GA - Suspicion over heat death of Cooper, 22 mo., Cobb County, June 2014, #2

[NancyA]

I cannot even put myself there. I have no clue what it would look like if I was accidentally responsible for the death of my child. I doubt anyone truly knows if they would be raving mad or calm and catatonic or anywhere in between.

But something apparently seemed off to responders and witnesses alike based on interviews and statements from multiple people on the scene first.

That alone is highly subjective. Taken alone it is nothing MOO. Taken in with all the other little pieces to the puzzle and at the very least you have someone who accidentally and negligently was responsible for the death of their child and then tried to figure out how to not look like crap when they figured it out midday. Just My Own.

What if what he took out to the car was so stupid and inconsequential that LE knew it was a ruse, a reason to step out to his car or be heading to his car to see what was going on with Cooper. Maybe the lunch visit to car to put "something" in it was because he had just figured out he had left cooper in the car?

IMO the sequence of events then becomes very important because rather than jump up and scream to coworkers OMG! I think I left the baby in the car!!!!

What if, the alleged computer search happened just before the car visit? What if he hesitated to try to figure out what he was about to find a dead or living child?

That means even if an accident, he went into CYA mode IMO.

I've read every page of these threads and your scenario is the one that makes the most sense to me of all. I truly believe the child was left in the car accidentally but the dad remembered - probably too late - and his concern for appearances and self-preservation overrode his parental instinct to run screaming to the car as most would in that instance regardless if they already knew it would be in a futile effort to save the child. I just think he's one of those people who can and do love others but will always love themselves more and would rather concoct excuses for even the purest of accidents rather than admit to have been in any way at fault. This would have helped him remain detached enough to google and then try and come up with some plausible excuse that wouldn't reflect too badly on him. He bungled it by the visit to the car and his inability to keep his story consistent when he finally did report it IMO. Obviously this doesn't make the dad a particularly nice person, actually it makes him to me more than a little despicable, and he clearly deserves to pay whatever penalty is appropriate for his negligence, but it doesn't make this a premeditated murder either.

 

[Kensie]

Great post Nancy.

 

[Karmady]

It has occurred to me that it is common at death to issue a death gasp, that last breath.

I AM NOT SUGGESTING HE HAD ONLY JUST EXPIRED (sorry not yelling, just really want that bit to be clear).

Does anyone know that if as a part of natural decomp processes escaping gases could cause a dead person to issue an audible sound?

Another thing that occurred to me is that a reaction of a distraught father in denial and not thinking clearly to seeing his "blueish" baby in the rearview might be choking? I'm really not espousing that as what happened, but it's a possibility that didn't occur to me previously.

 

[LaborDayRN]

Genuine question - would there ever be any reason to do that? If someone's in rigor they're past resuscitation, aren't they? Also respectfully.

There would be no reason to initiate resuscitation efforts on a person if full rigor.

 

[LayzeeDayzee]

Wasn't the hyperthermia COD announced. At this point, I don't think there's any doubt that the car was extremely hot and definitely hot enough to kill him. I guess there just waiting for the tox to see if he was drugged for some reason - to be still and quiet maybe?

That just made me think of something. If I leave my kids in the car and lock the door out of habit while I run in to the store or something (everyone relax, my kids are way old enough for that lol) if they move, the car alarm goes off. It just happened to me on Tuesday, as a matter of fact. And now I'm remembering also the story someone posted about the dad who turned his car alarm off three times after the child he accidentally left in the car set it off. Only to come out to find his child dead in the car seat...gah! Wonder if the car alarm went off and, if it did, whether anyone heard it. Maybe it wouldn't have since he was strapped in the middle.

sorry for the stream of consciousness post

Makes me wonder.........did he really go out at lunch to put something into vehicle or did he go out there because vehicle alarm going off due to Cooper moving about/struggling?

 

[Karmady]

Thanks. Interestingly, a news article I just read said this happened on June 19th. They're all over the place, aren't they? Who's the most dependable news source that you don't have to pay for, in your opinion?

Is the 18th wrong then, or the 19th wrong? I'll have to double check. imo, there is no reliable msm. In order to get a complete picture, you have to check all of the msm and the blogs as well as social media. Very time consuming lol So I'm selective about what news matters to me. I never take any headline of any msm at face value.

 

[LinasK]

He shouldn't be alive but he may have been seizing. He had just had breakfast so perhaps the sustenance kept him alive longer. The "choking" that he mentions later could have been what he heard at that time and he threw it into the story to try to make it seem more valid.

