George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin General discussion #3

[ScarlettScarpetta]

That is what bothers me.. the state seems to be trying to prove their case with the absence of evidence. Not direct evidence. Not even circumstantial evidence. Basically they are asking the juror to make up their own story about what may have happened.

 

[ncgramma]

Because past behavior is a good predictor of future behavior. The only person with instability or violence and drug use in his past is TM, imo.

IIRC, none of TR's priors are being allowed in. Just GZ's. This trial is ripe for appeal already.

 

[scorekeeper]

here comes Rachel

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Testimony repeats that " it was too dark to see." No one has said he was under total surveillance until the police arrived, to my knowledge. Thanks for your comment, Scarlett.

Yes. They have. The witness said she saw him get up and walk over and sit with the other neighbor waiting for police. Once the shot went off, After someone witnessed TM beating him, He was under watch of at least one neighbor.

 

[Beyond Belief]

Finally the gf

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Is it me or does she look much older???

 

[AngelWings444]

Hold on to your hats...and maybe sit on your hands a little. LOL

 

[gxm]

Grab the popcorn!

 

[cityslick]

Here we go.

 

[Nymeria]

I was really surprised by the extent of the head injuries, the big bumps in particular, from the photos yesterday.

*IMO*
I give the "bumps" no credence.
To me they look like the ridges along his skull.
I will say ONE of the bumps actually looked like a "goose egg", but the rest, I dunno.
Wish he was still bald so we could compare, but I will assume DT did not want him to have that look during trial. He looks much more innocent with hair.

Also, I still want to know why his nose looks huge and red in the police car pic that Defense came out with, but at the police station it is not swollen at all.

 

[m00c0w]

Um I wasn't talking about by him watching TM, and he was also following him. My comment was because GZ said that TM asked if he had a problem, GZ replied he didn't and then reached to get a cell phone and TM hit him.

If I'm TM and I know you were following me, and you didn't attempt to explain yourself, I might think you are reaching for a gun. In that scenario TM is using self defense.

IMO


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If that were the case, I could turn around on any street and ask the person behind me why they're following me. If they stammer and reach into their pocket, I can beat them down.

There has to be an imminent threat of unlawful force. Saying nothing and reaching into your pocket is a complete stretch to that end.

To take your example, and assuming that Martin did assume it was a gun, and proceeded to kill him (since deadly force would surely be lawful since there was suspicion of a gun). But let's imagine no gun was found. What then?

There has to be a credible basis for the self-defense claim to stand on. "He was watching me", and "He reached towards his pocket" don't do it for me.

IMO

 

[raine1212]

Random drop!


Remember everyone has the right to voice their opinion.

Race is a factor in this trial.. please do not make it one here.



NO BASHING OF FELLOW POSTERS

NO NAME CALLING

NO RACIST REMARKS

IF YOU SEE A POST PLEASE ALERT DO NOT RESPOND TO THE POST

PLEASE DISCUSS LIKE ADULTS...WE UNDERSTAND THAT RACIAL ISSUES WILL BE BROUGHT UP DURING THE TRIAL AND CAN BE DISCUSSED HERE WITHOUT MAKING WEBSLEUTHS A RACIAL FORUM!

 

[Hatfield]

I am glad this trial is moving fast and normally. What a contrast to the way the JA trial was run. Those sidebars in the JA trial were inexcusable and judge should not have allowed so many. The defense lawyer used them as a crutch.

 

[Marah]

Is this the girlfriend?

 

[DIBSY]

Yes. They have. The witness said she saw him get up and walk over and sit with the other neighbor waiting for police. Once the shot went off, After someone witnessed TM beating him, He was under watch of at least one neighbor.

I watched the court room testimony and didn't see or hear those exact words. Must agree to disagree. Thank you.

 

[Horace Finklestein]

Didn't GZ have a history of using prescription medications? Didn't he have a prior violent act? I'll say it's JMO until I find link.

Last I checked, smoking a joint doesn't make one violent. Not that Trayvon had been smoking it that night. Little traces found in his system. '

I still believe LE should have done a TOX screen and alcohol test on Zimmerman.

Using prescriptions? Yes, doesn't everyone?

 

[claudicici]

IMO. Just for fun, lets say that 17 year old Trayvon had a police record. Lets even say he was found guilty of possession of pot. * I AM MAKING THIS UP*

What does that have to do with the price of tea in China? He was walking, talking on the phone. Oh, and he "looked suspicious" according to the defendant, "something's wrong with him...yep." So this suspicious looking night walker "looked" at GZ who was staring at and following him.

Why again does it matter whether Trayvon ever did anything questionable before? (Again, not saying for real whether he did or didn't.)

The kid walked through a townhouse complex. GZ over-zealously, while packing a loaded semi-automatic handgun, pursued his view of "justice" because "they always get away."

<modsnip>. Trayvon was not doing anything wrong, unless you concur that his "looking at" the guy who killed him was provocation to be accosted and shot.

If GZ had the wherewithal to pull out the gun, get it between himself and Trayvon, and if he felt threatened, why didn't he hit TM with the gun? Why didn't he say "halt I have a weapon" and display it? Why didn't he shoot him in the arm or shoulder? Why did he shoot him right in the chest?

You can't just go around carrying a concealed weapon and pull it out and kill someone if you provoke a confrontation because you perceive they look suspicious.

<modsnip>. Whether that amounts to 2nd degree murder is something to be determined after all the testimony and jury instructions on the law. But IMO, GZ is criminally responsible for this kid's death, and it's not self-defense.

Thank you very much for that.ITA George definitely had major issues,I know it's not related to the case (just like TM's weed smoking is not) but I'm sure the woman that he molested as a child would attest to his major issues.Just the tone of his voice on the 911 call is so creepy to me."there's something wrong with him" IMO there's something wrong with George."He's on drugs or something" well,it's a fact that George was on drugs,George had a psychologist and went to see him the day after the murder.
So in my mind I speculate who really used the words "You're going to die tonight"?

 

[JudyBolton]

IIRC, none of TR's priors are being allowed in. Just GZ's. This trial is ripe for appeal already.

Yes - if it is relevant to hear GZ calling 911 - to determine his "state of mind"...why is it not relevant for the jury to hear of TM's "issues" which I will not list here for the sake of brevity (imo)

 

[nnglas]

I feel like I am in bizarro world also. Anytime people think that you can gun someone down and there should not be an investigation.

If the jury finds him not guilty, fine. But I think this young mans death deserves a trial.


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[Angelina Frost]

Regardless of the outcome of this case, this judge is GREAT! So refreshing!

I totally agree with you. This case progression is so different than the circus-like atmosphere in Arizona. I'm seeing how the wheels turn when an experienced judge is at the bench. No intentional disrespect to JSS, but she was not equipped to deal with a case of that magnitude.

On time, nonsense free, moving smoothly is really refreshing.

The professionalism of the DT is head and shoulders above the Arizona DT as well (imo).