George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin General discussion #4

[Chester_from_THM]

Thank the lord, finished!

Did the attorney just ask if he could go get an aspirin?

Or maybe just projecting on my part.

 

[Horace Finklestein]

What are some of these tweets that they are talking about, in summary?

They're all over smokinggunn.com don't know if we can link to it or what.

 

[LinasK]

I believe what was said during the testimony- We don't need you to do that.

They really prefer you to watch at a distance. From what I understood this meaning was all to protect the the person doing the watching. Correct me if I'm wrong here.

"Don't need" is NOT a preference, it's a polite way of saying back off. It's irrelevant whether George identified himself as Neighborhood Watch or not because he had no authority to follow or anything else. I am Neighborhood Watch. You are not supposed to follow anyone, only to report suspicious crime to LE.

 

[DIBSY]

So when you said "x-ray happy", you meant the large number of x-rays that are taken automatically during a CT scan... And not x-rays as a typical person would think of them?

From personal experience I mean all sorts of X-Ray happy...All imaging such as general X-Rays, CT Scans and the radio wave imaging of MRI: all viable for determining serious injuries.

As a result of iffy health, I know from experience how often X-rays of all types are pushed upon a person under observation. If there is even a shadow of doubt that serious injury has been done, X-Rays are par for the course.
Therefore, it's obvious to me ( as well as others ) that GZ wasn't considered to be seriously harmed in any fashion.

 

[kaRN]

Regarding the witnesses other name. I know lots of people her age and many have another name they use on FB, twitter........WS even. Her friends even call her Diamond I bet.

 

[Moonie]

Linda, do you know where I can watch this?

http://youtu.be/uHyIpO43NRg

 

[iluvmua]

I'm sure the PA will explain everything when she has to testify.

 

[ncgramma]

In my opinion, she's been blocking the defense from the get go.

It's absolutely unbelievable. How in the world do we insure a defendant gets a fair hearing in our justice system if a judge is allowed to continue this way. I don't care what the verdict is in this case, I only care that the jury gets an accurate depiction of what happened. If a witness is allowed to be continually led and coached, (and in this case even by the judge) the jury is being blocked from hearing testimony. It's as simple as that.

 

[Tenaciousdae]

I'm not sure what you mean by any of that, or how it relates to him defending himself from TM's attack. Should he only have used his gun if a pit bull was threatening his life? GZ used common sense, unfortunately TM did not. It seems TM felt the need to physically confront the cracker/potential rapist. The situation rests solely on the bad actions and decisions of TM imo.

{Mod Snip}

There is no evidence of TM confronting GZ except for GZ's word...

Last time I checked, I've never heard of anyone dying from a broken nose...

but I could imagine a hyper over-reactive person saying "I've broken my nose and I'm fighting for my life!" but that is just rediculous...

:seeya:

 

[corundogs]

I think the problem here is many posters seem to paint with a broad stroke brush.

My brother-in-law pushed me into an ordinary wall and my head hit right above my ear. The skin above my left ear split without a single scratch, abrasion or any other synonym. It required stitches and he only pushed me.

The year before that, he grabbed my sister by the face and repeatedly bashed her head into a concrete wall she was standing next to. Not a single scratch...she had a skull fracture and it never bled a single drop.

I think the human body is a magical thing and an injury may happen to one person and present itself as one thing and happen to another and look different.

I am still on the fence as to who/what I believe happened, but I think too many are stuck with their beliefs and assume a lot about who/what/where/when. I personally need more facts before I can judge the validity of either side.

I just hope we all make it through this with our sanity and wits about us. Happy posting all!

I absolutely agree with you.

However, GZ at the time was basically bald. So we are talking about bare skin on concrete. Repeatedly according to him.

That just doesn't sit right in my head, even knowing we all experience things differently.

And of course, in your example, someone with their head repeatedly banged against a concrete wall had a skull fracture.

Yet GZ didn't even get medical assistance or any further examination at a hospital.

Knowing what we know about head injuries now, I do find it hard to believe that the EMT wouldn't demand some sort of follow up (ride in the ambulance) to make sure they weren't held liable.

I mean, if an EMT sees someone that complained of what GZ did, and let's them walk away (with the police or not) and that person has a skull fracture or like Natasha Richardson who died hours later...is that EMT responsible? Did he sign a waiver?

I mean, these types of things are so litigious these days, it would just surprise me.

 

[Horace Finklestein]

Regarding the witnesses other name. I know lots of people her age and many have another name they use on FB, twitter........WS even. Her friends even call her Diamond I bet.

Everyone seems to know teens who do all kinds of stuff that is somehow supposed to minimize/normalize things in this case. Teens who walk slow, teens who use racial slurs, {Mod Snip} teens who don't care about court/authority, teens who fight regularly, etc., teens failed by the education system. None of it excuses the disgraceful displays we've seen here imho, jmo.

 

[katydid23]

Zero evidence of a broken nose.

View attachment 35219View attachment 35220
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No x-ray.