It seems to me that it might be a situation where he wanted to find the child with a lot of people around. Perhaps everyone congregated in a certain area around lunch time (smoke breaks and what not ) and he intended it to be seen then. Waiting for 4 pm would raise the whole "how could you not know for HOURS" deal, and perhaps his wife would have called etc and it would look more suspicious in his mind. 9-12 should have killed him. But it didn't .

His story was " I totally forgot and then when I went to put something in the car I found him there!!!!" but then the boy wasn't dead yet. So he pretends he doesn't see him AGAIN and leaves to wait. This might ALSO be why he drove away from that area to do the discovery somewhere else. He knew they would likely check the security videos on the camera if he did the discovery right then and there and that they'd see him coming there earlier.

I think you're right.

 

[BrianInBirmingham]

There would be no reason to initiate resuscitation efforts on a person if full rigor.

I might. In denial...and crazy hope... I might have to be dragged away from trying to revive the corpse of my child.

 

[Karmady]

Makes me wonder.........did he really go out at lunch to put something into vehicle or did he go out there because vehicle alarm going off due to Cooper moving about/struggling?

Doubt it. It's unlikely that's the first time the alarm went off and, also, it appears that the distance from the parking lot to the building wouldn't have allowed it. Which, imo, makes it unlikely that the defendant deliberately left an awake toddler in a car seat when the vehicle and the child and the alarm (if there was one) could have been seen/heard by any number of people coming and going as well as the video camera. Not a great plan, imo.

 

[Judicious1]

I've read every page of these threads and your scenario is the one that makes the most sense to me of all. I truly believe the child was left in the car accidentally but the dad remembered - probably too late - and his concern for appearances and self-preservation overrode his parental instinct to run screaming to the car as most would in that instance regardless if they already knew it would be in a futile effort to save the child. I just think he's one of those people who can and do love others but will always love themselves more and would rather concoct excuses for even the purest of accidents rather than admit to have been in any way at fault. This would have helped him remain detached enough to google and then try and come up with some plausible excuse that wouldn't reflect too badly on him. He bungled it by the visit to the car and his inability to keep his story consistent when he finally did report it IMO. Obviously this doesn't make the dad a particularly nice person, actually it makes him to me more than a little despicable, and he clearly deserves to pay whatever penalty is appropriate for his negligence, but it doesn't make this a premeditated murder either.

Yes! This is what I've been trying to say but wasnt as articulate as the both of you. Doesn't mean he won't or shouldn't go to jail but had he handled it the right way once he realized it and/or discovered the child which ever came first, I would think he might have faced different charges. Just based on other cases with a similar situations less the cover up.

This is all blown to hell if the search was anytime prior to the date of death.

 

[Karmady]

I might. In denial...and crazy hope... I might have to be dragged away from trying to revive the corpse of my child.

oh, definitely for me!

 

[LinasK]

I'm still unsure regarding the intent issue and I don't think they have evidence to support it. Doesn't add up. Other than an Internet search that they don't know (as of now) when it was entered, there is nothing to imply his actions were calculated or premeditated as far as causing his sons death. Taking him to breakfast just to kill him? And taking him inside the restaurant to be seen with him to boot. Now if they hadn't paid the daycare bill and couldn't afford to pay it so Ross decided to keep in the car and he fed him to keep him happy and leave him to sleep thinking he would be ok that would almost make more sense. Everything just seems so senseless and far removed from this man's known character. I just keep thinking it had to have been an accident and like a fool he didnt want to admit to people he left the kid in the car and that he died on his watch. If the child is already dead and you are the only one who knows you can try to convince yourself of anything. Clearly he wouldn't have been in his right mind. His actions at the scene at the very least reflect a desperate man filled with fear,anger and at times sorrow. I think he should go to jail I just can't get on board with him setting out to purposely kill his child. If this was a man with a plan I highly doubt he would be flipping out on police to the point of them having to cuff him and out him in a car for close to 90 mins ( as reported I believe on JVM). I think there are dozens of ways he could have harmed Cooper if he was set on doing so that would have been less traumatic and severe than this.

BBM. True, but some people are cowards. This is a passive way to kill someone, and less violent, and... perhaps he thought he'd get off easier if he could pass it off as an accident. People are quick to forgive in situations like this (even though they shouldn't) the "There for the Grace of God/Lest ye not judge" defense.

