Hannah Graham: Remains Identified

[ILOKAL]

This is one of the links you posted, ILOKAL, as being one of the stories about Mr. Pugh. It is my opinion that this story is NOT about Mr. Pugh, but is about the second person who called in the tip about buzzards on the property on Oct 6. Wolf Blitzer and Coy Barefoot tried to clear this up on the Situation Room last night. Wolf specifically stated that there are two men who made reports about the buzzards.

Mr. Pugh is named in all the other articles about his statements. Nowhere in this article does it say that this pertains to Mr. Pugh, and the specifics of this man's experience differ from Mr. Pugh's.

http://insidecville.com/blog/exclusive-where-hannah-was-found/

This is a different person who saw buzzards on a different day, got out of his vehicle and walked the property, even walked into the edge of the woods near where Hannah was.

This was covered once again on the Situation Room yesterday afternoon.

Please note the date of this article was October 19th (which is when I first read it) and the info was given to Coy Barefoot by an individual who knows the person who saw the black vultures on October 5th. Not the person himself. Mr. Pugh's very first accounting was THIS one, when he finally decided to give his "only" interview. He drove by, saw many black vultures on and behind the main house. He went on to his work. He returned on October 6th, saw NO vultures, got out and walked a bit of the property doing a cursory search but began to feel awkward since there was no longer a For Sale sign and he felt he might be trespassing. He left the property and at 9:45 AM October 6th, he called in the tip.

Surely you're not trying to say that two different men saw the same thing on the same exact days and DID the same things on those same exact days, now are you?

 

[ILOKAL]

BLITZER: Coy, you spoke with the second tipster who reported the property to police where they found Hannah Graham's remains, her body. He actually walked around the property. What did he have to say to you about that? BAREFOOT: I was with him this morning. And just to review here,

there were two gentlemen who called in on the tip line to report the property where Hannah Graham was eventually found, and both men were motivated to call in because of an unusual collection of very large buzzards that were all over the property. The gentleman that I was with this morning was a Navy SEAL. He'd served two tours in Vietnam.

And he said to me, he said, Coy, I've seen it all. And I can tell you, I got out of my car that morning, I walked behind that house, I walked into the woods, I stood there under all those buzzards, and I was so freaked out and nervous that I had to leave. And I would think that it takes quite a lot to creep out a Navy SEAL. He walked into the woods and as we know now he was only feet from the body of Hannah Graham, but he just did not see her.

That was the morning of October 6th. And he said the woods were so thick, and such a thicketed woods leading down to the creek that he couldn't see her. But he did walk the property and look as best as he could, Wolf.

BLITZER: So you hear about that.

Tom, we're told there's no more active digging going on, on that property, no more searching. So it would appear police believe they've collected enough evidence, there's nothing left there to go through. Is that your assessment?

Yes, there were two tips about vultures. One from the neighbor just two days before Hannah was found and one from Mr. Pugh. I don't know if Mr. Pugh is an ex Navy Seal but he certainly isn't old enough to have served two tours in Vietnam. Mr. Pugh who is quite knowledgeable about "black" vultures saw them on Oct 5th but not the 6th (in his first accounting). Other accounts he saw them on the 5th and called in the tip on the 5th. Another account was the end of Sep or beginning of Oct, and last there's his sighting and tip on September 30th.

There seems to be some confusion, perhaps on Coy Barefoot's part, but I think it's WAY too coincidental for, "both" alleged tipsters to have the same accounting. Also, don't we have some LE in that very same segment saying the information that the remains were found in a dry creek bed is incorrect and that the remains were basically just on the ground?

 

[Meemaw12]

Yes, there were two tips about vultures. One from the neighbor just two days before Hannah was found and one from Mr. Pugh. I don't know if Mr. Pugh is an ex Navy Seal but he certainly isn't old enough to have served two tours in Vietnam. Mr. Pugh who is quite knowledgeable about "black" vultures saw them on Oct 5th but not the 6th (in his first accounting). Other accounts he saw them on the 5th and called in the tip on the 5th. Another account was the end of Sep or beginning of Oct, and last there's the sighting and tip on September 30th.

