George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin General discussion #4

[Ray_of_hope]

I don't understand why the phone would "hang up". It sounds like it landed and she could still hear. I dropped my phone multiple times and it stayed on. Has anyone else wondered about this? It's just that critical events happened here. Also, was it on when the police discovered it?

 

[Chester_from_THM]

Great Q, I want to know the answer, too.

I don't know the answer, but perhaps can give some info that could help piece it together.

This aerial photo shows the believed paths of TM and GZ.

http://bcclist.com/2012/03/27/trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman-map/

I seem to recall testimony that said that TM was found dead 70 yards away from his Dad's GF home.

 

[legalmania]

The insurance company paid, not the HOA.

Yes but it's the same as when you put in a claim with your insurance your rates go up. Somebody has to make up that loss and it's not going to be the insurance company.

 

[iluvmua]

because he was a teenager living in 2012, not 1979.

other than that, i do believe i said 'moo.'' if i failed to, my apologies.

So what George is saying Trayvon said to him could not possibly be true?

Is this what you are saying?

George was there, None of us were....... And as of yet, I have no reason to not believe what he says happened.

JMO

 

[PaperDoll]

I am curious as to how she was able to remember her conversation with Trayvon in what appears to be remarkable detail, including wet grass moving, and all the things he was saying. And that after quite some time passed.

The detail isn't that remarkable, IMO. She knows what she heard and she is saying what she heard. Sometimes you just remember things.

 

[kaRN]

Seriously? She's 19. She's legally an adult. The earlier witness who actually was a kid did quite well imo. She lies because she is mad at people asking her questions and has no sense or respect for anything beyond herself imo. I'm not seeing shades of grey being applicable, these are extremely simple and basic questions...I'd respectfully say that if she can't understand or process them, she probably doesn't need to be swaying a murder trial. There's too much at stake.

I don't understand the reasoning here that if lots of teens do something, that means it's ok? I know the trend seems to be to minimize any offensive/racist/untruthful/illegal behavior by Rachel or TM but why? jmo

Here's a shade of gray because most of life and certainly truth in a case like this, lies in the gray areas. Her Mother is Haitian. Quite possibly english is this witnesses second language. Her Mother tongue is so it's a safe assumption. As far as minimizing her offensive comments, you ignore the racist utterings of the defendant with no issue. Why is that? Two wrongs don't make a right.

 

[Lovelymountains]

Oh and " you're gonna die tonight" he claims TM said.

I think it's possible that someone said, "You're gonna die tonight," but it wasn't TM. Also the claim that after being shot in the heart, and with a hole in his lung which would have prevented him having air with which to speak, TM said, "You got me," just isn't physically possible. Sounds like an old Grade B Western movie, to me. A post-mortem reflex movement is possible, but not speaking.

 

[jjenny]

The detail isn't that remarkable, IMO. She knows what she heard and she is saying what she heard. Sometimes you just remember things.

To me it is. I don't think I could remember a conversation I had some time ago in such detail.
Including locations where he was, and hearing grass over the phone?

 

[shragae]

Seriously? She's 19. She's legally an adult. The earlier witness who actually was a kid did quite well imo. She lies because she is mad at people asking her questions and has no sense or respect for anything beyond herself imo.

She was 18 at the time -- and if memory serves she is still in high school and still living at home with her parents. To me this is a "kid."

Some people are mature younger, some are mature older. This is JMHO and my :twocents:

Have you ever heard the story that there is "his story, her story and the truth"? I think GZ's story makes TM to be "all bad" and the girl's testimony makes GZ seem "all bad" (bad *advertiser censored** cracker and all). The truth probably lies somewhere in the middle -- but I think by now both GZ and Dee Dee think they remember it "correctly."

But then perhaps I'm naive! :blushing:

 

[PaperDoll]

So what George is saying Trayvon said to him could not possibly be true?

Is this what you are saying?

George was there, None of us were....... And as of yet, I have no reason to not believe what he says happened.

JMO

It "could" be true but I don't buy it. Doesn't sound like it happened. I don't believe everything GZ said, I just don't. He doesn't want to go to jail so he will be twisting this in his favor. IMO :twocents:

 

[mck16]

She actually didn't say any of that. The defense lawyer said to her, if you didn't want to consent to the interview or do it, why did you, was it because you wanted GZ arrested? and to this she answered YES. This to me is not a shocker, she didn't know her call and the last words she heard were of such value and neither did the TM's parents UNTIL they heard what she had to say. Then they realized their SON was being followed. She decided to help because YES she wanted him arrested, because to them this was now a crime. MO

This girl has a very limited education and although some think it is funny, it is not, her story about the call is simple and her description was simple, someone coached her? no. no way she could keep it all clear. She can't read, is that funny? no. Did she have someone else write her words down, yes. Simple.

