GA - Suspicion over heat death of Cooper, 22 mo., Cobb County, June 2014, #3

[ScarlettScarpetta]

A family pet would not die of 130-170* temps inside car so that's not a good comparison. But if it did, just like Cooper he would have an awful odor as Cobb county police reported. FWIW.

:banghead:

Im sorry, Why wouldn't a pet die in a car at the same temps?

And again, The odor was not reported by the police.

 

[snowblossom2]

That's not what I'm reading, snowblossom. That the odor doesn't begin until about 2.5 days.

I hate to be gruesome here, but if anyone as had a beloved pet die and then wait a while to bury it to when the family can gather that night you'll know even a labrador doesn't smell yet - even if he's been out in the hot backyard - after a handful of hours. You can still pic him up, wrap him in a blanket and bury him without smelling death.

Lack of air circulation would concentrate the odor - not create it.

Right. But that dog isn't trapped in a car/box which like you said would concentrate it.

 

[Lorne Malvo]

CNN just showed a new product called baby alert that some dads are using when traveling with kids. The FOB like product beeps if you leave kid in auto.

 

[Judicious1]

as to rigor reports

Eyewitness Edward Cockerham, 49, told MailOnline: 'I was interviewed by the police last night and I told them I thought the guy was acting, he was really over-reacting to the situation.


'I know he had lost his baby but he was acting up more than he should have been. It seemed like acting to me. When he pulled in and people started asking him what had happened, he said that the baby had just started choking.

SNIP

Artiyka also believes the baby had been dead for many hours before Harris pulled the child out of the car.
'The baby was a grey/blue color, not its natural color. I know he was in the car seat but when the dad placed him on the ground his legs stayed in the same sitting position, as if he was laying on the ground with his knees up in the air stiff. It wasn't natural.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...t-car-toddler-son-died-way.html#ixzz35t7We9Ne

Thanks! I knew someone said blue/gray in color. Didn't remember the stiff legs.

 

[JeannaT]

But he didn't die days before and he was alive that morning at Chicfila that part was verified by police and not rumor. He took the child for breakfast.
Cause of death is hyperthermia. What do you think he drove around for days with a corpse? I'm confused by your statement maybe I read it to fast if so I apologize in advance.

No, he didn't die days before. You're right - and LE knows that now too.

But I would think a cop on the scene in the mall - where Dad is crying and saying his baby was fine this morning and now he's accidentally dead would think that was a total lie if he could smell a strong smell of decomposition. The first thought would be, this is a total farce.

It was later when the other evidence about going to breakfast, etc. came out. The Cop's very first impression - in my opinion - has been what's colored this entire investigation.

And I suspect it's because they've dealt with dead bodies, they know a freshly deceased baby doesn't smell so horrible after this little time.

Or anyway, something made them IMMEDIATELY decide Harris was guilty and lying.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

just wanted to throw this out there. We all should be cautious about something I learned my lesson on. The google search does indeed pull up the Bolded text above. But the business about the smell of death does NOT originate from the article. It comes from the comment section beneath the article.

Search engines do not discriminate between the body of the published doc and the comments beneath it.

So if you google or bing the words Harris heat death smell, you will get all sorts of hits that seem to indicate the article described will contain that text. Notsomuch Like I said lesson I learned the hard way.

I still say where there is this much smoke there is fire. Just waiting for the details to come out in trial.

ETA the comment was made by someone with initials M c and was made on June 26th and discusses a time her father found a dead body and the odor associated and quotes Randy Travis from Fox-5 said police said Harris had to have smelled it. HTH

ETAA sorry forgot to add link to story that searching google associates with the bolded above http://mdjonline.com/view/full_stor...s-toddler-died-from-heat?instance=home_viewed

Thanks Tlcya!

Good to know that the comments get "thrown in" with the text of the article in Google entries!

I will remember that! :seeya:

 

[JLSChook]

Im sorry, Why wouldn't a pet die in a car at the same temps?

And again, The odor was not reported by the police.

In your opinion it wasn't reported by LE. Many of us believe it was, as quoted several times from two different LE sources.

 

[popsicle]

DO you have factual info for that? Because we are made of the same biological material and I have never seen anything allude to a child decomposing faster than a child. It is the same process for us all.

I stated imo... however, I did see an interview with Dr Vincent Di Maio ME the other day who stated the exact same thing. jmo

 

[Lorne Malvo]

Problem is we can't find where they said that it smelled... Only that a unnamed source said it to Randy Travis.

Randy Travis is an EXCEPTIONAL reporter with inside sources you don't have privy. It's obvious someone with Cobb county police force told Randy. Many times reporters get inside info "off the record". Common practice. HTH.

 

[JeannaT]

Right. But that dog isn't trapped in a car/box which like you said would concentrate it.

It's not the concentration that creates the smell, snowblossom. If you can get right up to the dog and hug it a last time goodbye and it doesn't smell, that's because it's not putting off the odor of decomp yet.

I don't know why this baby smelled so foul so soon, and I don't know for sure if that's in fact what happened. I think it will be in the ME report if there was an unexpected foul odor.