There seems to be some confusion, perhaps on Coy Barefoot's part, but I think it's WAY too coincidental for, "both" alleged tipsters to have the same accounting. Also, don't we have some LE in that very same segment saying the information that the remains were found in a dry creek bed is incorrect and that the remains were basically just on the ground?

The LE on the show is former FBI, are you talking about The On the record show on fox that aired last evening, former LE and producer walking the crime scene? If so 2 different shows, Coy on Cnn

 

[ILOKAL]

The LE on the show is former FBI, are you talking about The On the record show on fox that aired last evening, former LE and producer walking the crime scene? If so 2 different shows, Coy on Cnn

I don't know WHAT show it was on, quite frankly! I read it on this thread this morning. Actually I think it might have been Ted Williams saying he had been corrected as to where the remains were really found. If that's correct, then Coy's recollection of his conversation with the Navy Seal would have had him probably walking ON the remains.

 

[Meemaw12]

I don't know WHAT show it was on, quite frankly! I read it on this thread this morning. Actually I think it might have been Ted Williams saying he had been corrected as to where the remains were really found. If that's correct, then Coy's recollection of his conversation with the Navy Seal would have had him probably walking ON the remains.

Ted Williams is on Fox, he was walking down behind the smaller house, the cabin I believe it had been referred to.
I believe the person Coy talked to walked behind the larger ranch type house.

Hell at this point I will wait for a report that is coming out later today,I've been told.

Fact is No tips were investigated when they were called in regarding this location or HG would have been found. Doesn't matter to me how many or by whom. LE missed it, sad.

They were getting so many tips, mistakes happen. BUT they found her within 35 days in a needle in a hay stack situation. God bless them for that.

I honestly didn't think they would.

All JMO

 

[jbowman55]

Yes, there were two tips about vultures. One from the neighbor just two days before Hannah was found and one from Mr. Pugh. I don't know if Mr. Pugh is an ex Navy Seal but he certainly isn't old enough to have served two tours in Vietnam. Mr. Pugh who is quite knowledgeable about "black" vultures saw them on Oct 5th but not the 6th (in his first accounting). Other accounts he saw them on the 5th and called in the tip on the 5th. Another account was the end of Sep or beginning of Oct, and last there's his sighting and tip on September 30th.

There seems to be some confusion, perhaps on Coy Barefoot's part, but I think it's WAY too coincidental for, "both" alleged tipsters to have the same accounting. Also, don't we have some LE in that very same segment saying the information that the remains were found in a dry creek bed is incorrect and that the remains were basically just on the ground?

This is the last post I'll make about this, and then I'll just agree to disagree.

There were two tips. Mr. Pugh saw buzzards on Sept 30. He went to his job, came back and saw them again.

The Navy Seal saw buzzards on Oct 5 and called his report in at 9:45 am on Oct 6.

Mr. Pugh's report was all over the news reports and such.

The Navy Seal's report was in Inside Charlottesville, and then Coy Barefoot has discussed it with Wolf Blitzer twice on the Situation Room show.

That's my understanding. I have not ever mentioned the report of the neighbors who smelled something and closed their windows until this very minute. As far as I know, they did NOT phone in a tip about buzzards.

 

[Elley Mae]

BLITZER: Coy, you spoke with the second tipster who reported the property to police where they found Hannah Graham's remains, her body. He actually walked around the property. What did he have to say to you about that? BAREFOOT: I was with him this morning. And just to review here,

there were two gentlemen who called in on the tip line to report the property where Hannah Graham was eventually found, and both men were motivated to call in because of an unusual collection of very large buzzards that were all over the property. The gentleman that I was with this morning was a Navy SEAL. He'd served two tours in Vietnam.

And he said to me, he said, Coy, I've seen it all. And I can tell you, I got out of my car that morning, I walked behind that house, I walked into the woods, I stood there under all those buzzards, and I was so freaked out and nervous that I had to leave. And I would think that it takes quite a lot to creep out a Navy SEAL. He walked into the woods and as we know now he was only feet from the body of Hannah Graham, but he just did not see her.