MO

I am just wondering which version of the call you believe to be the truth. I think I have heard 3 versions. jmo

 

[jjenny]

Yes, she is an adult at 19, but I get the feeling that education-wise, she is not much more than a 3rd grader.

Didn't she say she was admitted to college?

 

[Karmady]

Yes but it's the same as when you put in a claim with your insurance your rates go up. Somebody has to make up that loss and it's not going to be the insurance company.

Maybe. But there's a big difference between the homeowners being directly responsible for a 7 figure settlement and their insurance premiums going up by a few thousand dollars, imo. I thought you were suggesting the former.

 

[Nymeria]

FYI Croakerqueen has videos of this trial on her youtube account...

http://www.youtube.com/user/croakerqueen123/videos

I was JUST about to ask if Croaker was posting vids.

:tyou: Harmony!

 

[PaintingAnemone]

I am curious as to how she was able to remember her conversation with Trayvon in what appears to be remarkable detail, including wet grass moving, and all the things he was saying. And that after quite some time passed.

For the same reason I can barely remember the names of the Presidents, but I can remember the details of every truly bad argument I've ever had with my boyfriend, down to what we were wearing, who was standing where, and what was playing on the radio in the background while we were arguing. It's why probably everyone in this room can remember what they were doing on 9/11, or (if you're older) what was going on in your life the day Kennedy was shot. The heat of the moment sort of emblazons the details in your mind.

 

[Mendara]

His body was found in the back of the houses, so at least that can be confirmed. You can see with your eyes, the back of the houses. Why was GZ at the back of the houses? TM told her on the phone he was going through the back of the houses.

 

[iluvmua]

Well, he is, so... that's why there is a trial thread. Shall we follow the trial? :seeya:

And it is my opinion that he should not be on trial.

IMO

 

[kaRN]

The detail isn't that remarkable, IMO. She knows what she heard and she is saying what she heard. Sometimes you just remember things.

I also imagine that if she was interviewed 20 years from now, this last conversation with a friend [modsnip], would be seared into her brain. I remember the smell in the air the day I left to go to the hospital 29 years ago to deliver my first son.

 

[Nezumi]

This case has been deeply troubling to me from the beginning for a variety of reasons, beginning with the Martin family's and their attorney's efforts to mislead the public and manipulate public opinion by offering photographs of Trayvon Martin that were at least five years old. The blatant attempt to make TM look more vulnerable to the public than the 6'0 160 17 year old that GZ encountered that night is a shameful misrepresentation on the part of the Martin family that continues to be kicked under the carpet.

To that, I will add that I was deeply disturbed by the tacit support the Martin family lawyer lent to the New Black Panther Party putting a "dead or alive" bounty out on George Zimmerman prior to his arrest. TNBBP is an organization that has been rejected by the original BBP and is characterized by the The Southern Poverty Law Center as "a virulently racist and anti-Semitic organization whose leaders have encouraged violence against whites, Jews and law enforcement officers..."

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way...-party-offers-10k-bounty-for-george-zimmerman

Everyone is entitled to his or her own opinion. This is mine: the Facebook and Twitter content of TM is absolutely relevant to understanding the person that GZ encountered that night. Far from being the sweet faced 12 year old depicted in the photos provided by the family and their lawyer to the media, he was a recreational drug user and underage drinker who, by his own admission, was involved in multiple assaults of others and who was in the process of trying to illegally obtain a weapon. If I'm not mistaken, THC was found in his system at autopsy. He had been expelled from school and kicked out of his mother's home and sent to live with his father when she could no longer control him.

I find it interesting that we have had so many conversations about the value and accuracy of our personal intuition in so many other cases yet no one is prepared to give GZ the benefit of his intuition.

Finally, I'm just confounded by the talking heads (and some members here) who are willing to bend over backward to justify the deplorable courtroom behavior of yesterday's 'star witness' and the justifications offered here for the racial slurs used by TM. I can only speculate as to the reasons for that so I won't go into any detail. Her Twitter account was recently scrubbed of her references to getting drunk, stoned and driving under the influence and I believe that all of that goes to her credibility:

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/crime/zimmerman-witness-gets-twitter-scrub-748092

At this point, I have seen nothing from the Prosecution that would allow me, in good conscience, to convict GZ of anything. Then again, the case hasn't been fully presented or defended yet so I'm reserving judgment until then.

 

[nnglas]

So what George is saying Trayvon said to him could not possibly be true?

Is this what you are saying?

George was there, None of us were....... And as of yet, I have no reason to not believe what he says happened.

JMO

Can you tell me which version of GZ's story you believe?

Was he holding his hands over his mouth and nose?

Repeatedly bashing his head in concrete?

Grabbing for the gun?

I honestly don't know how you can do all of those things at the same time.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk