Hannah Graham: The Search - #4

[SteveP]

I say this as nicely as I know how, and it is aimed at no one in particular, but do the folks that repeatedly post that another post belongs in another thread, because in their mind anyway, the post doesn't pertain to the search.....do they not realize that their particular post doesn't pertain to the search either? Just saying.... (and yes, I know, this one doesn't either, so it doesn't need to be pointed out to me). Really don't mean to sound snarky. I appreciate everyone's input, but a lot of these topics can and do overlap at times and I do think most people try to stay on topic. JMO

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Good evening, jamicat

Legal ponderings, remember, would be a kindness on your part to keep here, so this thread may stay open for us all. thank you, again.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?257735-The-Charges-Against-Jesse-Leroy-Matthew

She's commenting on the amount of money and resources being spent in the search. Which is relevant to the search.

 

[SteveP]

JMO, but if JM learned anything along the way, the clothes he was wearing that night will never be found. My guess is they were burned, because that is the one sure way they will not be found.

 

[jamicat]

Everyone seems to only be thinking about places that JLM is familiar with. Maybe he took Hannah someplace SHE was familiar with. In a scenario where JLM would fear being stopped by LE for ANY of the many possible reasons previously discussed throughout the thread, he may not attack his victim(s) until arriving at a "safe" place. This way if he is stopped while he has his soon to be victim in his car, the victim, in this case Hannah, would be none yet the wiser and JLM can ditch his plan. If Hannah was wanting to "party" with JLM, he might have asked her about places SHE is familiar with that would provide a safe haven for such activities. There are many who think it appears as though Hannah was looking for someone in particular; others think she and JLM might have been previously acquainted. Some think Hannah joined JLM willingly and left with him willingly as well. Maybe LE needs to start searching areas that were familiar to HANNAH! If LE hasn't already asked these questions of her friends, it might be time to do so. JMO

Interesting idea. Perhaps JM did take her on campus or where she wanted to go, and found a spot that suited his plans when doing so. That his face is not scratched up is some evidence that she did not go right at him that way. She's a smart girl and would have likely bolted from the car or done something if and when she realized he was taking her somewhere she did not NOT want to go.

The thing that concerns me about that theory, is the report of how incapacitated Hannah appeared to one of the last persons seeing her as she left with JM, and how JM took the time to get 2 drinks before leaving the mall with her. Why would he buy two drinks, when he "caught his fish", as impatient as he is? I think he wanted her knocked out for the ride.

I think the UVA campus and the areas nearby have been thoroughly searched, and dogs brought around there from the very beginning. Now LE is radiating outwards. She's not native to this area, and UVA undergrads tend to stay close to the campus--even the mall area was not all that familar to her, and as UVA posters have outright said, is not a usual venue for the undergrads. JM, on the other hand, grew up there and drove a cab even, so he'd know the intricacies of the area, and being a fisherman, a former member of the Outdoors club and noted for knowing the outlying areas, would likely know all the places less likely to be found.

I hope Hannah was not consicous if she were harmed. That little bit could be comforting to her parents, her loved ones. Bad enough to have to endure her being missing, think of what could have happened, and be waiting, waiting through this search. I keep checking whether anything has been found to help find Hannah.

 

[ksj3]

I say this as nicely as I know how, and it is aimed at no one in particular, but do the folks that repeatedly post that another post belongs in another thread, because in their mind anyway, the post doesn't pertain to the search.....do they not realize that their particular post doesn't pertain to the search either? Just saying.... (and yes, I know, this one doesn't either, so it doesn't need to be pointed out to me). Really don't mean to sound snarky. I appreciate everyone's input, but a lot of these topics can and do overlap at times and I do think most people try to stay on topic. JMO

OT: (Yep. Which is why I like the reminders before Bessie comes in and closes it down, because I'm guilty! Particularly in responding to something someone else posts... But I understand if others don't. And threads do overlap, no doubt. Some posts clearly are OT, though, even though the train of thought might start on topic, mine included.)