This is as grisly a topic as they come, but that coroner who was so fabulous in the Newsome/Christian murder trials talked about how coroners are extremely aware of smells and when the smell is unexpected considering the other evidence presented.

 

[OtterPops]

This whole thread off-shoot is getting painful to read. If we cannot take info given to us by a reporter who claims to have spoken to two LE sources and discuss it as reasonable info in the case, what is the point of this entire website?? We can only take info from official documents and court proceedings as "facts" because then we have "proof"? Even then it's not "proof", it's stuff thrown at a wall lawyers hope will stick. Isn't this a forum for discussing information, getting more information and sharing ideas? Otherwise... what is the point??

 

[gitana1]

Food takes 24 hrs or more because the stomach is removed.

That car reeked. IMO it was overpowering and there is no mistaking decomposition for a dirty diaper.
Yes, diapers stink... It's just not the same.

IMO
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I would never suggest a dirty diaper can be mistaken for decomp. Plenty of parents can get used to the stinky smell of a diaper. No one gets used to the smell of death.

Because babies are smaller and smell sweeter the decomp smell will not be noticeable as quickly or they will not decompose as quickly?

The truth is imo... In that heat... a temp of 130-170 within the car... a small child will actually decompose faster than usual and will decompose faster than an adult.

Can you guys link to info supporting your statements? Because JeannaT linked to actual info. I don;t have reason to accept one position over another as to what actually happens with decomp except via linked articles. Do children decompose faster? Does heat accelerate the process (I think it does) and if so, by how fast?

 

[JeannaT]

Randy Travis is an EXCEPTIONAL reporter with inside sources you don't have privy. It's obvious someone with Cobb county police force told Randy. Many times reporters get inside info "off the record". Common practice. HTH.

Maybe the inside source lied? Got it wrong? Heard it third hand? Jumped the gun?

A reporter is only as good as his sources, and this guy isn't naming his source - so obviously it's not anyone authorized to talk.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

In your opinion it wasn't reported by LE. Many of us believe it was, as quoted several times from two different LE sources.

But only the same one reporter so that is just one source. And no LE are reporting it. It is second hand supposed confidential sources.

 

[JeannaT]

This whole thread off-shoot is getting painful to read. If we cannot take info given to us by a reporter who claims to have spoken to two LE sources and discuss it as reasonable info in the case, what is the point of this entire website?? We can only take info from official documents and court proceedings as "facts" because then we have "proof"? Even then it's not "proof", it's stuff thrown at a wall lawyers hope will stick. Isn't this a forum for discussing information, getting more information and sharing ideas? Otherwise... what is the point??

Yeh you should have been here when coffin birth was the topic of the day.

 

[Linda7NJ]

This whole thread off-shoot is getting painful to read. If we cannot take info given to us by a reporter who claims to have spoken to two LE sources and discuss it as reasonable info in the case, what is the point of this entire website?? We can only take info from official documents and court proceedings as "facts" because then we have "proof"? Even then it's not "proof", it's stuff thrown at a wall lawyers hope will stick. Isn't this a forum for discussing information, getting more information and sharing ideas? Otherwise... what is the point??

This^^^^^

Thank you.





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[Linda7NJ]

I would never suggest a dirty diaper can be mistaken for decomp. Plenty of parents can get used to the stinky smell of a diaper. No one gets used to the smell of death.



Can you guys link to info supporting your statements? Because JeannaT linked to actual info. I don;t have reason to accept one position over another as to what actually happens with decomp except via linked articles. Do children decompose faster? Does heat accelerate the process (I think it does) and if so, by how fast?

That second quote isn't mine.




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[Lorne Malvo]

I don't know why this baby smelled so foul so soon.

Because the child was fried in a dry sauna over a seven hour period @ temps between 130-175*. Ever opened a hot trunk with something left inside? :seeya:

MOOYA.

 

[gngr~snap]

Anyone remember if a witness administered CPR before police arrived? Wouldn't they have smelled an odor? So confusing.

Whoever tried to administer CPR to the child, they were not interviewed by a news station.
They were probably being interviewed themselves and advised not to discuss the case. IMO they would be called to testify at a trial.
The people interviewed were onlookers.

I also am thinking about how the father was reportedly acting after finding out his son was dead. Pulling at.the leaves on the trees etc....

If the SUV smelled like his sweet toddler why not return to it and sit down? In most situations regarding vehicles and police don't pro usually remain in their cars while waiting on police?

I guess they could have told him her couldn't get back in it.
moo


IMO he as walking around in circles because of the smell.

 

[LinasK]

This whole thread off-shoot is getting painful to read. If we cannot take info given to us by a reporter who claims to have spoken to two LE sources and discuss it as reasonable info in the case, what is the point of this entire website?? We can only take info from official documents and court proceedings as "facts" because then we have "proof"? Even then it's not "proof", it's stuff thrown at a wall lawyers hope will stick. Isn't this a forum for discussing information, getting more information and sharing ideas? Otherwise... what is the point??

Bingo! Because this is all we know right now, the rest of the case hasn't been made available to us yet, so it's all we have to go on. I see alot of nit-picking over the same points- whether the day care called or not, whether it was their policy to call or not, whether the dad researched dogs dying in hot cars or not, whether the body smelled or not...