 

[LaborDayRN]

I might. In denial...and crazy hope... I might have to be dragged away from trying to revive the corpse of my child.

Point taken, and I agree. I should have been more clear. I was referring to first responders.

 

[LayzeeDayzee]

Another thing that occurred to me is that a reaction of a distraught father in denial and not thinking clearly to seeing his "blueish" baby in the rearview might be choking? I'm really not espousing that as what happened, but it's a possibility that didn't occur to me previously.

But if Cooper was in a rear-facing carseat, I don't see how Dad would have been able to see his face by looking in rearview mirror........IMO he'd only be able to see the back of the carseat, where is was positioned in the middle of back seat.

That being said, the overwhelming stench of death should have immediately tipped him off, once opening vehicle door, that something was very very wrong......at which point he'd look around vehicle for the source (assuming he really DID forget Cooper in SUV, which I don't buy for a minute BTW) and see poor little Cooper......at which point you'd expect him to take out the cell phone we know he had in his possession (as he called his wife on that same cell phone a few minutes later when he was parked @ Aker Mills and LE were there)....and call 911.........not drive a ways away then ask for help.

Curious, also, where in the parking lot he parked. Was it way in the 'back 40, so to speak'.....in a spot at very edge of parking lot where the odds of others parking beside him would be low?......how busy or full was the lot usually? Did he park in his usual spot or was lot so full by the time he arrived at 9am that he just parked in whatever available spot there was?

 

[Karmady]

But if Cooper was in a rear-facing carseat, I don't see how Dad would have been able to see his face by looking in rearview mirror........IMO he'd only be able to see the back of the carseat, where is was positioned in the middle of back seat.

That being said, the overwhelming stench of death should have immediately tipped him off, once opening vehicle door, that something was very very wrong......at which point he'd look around vehicle for the source (assuming he really DID forget Cooper in SUV, which I don't buy for a minute BTW) and see poor little Cooper......at which point you'd expect him to take out the cell phone we know he had in his possession (as he called his wife on that same cell phone a few minutes later when he was parked @ Aker Mills and LE were there)....and call 911.........not drive a ways away then ask for help.

Curious, also, where in the parking lot he parked. Was it way in the 'back 40, so to speak'.....in a spot at very edge of parking lot where the odds of others parking beside him would be low?......how busy or full was the lot usually? Did he park in his usual spot or was lot so full by the time he arrived at 9am that he just parked in whatever available spot there was?

true, but he got out and saw the baby at some point. So the point is the same except he wouldn't have seen him in the rearview, but face to face. My bad. Thanks for pointing it out

eta: now I wonder if mom called in the minute or two between him leaving work and pulling over or what happened to make him notice something was wrong -- assuming it wasn't staged.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Genuine question - would there ever be any reason to do that? If someone's in rigor they're past resuscitation, aren't they? Also respectfully.

Way past.


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[LayzeeDayzee]

I think there's an almost certain chance that Harris had an absolute break with reality and remained in a delusional state if not psychotic. His statements to police should be viewed in that light.

bbm

An 'almost certain chance' is not synonymous with 'certain chance.'

IMO, I feel you're making nothing more than an unfounded, unsubstantiated assumption. According your thinking, then I guess the same could be 'assumed' for anyone directly involved in another's death.........armed robbery, domestic violence fatality, home invasion-turned-rape-leading to death, etc etc. So then nobody's "really guilty" because they just "snapped" and acted (killed) based on a break with reality. Sorry but I call pig poop on this.

 

[jmcgladr]

Point taken, and I agree. I should have been more clear. I was referring to first responders.

Me too. I might be desperate enough to try this on my own child, but not anyone else! Would be creepy (for me, anyway) and completely pointless too.

 

[tlcya]

I am going to bring up something a defense attorney would bring up in regard to the reports the father claimed the child was choking.

A defense attorney could spin the whole him claiming the child was choking into - he used to be a dispatcher and knew it would get the responders there quickly, more quickly than my dead stiff baby was in the car all day.

 

[Judicious1]

I am going to bring up something a defense attorney would bring up in regard to the reports the father claimed the child was choking.

A defense attorney could spin the whole him claiming the child was choking into - he used to be a dispatcher and knew it would get the responders there quickly, more quickly than my dead stiff baby was in the car all day.

Yes but he also told witnesses and the first responders that when they got there