HCPD contacts Florida LE about skeletal remains that were found

[stmarysmead]

The Duke Lacrosse case is fortunately an anomaly that is extremely rare. The arrests were based on evidence and the person providing the evidence lied about what happened to her. She was found out. False witness testimony, false witness assertions, and a corrupt DA that was not only not lazy, but was determined to take that case to trial. The truth has a way of coming out in the end. Look where Crystal Magnum is today: in prison for stabbing her boyfriend to death.

There is no eye witness claiming to be the injured party in this case. There is no false physical evidence as far as we know. There is video evidence. There is phone call evidence.

Not at all the same.

I was responding to this assertion:

"It is also false that anyone could be accused of a crime--not by the state without some evidence; though perhaps by misinformed citizens. It is not up to the media to do anything; cases are proved in court using evidence. Juries decide the strength of the evidence and whether the state met their burden."

An allegation ALONE without evidence should not be enough for an indictment. If it were, no man should get into an elevator alone with a woman. Not only were these kids accused...they were indicted...though the DNA results had come back prior to indictments and other exculpatory evidence was available. Nifong refused to view any exculpatory evidence. So it is sadly ..NOT "false."

This type of thing did happen and has happened and can happen again. That was my point. Nifong was losing his election. These indictments provided a "million dollars worth of free publicity." He was running against Freda Black...( the Petersen case) and saw what a national case did for her. He had fired her, by the way, after he was appointed DA.

I wish I could believe such a thing could never happen again. But I no longer have such faith.

I pray all DAs and LE put JUSTICE first. I think they do....in the majority...but not in the totality of "never."

 

[Miss Priss]

What makes you think the prosecutor is being lazy?? He knows more than we do, perhaps its the best interest. That prosecutor wants to win this case and see justice he took an oath .... beyond what we know, they are trying to preserve the solidity of the case.... considering I know where I stand on this case, I'm willing to sacrifice all the drama for real just justice... maybe its because I come from a family of attorneys.... or maybe I just believe that decisions made are based on what's best..... finding justice for HE.

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

Read "The Innocent Man", by John Grishom. His only book based on a true story.

In my post above, I wasn't specifying the prosecutor in this particular case. I'm only saying that lack of media coverage in an investigation and murder trial isn't a good thing.

It enables our government to operate in secret. I'm a firm believer that if allowed to operate in secret, it's only a matter of time before someone takes advantage of it.

There is an incredible amount of pressure on LE and the DA's office to solve crimes. Especially cases involving the murder of children. Even the most honest DA doesn't want an unsolved case on his record close to a re-election campaign.

 

[Salem]

Stay on TOPIC here, please.

Salem

 

[Miss Priss]

Stay on TOPIC here, please.

Salem

I am on the topic of the gag order. The discussion came about when it was speculated that the remains in Florida weren't being identified in the media due to the gag order.

 

[cluciano63]

For me, it depends who said "young girl" re:the skeleton. An expert, would, Imo, be able to recognize a small-boned adult vs. a child.

 

[Missing Link]

Stay on TOPIC here, please.

Salem

Yes ma'am! I respect everyone's opinion... definitely want to respect the rules.. ... my emotions have got the best of me

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

 

[carbuff]

I'm really not sure! Has this little info ever happened in remains being found? I understand some can take a long time to identify, but does it usually take so long just to even know gender?
There are many people wondering if this could be there loved one and even just stating if it male of female could relieve at least half of those people's emotions right now.
I guess my opinion is more emotional than logical


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yes. There was a case in Idaho a couple of years ago where we didn't get the results for six to nine months, and another one -- I'm blanking on which one -- where the results were quite ambiguous. It's unusual, but it does happen.

 

[poppygirl]

Yes. There was a case in Idaho a couple of years ago where we didn't get the results for six to nine months, and another one -- I'm blanking on which one -- where the results were quite ambiguous. It's unusual, but it does happen.

We're still waiting for an ID on the remains found thought to be the Jamison family...has to be 5 months now.