That was the morning of October 6th. And he said the woods were so thick, and such a thicketed woods leading down to the creek that he couldn't see her. But he did walk the property and look as best as he could, Wolf.

BLITZER: So you hear about that.

Tom, we're told there's no more active digging going on, on that property, no more searching. So it would appear police believe they've collected enough evidence, there's nothing left there to go through. Is that your assessment?

bbm I got to tell you, I don't believe that for (1) one minute. No way, no how that buzzards, and by the way, they where most likely Vultures. Turkey vultures and black vultures and they do NOT sit if you are anywhere near closr to them. jmo idk So much for mister vietnam. After saying that I found this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_buzzard
The common buzzard (Buteo buteo) is a medium-to-large bird of prey, whose range covers most of Europe and extends into Asia.

Looking at the picture you will see that a buzzard looks nothing like a vulture. jmo idk

 

[Mountaingazer]

He clearly lied about giving only one interview which he said he only did because his mother asked him to!? And, in defense of even the worst journalist, how do you misinform the date(s) of September 30th and October 5th/6th? Several of them would have had to do this, as a matter of fact? I'm not saying Mr. Pugh's story is hinky, but there's SOMETHING wrong with it!

He didn't lie. He only gave the one interview. You are witnessing the reporter telephone game. The first station got the scoop, the next ones used the info from that first station's interview, but they can't print the exact same thing because that would be plagiarism. So they rewrite the article in their own words they even use (and credit) the first news station's pictures. The problem is when journalists rewrite things in their own words October 6th becomes early October... Etc.

Also the first station wasn't very clear in their article. He first saw the vultures the 30th or so he states in that interview. They do not give the date he reported the tip only that 13 days later her body was found. Thirteen days later would mean that he did report the 6th.

 

[jamicat]

If this picture was taken after the search then the driver side would likely be forward as well...they would check both sides.

Not necessarily. There may have been 2 searchers, on for each side, and one just left the seat back and the other forward. I don't always think about how I leave the seats after I have to search under them for things. With the 2 door car, it would have been far easier to get a tall person, or anyone, for that matter, right into the front seat. Also, knowing how slobs tend to keep their cars, that back seat would likely be full of junk, IMO. Of course we don't know for sure Hannah could have been in the back seat, but getting her out of the back seat as well as in it would have been more difficult than the front, and JM tends to go for the easy, IMO.

 

[newshound6]

All of this micro dissection of the tipster's actions(about the vultures) makes me think this is the kind of scrutiny that make people just not want to "get involved"

On another topic, days ago we all talked ALOT about "how could the body be a set of bones" etc...I don't know the answer exactly, but this morn. I was watching some forensic show on ID they were talking about finding a murder victim one month later and there were only " skeletonized remains" this was outside of Denver in the 1990's. FWIW

 

[jamicat]

All of this micro dissection of the tipster's actions makes me think this is the kind of scrutiny that make people just not want to "get involved"

On another topic, days ago we all talked ALOT about "how could the body be a set of bones" etc...I don't know the answer exactly, but this morn. I was watching some forensic show on ID they were talking about finding a murder victim one month later and there were only " skeletonized remains" this was outside of Denver in the 1990's. FWIW

That's a reason why LE likes to keep it quiet. Also a reason why talking to the press can be an issue. You don't think quickly or clearly enough, misspeak, make a mistake get misquoted and there can be a storm of opinions right down to being involved with the crime. That was sort of the case with WG who gave a bad scrip of JM.

 

[ILOKAL]

He didn't lie. He only gave the one interview. You are witnessing the reporter telephone game. The first station got the scoop, the next ones used the info from that first station's interview, but they can't print the exact same thing because that would be plagiarism. So they rewrite the article in their own words they even use (and credit) the first news station's pictures. The problem is when journalists rewrite things in their own words October 6th becomes early October... Etc.

Also the first station wasn't very clear in their article. He first saw the vultures the 30th or so he states in that interview. They do not give the date he reported the tip only that 13 days later her body was found. Thirteen days later would mean that he did report the 6th.

