GUILTY - Tammy Moorer trial for Kidnapping Heather Elvis, 8 Oct 2018 #8

[Legally Bland]

So true and by saying Nancy TM's trying to elevate herself to same level as the state attorney. She thinks she's clever but it really just shows how manipulative she is, imo.

BBM. Exactly this. Thank you for posting this. I caught up with the cross-ex over the weekend and I think I was laughing too much at NL's reply to think about this.

You've just reminded me I saw this in a trial earlier this year, I even commented on it:

Wait, he's addressing the prosecutor as 'Jakob'?

He is - what a tool!

I wondered if the use of the prosecutor's first name was just Danish egalitarianism, even in these circumstances, like the way pupils call their teachers by their first names. But SATA has just disabused me of that idea. His tone is sneering anyway.

In that case there's a psychological report on the guilty party:

The psychiatrists have recommended that Madsen be held in “safe
custody”, as his “narcissistic and psychopathic traits” make him a
continuing danger to others. Their report adds that Madsen showed “a severe lack of empathy and remorse”, and was “extremely untrustworthy” and a “pathological” liar.

[...]

“He breaks out in tears which stop as suddenly as they have arisen.”

Danish inventor accused of Kim Wall murder 'psychopathic', court hears

This guy definitely thought he was at least equal to the prosecutor (and the defence too).

I'm not saying that just by using the prosecutor's first name they share the same psychology (it wouldn't surprise me), but I found it interesting.

 

[Surfside]

Did anyone catch when TM told Nancy that the kids had met Sidney's "first (pause) person as well". This was said while being questioned about the "meet the MRS" and the "kids want to meet you" messages sent to Heather.

I wonder who this earlier affair was with and if the "person"(man, woman or monkey *rolleyes*) is still alive and well. Bet they have a story to tell.

Yes! I've been thinking about this a lot. It seems to me if SM's "first [pause] person" truly exists, wouldn't the Defense (and especially TM) want to call that person to the stand to show they're still alive and well and weren't threatened? JMO

 

[Surfside]

The psychiatrists have recommended that Madsen be held in “safe
custody”, as his “narcissistic and psychopathic traits” make him a
continuing danger to others. Their report adds that Madsen showed “a severe lack of empathy and remorse”, and was “extremely untrustworthy” and a “pathological” liar.

“He breaks out in tears which stop as suddenly as they have arisen.”

Danish inventor accused of Kim Wall murder 'psychopathic', court hears

RSBM & BBM: WOW! Chilling similarities. Thanks for sharing this LB.

 

[yupikgirl]

Too late to edit my last post. I will be going back and reading so as to not miss any good points. But please message me anything you think of- or message Nancy directly if you want. I just don’t want to put everything out in the open anymore or what’s going on behind the scenes. Sometimes I forget who is reading here.

 

[hbone]

Personally don’t think Heather was her first victim & I don’t think Heather will be her last victim. The woman got a thrill out of this whole thing & maybe he did as well. That’s one scary couple.

 

[TTF14]

What about TM smiling at the jury very spooky

And the constant furrowed brow. Quinton Tellis had that exact furrowed brow during his entire trial and he burned a woman alive.

 

[Surfside]

Too late to edit my last post. I will be going back and reading so as to not miss any good points. But please message me anything you think of- or message Nancy directly if you want. I just don’t want to put everything out in the open anymore or what’s going on behind the scenes. Sometimes I forget who is reading here.

BBM: I'm glad to read this. I've been growing more and more concerned about you. Please be safe, yupikgirl. While everyone here appreciates what you're doing, it's not worth risking your safety.

 

[yupikgirl]

BBM: I'm glad to read this. I've been growing more and more concerned about you. Please be safe, yupikgirl. While everyone here appreciates what you're doing, it's not worth risking your safety.

I just reported some of my own posts because I can’t edit them. Sometimes I don’t think. I think my impressions are fine- but who is doing what and how should be kept private. Hopefully they can be edited or snipped or something.

Also, I think I was writing some of the stuff because as well all known when the defense starts their case we sometimes get worried watching and I just wanted to reassure some of those posts that people are on it- hopefully my posts will get edited since I reported some of them. Feel free to report some as well LOL.

 

[hbone]

Too late to edit my last post. I will be going back and reading so as to not miss any good points. But please message me anything you think of- or message Nancy directly if you want. I just don’t want to put everything out in the open anymore or what’s going on behind the scenes. Sometimes I forget who is reading here.

Yes & let’s don’t forget the big picture here. Remember she’s lying about the big things and they are obvious lies. The defense has just tried to confuse us about all the little things and yes there are lots of little inconsistencies & untruths but let’s not confuse the jury with all of the little details unless they’re going to go over every piece of evidence one by one for the next month or two. Also her lack of empathy, her gleefulness after she was arrested and gloating, her demeanor on the witness stand like she finds some of this funny, the disrespect she shows for the prosecutors and the court. Tammy’s absolute attempt to manipulate the evidence & mislead the jury. Her apparent lack of morals & decency.
If they cut to the chase and keep it brief like usual – they need to point out the big lies. Heather needs to be humanized more – we need to know more about her.
Nancy did a good job with her timeline. It’s pretty convincing. Tammy was the scorned woman & the boss & Sydney was the last person Heather communicates with. They stalked her at work and at home in the weeks before. Tammy’s love to plan things. Everything else lines up.
Heartbreakingly, we learned in this trial that Heather was killed. We didn’t know that before.
The bad all those gleeful posed photographs of them with their guns won’t be shown to the jury. They were both quite proud of what they had done & it was like they rubbed it in the face of the Elvis family and the State on social media. Those photos are no longer on their Facebook pages but they do exist.

 

[bestill]

Does anyone remember when LE announced they thought Heather was dead and do we know what lead them there other than she's not been heard from or seen since?

 

[Justice-seeker]

Holy posts since I was on! Someone asked how Tammy could possibly make Heather pee for that pregnancy test. Pull a gun out and see how fast. Tammy's truck was seen on video. Yes that is their truck. It was about 3 minutes in between. Heather, my assumption, got out of her vehicle to talk to "Sidney". Hence no prints. Either Sidney or Tammy picked her up, very quickly, I assume by threatening behavior. Tammy is nuts. She snapped. And to take the stand so smug, please. Talking about Jesus, scholarships, blah blah. Smiling, saying Heather was sweet. The most assinine thing is for a defendant, especially a guilty <modsnipped>, is to take the stand. <modsnipped>.

Didn’t TM say that SM was outside after they got home at 3:10. Something about feeding the dogs. That SM scared her father who was outside. So her father who has unfortunately passed is now his alibi??
I don’t recall AC seeing SM. Does she mention dad being up?
She said the kids were on the porch waiting for the door to be unlocked and that the kids were awake and walked over. TM said SM carried one of them. No one mentions seeing TM...
I really feel like the time between 3am-3:16am is crucial. Something changed to suddenly start calling SM’s phone rather than the payphone. One of them was not “HOME” as TM’s text implies. JMO

 

[?mysterian?]

I hope the prosecution asks for more detail about TM saying Heather was killed.

ETA: They also need to remind the jury about the disturbing photo of Heather that TM's cousin testified about, the photo SM showed him at the family cookout.

 

[Justice-seeker]

Does anyone remember when LE announced they thought Heather was dead and do we know what lead them there other than she's not been heard from or seen since?

I remember it being a couple of days after they were arrested. When they announced the murder charges.

 

[Justice-seeker]

And the constant furrowed brow. Quinton Tellis had that exact furrowed brow during his entire trial and he burned a woman alive.

Right as she took the stand she smiled and said “hi” or “hello”. Will have to watch again. Ugh

 

[panacea]

Just thinking about this... can I ask why they are unable to use SM's statement where he stated that TM handcuffed him to the bed for punishment/so that he couldn't leave?

 

[bestill]

BBM. Exactly this. Thank you for posting this. I caught up with the cross-ex over the weekend and I think I was laughing too much at NL's reply to think about this.

You've just reminded me I saw this in a trial earlier this year, I even commented on it:



In that case there's a psychological report on the guilty party:



This guy definitely thought he was at least equal to the prosecutor (and the defence too).

I'm not saying that just by using the prosecutor's first name they share the same psychology (it wouldn't surprise me), but I found it interesting.

A male version of TM!

Yes! I've been thinking about this a lot. It seems to me if SM's "first [pause] person" truly exists, wouldn't the Defense (and especially TM) want to call that person to the stand to show they're still alive and well and weren't threatened? JMO

I've wondered about this myself, TM knows the name and if he/she would help her in the case we would know it too. I don't think she got over that one just like I don't think she's over Heather either - in fact I think she transfers her rage and right now it's directed towards NL.

 

[Justice-seeker]

Right as she took the stand she smiled and said “hi” or “hello”. Will have to watch again. Ugh

Sorry didn’t know a better way to screen grab.

Please advise if this is against posting rules!!

 

[hbone]

I hope the prosecution asks for more detail about TM saying Heather was killed.

Tammy will probably plead the fifth on that one. She told us she was kidnapped & killed but she’s just not going to tell us by whom & how.
The State’s evidence proves she was kidnapped. We had experts who came here from all over the country to explain the tracking, the timeline & the truck.

 

[TTF14]

Just thinking about this... can I ask why they are unable to use SM's statement where he stated that TM handcuffed him to the bed for punishment/so that he couldn't leave?

I'm not a legal expert, but here's what I think and why.

Last week the defense tried to get put into evidence witness testimony from SM's trial that refutes Mr. Frederick's (headlight pattern guy) testimony. Basically, they said, "we ran out of money to call him ourselves, so can we use the testimony from SM's trial based on law XYZ that states that blah, blah, blah, we can use it."

Ms. Livesay objected to that saying that law only applies if that witness is UNABLE to come to the trial based on X,Y,Z. None of those applied to this case. "The defense ran out of money" isn't one of those reasons. The guy WOULD have been able to attend/testify if he'd been asked.

So the judge said no.

I'm assuming the judge would say no to using SM's testimony, then, too since SM was there for over a week and technically would be able to testify, therefore he previous testimony could not be used. Now, of course, he may not, and probably would not have said the same thing (probably would have pleaded the 5th), but it seems to me the same rule would apply.

Just my opinion. I'm not a legal professional.

 

[?mysterian?]

Tammy will probably plead the fifth on that one. She told us she was kidnapped & killed but she’s just not going to tell as how.
The State’s evidence proves she was kidnapped. We had experts who came here from all over the country to explain the tracking, the timeline & the truck.

She probably will, but I'm hoping she won't.