 

[MzOpinion8d]

Could everyone please start adding info to the bottom of their posts so people can connect the dots as to how the info is relevant to the search so people will stop living in fear of the thread being shut down? I don't think I can handle one more "please don't get the thread shut down" post. (I'm kidding about adding info to the bottom of posts...but not the rest.)

 

[MzOpinion8d]

I realize this is 100% me most likely, but I am not following. Will you please explain it to me like I am 5?

She's saying that the clothes being missing may indicate they had blood or other DNA on them. And if so, the clothes would have been likely to leave evidence in his car which is maybe what they found and were able to use to obtain the search warrant.

 

[Perplexed 123]

Jim Krasula ‏@jimkrasulacbs · 2m2 minutes ago


#HannahGraham search shifts to area near a school suspect #JesseMatthew
worked as asst. football coach.

cbs news

 

[Foxfire]

From one of the prior msm articles, it was shared that the initial search radius of 8 miles was recommended by experts at The National Center for Missing & Exploited Children (NCMEC) & The Federal Emergency Management Administration.
I realize that the primary initial search area works out from the abduction site in most cases, unless there is cell phone pings, citizen tips, or other info that indicates specific areas to be searched.. The experts are relying on national averages of disposal sites in prior abductions in the US. Imo, this recommendation is faulty due to the inclusion of urban areas and domestic related abductions....

Since JM is forensically linked to MH's abduction and her remains were located 10 miles from the abduction site. Depending on his window of opportunity in HG's abduction, and up until her body disposal. It would be logical to conclude that HG's remains will likely be located much farther than 10 miles, and possibly in an opposite direction, and or different geographical area... jmo

http://www.wset.com/story/26797046/update-search-for-hannah-graham-put-on-hold-by-weather

<Sniped from article>
Longo says once that 8 mile radius is covered, they will move the search two miles out.

He says the basis for this logic comes from professionals from the Center for Missing and Exploited Children and the Virginia Department of Emergency Management who say most missing people are discovered within a five to eight mile radius of where they were last seen, but after they've finished searching that radius thoroughly, they will follow investigative leads and tips to just search specific areas.

 

[LG3]

Resources = Charlottesville's budget for 2014-15?

I took his use of the word "resources" to mean tips about possible locations. Especially since they stated earlier this week that they are now focusing their search areas based on tips and information.

 

[Perplexed 123]

http://www.nbc29.com/story/26806877...nah-graham-with-charlottesvilles-police-chief

Inside the Search for Hannah Graham with Charlottesville's Police Chief

Posted: Oct 16, 2014 9:22 PM GDT


Updated: Oct 16, 2014 10:34 PM GDT


Jesse Matthew ~ he's not telling anything

 

[FindHG]

Some information available in the FBI report bessie posted:

http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/201...ses/serial-murder-pathways-for-investigations

There are also myths based upon the earlier serial murder research:
&#8226; All serial killers were raised in dysfunctional or abusive families.
&#8226; They are loners who are incapable of maintaining long term relationships.
&#8226; They increase in the violence they inflict on the victims as the series progresses.
&#8226; They attempt to engage the police in dialogue and learn about the progress of the investigation by
frequenting police &#8220;hangouts.&#8221;
&#8226; Once a killer starts murdering, he can never stop.
&#8226; If there is a time break in a series, the offender was either in prison, joined the military, went away to
college, or was admitted to a mental health facility.
All of these myths greatly contribute to the inaccurate base of information concerning serial murder to the
public in general and law enforcement specifically (Morton & Hilts, 2008).

In over half of the cases (54.0%), offenders removed multiple items from the crime scene. Of those cases
(n=259), the majority of items taken were:
&#8226; Clothing or shoes (48.5%)
&#8226; Jewelry (31.7%)
&#8226; Wallet or purse (23.6%)
&#8226; Money (20.5%)
There have been many references throughout the literature published on serial murder identifying items
that serial murderers take from crime scenes as trophies or souvenirs. There were multiple explanations
as to the meaning of this behavior. In this study; however, we only identified the items taken and did not
interpret any intrinsic meaning.