My DS had a broken nose twice, from playing hockey. The doctor never took an x-ray. He said it was obvious from being crooked and swollen, so it was not necessary to x-ray it. GZ'z nose looked a bit swollen and crooked at first to me. But who knows.

 

[Horace Finklestein]

Concerned about getting her phone...

 

[legalmania]

Maybe he didn't think TM would respond with "Hello good sir, thank you, but your concerns are not well met, for I am simply returning home."? He rightfully thought TM was suspicious and he called 9-11 for a reason. imo

Suspicious of what? Going to the store getting skittles and a drink? When you call 911 don't you usually wait for them to arrive so you can talk to them and tell them where you saw the perpetrator? When he called 911 he already had it in his mind this kid was up to no good. Not rightfully so.

 

[iluvmua]

Stiil no evidence that George wanted to shoot Trayvon.

every witness the defense has either torn their testimony to shreds or turned a state's witness into a defense witness.

JMO

 

[katiewonders]

What are some of these tweets that they are talking about, in summary?

Just google it, CitySlick, there are so many and I wouldn't want to try to summarize her words.

 

[Lovelymountains]

Where Trayvon actually died? No where near the truck...

And not on the sidewalk, either, IMO; Some distance from the sidewalk where he was claimed to be bashing GZ's head--the sidewalk with no blood, even though GZ's head was bleeding and certainly one would expect that there would be blood from TM being shot in the heart. Also, the autopsy lists no injuries other than a gunshot to the heart. There are no injuries on his knuckles, there is a small scar and a very small cut on the side of his left ring finger. How could it be that if he were hitting GZ in the face 20-30 times he has no evidence of it on his hands? (How could he be bashing GZ's head against a cement walkway and at the same time be hitting him in the face, reaching for his gun and holding his hand over GZ's nose and mouth?) And according to the State, none of GZ's DNA on his hands or elsewhere on his person? IMO

 

[ktgirl]

My first thought yesterday when I heard Rachel's last name and found out she was of Haitian descent was that English wasn't her first language.

Rachel reminds me a lot of a colleague I have who grew up in NYC. Her parents were Garifuna Hondurans. Her first language and language she mostly grew up using aside from at school was the Garifuna language (an Arawakan & Carib language with elements of French, Spanish & English). Her second language was Spanish, as she grew up in a Garifuna enclave within a Hisapnic community. Her third language, learned at school & from friends, was English. The friends generally spoke a type of English that was non-standard English.

This woman has a MA from a US university and is pursuing her PhD in a social science field. Her spoken English is still off, particularly subject-verb agreement. Her written English is still off if she writes quickly or on the spot; she has others who speak English as their first language re-read her written work. Her grammar reminds me a lot of Rachel's. (Although she does not use derogratory terms; I'm speaking soley about her grammatical English.)

This colleague can come off somewhat off-putting and like she has an attitude (although nothing like Rachel's) often when pressed to answer questions/speak English off the cuff. She also did not make friends with the class cohort right off of the bat. She didn't engage in conversation with us and many of us thought she thought she was better than us or had an attitude. In reality, I think it's because she 1) is unsure/not confident of her standard, academic, professional English and 2) she was often translating what was being said in her head from standard English to either the colloquial English she learned growing up from friends or Garifuna or Spanish and then translating her replies back in her head before saying them. If pressed for time or put on the spot, she resorted to her non-standard English full of subject-verb agreement issues and expressed a slight attitude.

I am glad someone else pointed out that Rachel probably doesn't speak English as the primary language at home and it wasn't her first language.

Thank god someone told her to answer with "yes ma'am" and "yes sir" today. That goes a long way and I wish the proescution would have worked with her on that or prepared her to do that before she testified yesterday. I'm really at a loss as to why this wasn't done before yesterday. Why didn't the prosecution work with her to prepare her better (as far as using "yes ma'am," "yes sir," toning down the attitude, etc.)?

 

[m00c0w]

{Mod Snip}

There is no evidence of TM confronting GZ except for GZ's word...

Last time I checked, I've never heard of anyone dying from a broken nose...

but I could imagine a hyper over-reactive person saying "I've broken my nose and I'm fighting for my life!" but that is just rediculous...

:seeya:

Yet, some here have claimed that the non-violent action of merely following Martin would be cause enough to shoot Zimmerman.

 

[cityslick]

I absolutely agree with you.

However, GZ at the time was basically bald. So we are talking about bare skin on concrete. Repeatedly according to him.

That just doesn't sit right in my head, even knowing we all experience things differently.

And of course, in your example, someone with their head repeatedly banged against a concrete wall had a skull fracture.

Yet GZ didn't even get medical assistance or any further examination at a hospital.

Knowing what we know about head injuries now, I do find it hard to believe that the EMT wouldn't demand some sort of follow up (ride in the ambulance) to make sure they weren't held liable.

I mean, if an EMT sees someone that complained of what GZ did, and let's them walk away (with the police or not) and that person has a skull fracture or like Natasha Richardson who died hours later...is that EMT responsible? Did he sign a waiver?

I mean, these types of things are so litigious these days, it would just surprise me.

A person has the right to refuse medical care, the EMT cannot order them to the hospital if they are self aware.