Yep, 13 days would make it the 6th. However, in his most recent televised interview, the date he said he saw the vultures AND reported the tip was . . . . September 30th! So there you have it!

 

[Meemaw12]

All of this micro dissection of the tipster's actions(about the vultures) makes me think this is the kind of scrutiny that make people just not want to "get involved"

On another topic, days ago we all talked ALOT about "how could the body be a set of bones" etc...I don't know the answer exactly, but this morn. I was watching some forensic show on ID they were talking about finding a murder victim one month later and there were only " skeletonized remains" this was outside of Denver in the 1990's. FWIW

1st part- Boy isn't that the truth!!!

 

[ILOKAL]

This is the last post I'll make about this, and then I'll just agree to disagree.

There were two tips. Mr. Pugh saw buzzards on Sept 30. He went to his job, came back and saw them again.

The Navy Seal saw buzzards on Oct 5 and called his report in at 9:45 am on Oct 6.

Mr. Pugh's report was all over the news reports and such.

The Navy Seal's report was in Inside Charlottesville, and then Coy Barefoot has discussed it with Wolf Blitzer twice on the Situation Room show.

That's my understanding. I have not ever mentioned the report of the neighbors who smelled something and closed their windows until this very minute. As far as I know, they did NOT phone in a tip about buzzards.

Yes, we will have to agree to disagree because if you read the various accounts given by Mr. Pugh (not merely "a" tipster) you will see that the synopsis in your post is not correct. Btw, who did Mr. Pugh give his first interview to, if you know?

 

[Sachi]

a few questions
And Listened to the Greta Show
http://www.foxnews.com/on-air/on-the-record/index.html#/v/3862753283001

They talked about where Hannah's remains were found and the evidence they were looking for ie.. dragging marks in the soil, soil type perhaps on perps shoes as evidence ( if found or even, I guess, in his car -on his gas petal and break if he hadn't completely changed, I assume).
Also, during the interview they mentioned the body being dragged from the cottage. Is that just a point of reference as he is looking toward it?- for instance- "from the area of" or is there any evidence and released info that the crime may have been committed in that cottage?

 

[Meemaw12]

Yes, we will have to agree to disagree because if you read the various accounts given by Mr. Pugh (not merely "a" tipster) you will see that the synopsis in your post is not correct. Btw, who did Mr. Pugh give his first interview to, if you know?

It was on Twitter at the time, when I have time I will get it for you, iirc it was someone named Hawes or Noel, can't remember rt now.

 

[Ollie]

Many tips were sent to the tip line. I was following this case on Psychic crime fighters also;on Oct 5th a gentleman felt strongly Hannah would be found near the intersection of Red hill Rd and Old Lynchfield Rd;on Oct 10th he felt sure ,I emailed that tip on the 10th;so lots of people sent tips for various reasons. Guess what? they were right (I even encouraged them to check Walnut Creek Park close by) . I felt he had to brought her into his comfort zone, it's isolated at night;and he grew up there.

 

[Sachi]

How about the comment made here.. not psychic , made a month ago.. but like many others..
http://www.c-ville.com/hannah-graham-case-poi-worked-cab-driver/#.VE_mBjgtDcs
this guy had right.. a month ago...

Hannah Graham case POI worked as cab driver

[modsnip]

 

[CvilleMother]

The bird issue was further complicated by the fact that this occurred during the height of the migration period for birds of prey:

http://www.dailyprogress.com/news/l...cle_ead31556-50db-11e4-b2ec-001a4bcf6878.html

According to the article at the link, the watchers on Afton Mountain spotted 900 migratory birds in one day, likely during the time Hannah was missing.

 

[Meemaw12]

Yes, we will have to agree to disagree because if you read the various accounts given by Mr. Pugh (not merely "a" tipster) you will see that the synopsis in your post is not correct. Btw, who did Mr. Pugh give his first interview to, if you know?

@HawesSpencer: #BREAKING @AugensteinWTOP and I interviewed the man who called in tip that may have led #HannahGraham searchers to vacant house.

This was posted oct 20th