The movement of the victims&#8217; bodies by offenders
increases the chances that an offender may be seen or identified in the vicinity of the murder site and/or
disposal site. This movement is extremely risky for an offender, yet these offenders are compelled to move
the victims. There are two main reasons offenders concealed victims&#8217; bodies:
&#8226; To delay or prevent discovery
&#8226; In order to place time and distance between themselves and the victims

 

[human]

I realize this is 100% me most likely, but I am not following. Will you please explain it to me like I am 5?

Ha ha. What I mean is that the clothes and those lovely crocs must have been covered with blood or other markers of Hannah. I don't like to say certain other things out of crying for Hannah.Even if he tried to clean up in a pond or river, it probably was not a good job.

Comsequently, I think he left traces of Hannah in his car and I don't mean hair from her head that he could have gotten just from walking with her.

 

[teeandcee]

Some information available in the FBI report bessie posted:

http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/201...ses/serial-murder-pathways-for-investigations

Regarding items taken, I'm surprised clothing topped the list. I would have thought jewelry simply because it's easier to conceal. However, when I think about it clothing makes sense as it probably smells like the victim. Yuck.

 

[cluciano63]

Jmo in no way is JM talking or wanting to talk, about the search or anything else. Generally lawyers are quick to say their client is cooperating as best as he is able, blah, blah, blah and it seems pretty certain JM has not had one word to say to LE since being returned to Virginia. LE is just trying anyplace where he was known to ever be, Imo, hence the school.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Many of the searchers, even professional law enforcement, are volunteers - giving their time for FREE. That is touching and admirable - as hard as they work at their regular jobs - to give their time because they care and have compassion.

So they are only searching on weekends or when they get off from work? They are not getting any overtime? None of them are being directed by their bosses to help in the search?

If that is true, I feel bad. I doubt it is completely their choice to have to continue working for zero pay in very hard conditions on their days/time off. And it not like saying no to their boss is easy.

 

[cluciano63]

Regarding items taken, I'm surprised clothing topped the list. I would have thought jewelry simply because it's easier to conceal. However, when I think about it clothing makes sense as it probably smells like the victim. Yuck.

Pawn shops have probably been checked if jewelry is missing, Imo.

 

[Daae]

The Covenant School, upper campus:175 Hickory Street Charlottesville, Virginia 22902. There are many areas around this campus that are similar to where MH was left.

 

[jamicat]

From one of the prior msm articles, it was shared that the initial search radius of 8 miles was recommended by experts at The National Center for Missing & Exploited Children (NCMEC) & The Federal Emergency Management Administration.
I realize that the primary initial search area works out from the abduction site in most cases, unless there is cell phone pings or other info that indicates specific areas to be searched.. Since JM is forensically linked to MH's abduction and her remains were located 10 miles from the abduction site. Depending on his window of opportunity in HG's abduction, up until her body disposal. It would be logical to conclude that HG's remains will likely be located much farther than 10 miles, and likely in an opposite direction and in a different geographical area... jmo

http://www.wset.com/story/26797046/update-search-for-hannah-graham-put-on-hold-by-weather

<Sniped from article>
Longo says once that 8 mile radius is covered, they will move the search two miles out.

He says the basis for this logic comes from professionals from the Center for Missing and Exploited Children and the Virginia Department of Emergency Management who say most missing people are discovered within a five to eight mile radius of where they were last seen, but after they've finished searching that radius thoroughly, they will follow investigative leads and tips to just search specific areas.

I got the definite feeling that LE had gotten some new info this week to focus on some areas. From comments and posts here, I thought maybe JM's cell phone info was finally allowed to be accessed and pings during the morning and day of Hannah disappearance were available. Though the poster who mentioned this about his farm being approached by LE in responce to "ping" info has yet to be verified, the timing of the info, that the search team is getting larger, Mark Eggleton making his appearance all seemed to point to some new info coming into the picture.

I am so hoping something comes up. It was a downer for me to read that LE did NOT have JM's clothes he was wearing that day. I'd thought those were part of the evidence LE got from the car and/or apartment.

 

[teeandcee]

Pawn shops have probably been checked if jewelry is missing, Imo.

I was referring to the article excerpts FindHG posted about serial killers in general. Apparently clothing tops the list of things kept from victims. Just a general comment rather than something HG specific.