately and continue to sink to the bottom. And when the body is placed in water it will displace a volume of water exactly equal to the volume of the body. For any object to sink when placed in a fluid, it must weigh more than the displaced fluid. For any object to rise in a fluid, it must weigh less than the displaced fluid. A body of constant weight must expand in volume to become buoyant. If the expansion is very slow, the rising will be slow. If the body is attached to a weight of very dense material, the body volume must increase to a volume which will displace a water volume equal to the additional weight. Disregarding the body, if a 50 pound weight is resting on the bottom and it is to be lifted by a “balloon”, the volume of the balloon must displace more than 50 pounds of water. If water weighs 62.3 pounds per cubic foot, the balloon, filled with only air, must displace slightly more .8 cubic feet of water and must be about 13.8” in diameter. So if the body weight is the same density as water causing it to begin to rise as soon as it expanded only slightly, it would have to expand another .8 cubic feet to lift the 50 pound weight. The Archimedes Rule also applies to the weight. How long all this would take would depend on the rate of generation of gasses within the body.

Trying to cut to the chase…

Water flow in a river or lake is highest at the top middle cross sectional area. Flow is almost zero at the bottom or the shore. Flow is not proportional from bottom to top but generally, as a body rises it will start more or less straight up and then the drift rate will increase as the body rises more and more toward the center top of the river or lake.

There are some really disgusting images of dead bodies floating, if anyone wants to look, but it can take a long time before a body with a weight attached rises high enough out of the water to be noticeable.

So, the point:

As someone previously mentioned, it seems reasonable to consider that the Beast, planning to put the bodies in the lake, had a boat, committed the murders, carried/dragged the lighter corpse down the walkway to the boat hidden under the canopy, returned for the other body but decided it was too much work, decided on surgery, began, got nervous, left with the head, got really nervous, knew the main channel was right there just beyond the cove, attached weight(s) quickly, and slipped the evidence off into the deep water. Over a period of many days, the body drifted downstream while rising very slowly.

The questions:

What possible reason could there be for going several miles downstream to place the body and secure it in position at Riley Shoals if the time required for the body to rise were the same regardless of location and the Beast was under the impression that any weight would keep the body at the bottom? What could be so special about Riley Shoals?

If Sheriff Sills would acknowledge that there was a weight attached to the body, would that prove positively that the Beast used a boat? If the public knew the Beast used a boat, might someone remember something?

 

[Canaille]

Snipped for focus:


Agree, but ...
persons of lesser means may borrow a boat, without or without owner's permission.

Some homeowners in GW and close by developments use the homes only on weekends.
Would any waterfront home owners leave their boats tied at their private docks subject to being 'borrowed', without their knowledge?
Or do some pull their boats from the water, when they are away?
Or do some properties have boat houses?

Although we've speculated about GW ppl - permanent, fulltime, wk-enders, etc - using their own boats.
If a GW person is involved, could he/they have used someone else's boat, rather than their own?

Just speculating. :seeya:

Perp could have also rented a boat. I believe I saw something on Youtube for boat rentals on Lake Oconee.

 

[Xara]

O/T
Lake Allatoona had our first drowning last night.
The boy graduated yesterday morning. He was 3 yrs behind my son. My son was invited to the houseboat party and decided not to go.
What a horrific way to die.
Kids! WHAT were they thinking???

Ok back to your regular lake side community programming

All posts are my opinion only. Sent via Tapatalk

I just googled this......OMG how awful. How could anyone think this "game" is a good idea?

 

[loveboxerkisses]

Just coming back on line again.

I wasn't going to mention anything about this but I want to know is anyone else bugged by this?

One thing has nagged at me from the very beginning.

Russ and Shirley seemed to have been extremely well liked and an integral part of their community but yet it took until Tuesday at 10am for their friend to finally go over to check on them.

The Derby Party was suppose to happen Saturday evening or night sometime, iiiirc.

Why did it take this long for their friend to finally walk over to see if anything was wrong?

Just puzzles the dickens out of me. I just don't see Shirley and Russ the type to just not show up and not call or anything. In fact I don't even think they would ever not show up somewhere they were planning to attend unless an emergency had happened, and I feel even then they would let people know.

It has nagged at me from the time I learned it took until Tuesday to even become worried about them enough to go see about them.

I know this.... if these were my friends and they were always as good as their word about showing up, I would have gone over there immediately after I left the Derby Party to see what could be wrong. Surely whoever this is was trying to reach them repeatedly on their cell phones or land line. Did that not even alarm them?????

I wonder if this strikes LE odd too or is it just me.:floorlaugh:

IMO

Good morning & Happy Memorial Day, thank you to our present and past military for your services to us!
I'm a little behind and trying to catch up, oceanblueeyes I have been wondering that myself since the beginning but didn't want my statement to come across wrong like I was accusing. I have some people I talk to daily that are very reliable and if I didn`t hear from them i'd be over at their house quickly, I work in the medical field and there are some of our patients who miss appointments and it's not unusual but if we have patients that never ever miss I will call them out of concern because it's so out of character for them. So to me it's been very strange because Mr & Mrs Dermond didn't sound the type to RSVP to events and not show hence somone coming to look for them that Tuesday. My heart goes out to whomever found Mr Dermond that had to be a very traumatic experience and one that person is likely to never forget that had to be so scary especially because my thoughts would go to is the killer/killers still in the house? How frightening.

 

[Hickory Born]

Random thoughts...if this were planned out ahead of time, the killer/killers might have been wearing gloves so they wouldn't leave fingerprints. BUT, why would Mr. or Mrs. D open the door to someone who was wearing gloves? Now I am wondering if the door had side windows so they could see who was there before opening it.

 

[lesterfinch]

Perp could have also rented a boat. I believe I saw something on Youtube for boat rentals on Lake Oconee.

Paper trail. Witnesses. Video surveillance. I think this was planned out weeks in advance. I doubt the killers would take that chance.

 

[Hickory Born]

I’ll try my best to avoid becoming (too) murky…

Regarding the sinking and rising of a body immersed in water, a body will sink almost immediately and continue to sink to the bottom. And when the body is placed in water it will displace a volume of water exactly equal to the volume of the body. For any object to sink when placed in a fluid, it must weigh more than the displaced fluid. For any object to rise in a fluid, it must weigh less than the displaced fluid. A body of constant weight must expand in volume to become buoyant. If the expansion is very slow, the rising will be slow. If the body is attached to a weight of very dense material, the body volume must increase to a volume which will displace a water volume equal to the additional weight. Disregarding the body, if a 50 pound weight is resting on the bottom and it is to be lifted by a “balloon”, the volume of the balloon must displace more than 50 pounds of water. If water weighs 62.3 pounds per cubic foot, the balloon, filled with only air, must displace slightly more .8 cubic feet of water and must be about 13.8” in diameter. So if the body weight is the same density as water causing it to begin to rise as soon as it expanded only slightly, it would have to expand another .8 cubic feet to lift the 50 pound weight. The Archimedes Rule also applies to the weight. How long all this would take would depend on the rate of generation of gasses within the body.

Trying to cut to the chase…

Water flow in a river or lake is highest at the top middle cross sectional area. Flow is almost zero at the bottom or the shore. Flow is not proportional from bottom to top but generally, as a body rises it will start more or less straight up and then the drift rate will increase as the body rises more and more toward the center top of the river or lake.

There are some really disgusting images of dead bodies floating, if anyone wants to look, but it can take a long time before a body with a weight attached rises high enough out of the water to be noticeable.

So, the point:

As someone previously mentioned, it seems reasonable to consider that the Beast, planning to put the bodies in the lake, had a boat, committed the murders, carried/dragged the lighter corpse down the walkway to the boat hidden under the canopy, returned for the other body but decided it was too much work, decided on surgery, began, got nervous, left with the head, got really nervous, knew the main channel was right there just beyond the cove, attached weight(s) quickly, and slipped the evidence off into the deep water. Over a period of many days, the body drifted downstream while rising very slowly.

The questions:

What possible reason could there be for going several miles downstream to place the body and secure it in position at Riley Shoals if the time required for the body to rise were the same regardless of location and the Beast was under the impression that any weight would keep the body at the bottom? What could be so special about Riley Shoals?

If Sheriff Sills would acknowledge that there was a weight attached to the body, would that prove positively that the Beast used a boat? If the public knew the Beast used a boat, might someone remember something?

Two possible reasons why killer might have gone to Riley Shoals: 1. That was on the way to where he docked the boat. 2. He wanted the body far away from where he lived if he lived in GW.

 

[Nana46]

I am blaming no one by any means but what has struck me as strange is the age of Mr. and Mrs. D....when my parents were that age I called them daily just to check in at least....I only lived 7 miles from them....it is odd to me if they were deceased by Friday etc., did their children not think it strange if they got no answer by phone???? Maybe it was normal for them not to speak for days but it strikes me as odd....IMO. At their age I highly doubt they would text but maybe so.

 

[Starry Night]

I will ask again - if perps used boat in lake, what difference does it make if the security was down at the gate? How would this help? A car would need the pass on the window or have been preapproved to get through.

This is not clicking for me. Any explanations would be appreciated.

I agree....the boat and the perp have already been established in the neighborhood.

 

[Carolinapeach]

Two possible reasons why killer might have gone to Riley Shoals: 1. That was on the way to where he docked the boat. 2. He wanted the body far away from where he lived if he lived in GW.

I was almost convinced #1 was the reason until driving over there. That almost seems too obvious to me now. Living in GW is hard for me to imagine too. I guess I just make sense of any of it. :banghead:

 

[Suthrnqt]

I agree....the boat and the perp have already been established in the neighborhood.

Well, please share your knowledge with the rest of us. Who is the perp? TIA

 

[Eileen730]

I am blaming no one by any means but what has struck me as strange is the age of Mr. and Mrs. D....when my parents were that age I called them daily just to check in at least....I only lived 7 miles from them....it is odd to me if they were deceased by Friday etc., did their children not think it strange if they got no answer by phone???? Maybe it was normal for them not to speak for days but it strikes me as odd....IMO. At their age I highly doubt they would text but maybe so.

I would call my mom many times during the day and before bed at night.

Just to make sure she was ok.

 

[Eileen730]

Anyone have a Link to a map of the area handy?

 

[Canaille]

Not a map, but I found this and thought it was interesting to watch... good arial views of the lake, etc.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4UEPIZxsMM

 

[Eileen730]

If you notice there are not many boats in great waters. Just about all the slips are empty.

 

[mck16]

If you notice there are not many boats in great waters. Just about all the slips are empty.

Having college age grandchildren that was one thing I thought unusual that they sold their boat. I don't know though if they came to visit often. jmo

 

[Eileen730]

Having college age grandchildren that was one thing I thought unusual that they sold their boat. I don't know though if they came to visit often. jmo

Why keep it if you don't use it!
Something just seems off in this whole thing.
The area is just beautiful but it appears that not many ppl have boats as I can see.

such a Horriffic crime!

 

[mck16]

Why keep it if you don't use it!
Something just seems off in this whole thing.
The area is just beautiful but it appears that not many ppl have boats as I can see.

such a Horriffic crime!

Just assuming (I know that's stupid), that the boat was paid for. It would be a source of entertainment when the families came to visit. Course I don't know what kind of boat it was. For all I know it was a canoe. jmo

 

[lisette]

OBE replied:

Actually the word he used iirc was 'placed' where she was found.

I took that to mean in the area she was found because he also mentions how deep the water is in the area she was found. Why would he mention how deep the water is there if he didn't know she had been submerged below it? Imo, that can only mean she had been weighed down with something in order to remain in that same area for 11 days. If she had not been tethered or weighed down somehow she would have drifted along on the lake floor until she rose no telling where.

Imo she was submerged then the decomp gases made her surface and that is when her body got caught in the trees above the surface of the water.

Thanks, OBE...I follow your thinking and you're probably right, but LE has been so tight-lipped about the location of the body, I don't think we can be completely sure if it was weighted to stay underwater forever, floated to the location and became entangled in the treetops, or was deliberately placed there to be found in a horrific manner...(Sorry...keeping in mind that this body was a precious human being--not trying to trivialize that at all...)