 

[NewYork625]

I saw this today, and thought of the picture TM posted of the ruins in the Arizona desert:

http://www.azfamily.com/news/Human-remains-found-in-container-near-Apache-Lake-254280751.html

"When the men opened the container, they were shocked to discover the skeletal remains and clothing of what Contreras said appeared to be a young small female.

"Her sandals were maybe like this big so I'm guessing maybe anywhere from like 9 to 13," explained Contreras. "She might have been pretty small.""

 

[U2forever]

The Duke Lacrosse player Reade Seligmann was arrested and charged on only an ever changing allegation from Crystal Mangum...and no additional evidence. He left the party with a friend BEFORE the time she originally stated the rape took place? He had a time stamp from a restaurant, a photo from a bank ATM, and the cab driver submitted his time sheet to support his alibi.

The cab driver was then arrested on a bogus "assistant to shoplifting charge" but acquitted at his outrageous trial.

DNA from other men were present in Mangum's three orifices yet none from the men she accused.

THree innocent kids were not only accused, but indicted. At his Bar trial where he was disbarred...a Nifong admitted refusing to see any alibi evidence from the defense attorneys, never interviewing the accuser, not reading his own reports that he submitted, and was found guilty of hiding the DNA evidence.

So it happens. Being accused and indicted for a crime with only an allegation and no evidence. All it takes is a rogue DA. Mangum has since stood trial for setting an arson fire with her kids in the apartment and some time later, killing a man who took her and her kids into his home. She was convicted of the murder charge.

BBM

What is the third orifice?

 

[ShaShaGa]

BBM

What is the third orifice?

I believe it is referring to the "mouth" .....

 

[U2forever]

I believe it is referring to the "mouth" .....

Thanks.
Well now.....I know better and this is off topic. lol

 

[abashfulben]

I'm not sure if there is already a thread about this but.... is anyone else bothered by the media trying to appeal and argue with the gag order? As much as I want all information to be available but I feel the media lacks respect in this matter.... I am ok with the decision of the court because they are trying to protect the case and justly so.... There are cases that our media has barely covered such as AB who was found murdered under the bridge and if the local media reported on it 5 times that may be a stretch. It seems that they are not only being selfish and disrespectful but appear to want what they have been denied all to stay in the spot light.... JMO, but the vicious news reports from disrespectful journalists and reporters is really getting to me! Sorry just had to vent!

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The local media definitely reported on AB more than 5 times. I was recently out and about in North Myrtle Beach and specifically heard someone talking about how there was plenty of DNA at the scene of the AB murder but it doesn't match up to anyone and so it has become a waiting game.

I still think if AB's friends and family pushed a bit harder, there'd be more to follow. I'm not blaming anyone, because I think the 50k + HE followers are certainly phenomenal. HE's family and friends were relentless and as an NMB native, I just don't feel/see that from AB's f/f.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

The local media definitely reported on AB more than 5 times. I was recently out and about in North Myrtle Beach and specifically heard someone talking about how there was plenty of DNA at the scene of the AB murder but it doesn't match up to anyone and so it has become a waiting game.

I still think if AB's friends and family pushed a bit harder, there'd be more to follow. I'm not blaming anyone, because I think the 50k + HE followers are certainly phenomenal. HE's family and friends were relentless and as an NMB native, I just don't feel/see that from AB's f/f.

A few things that probably also made a difference:

1. Heather has been missing for almost 4 months, while Amber was never missing. Due to this, there can be searches, fundraiser, prayer vigils, hope that she is still alive (before the murder charges) for Heather, but not for Amber. Same reason why Teghan Skiba, Alanna Gallagher, and Grace Ford barely got national coverage, while Jessica Ridgeway, Kyron Horman, and Lisa Irwin were all over the news. For whatever reason, someone being missing, gets a much bigger response than someone being killed (at least from what I have seen).

2. Heather's likely killer was very active on SM. She gave people a lot to talk about. With Amber, the killer is a complete blank. With Heather, we have someone to discuss, someone to hate, etc. Pretty much all high-profile cases have a villain. A part of me wonders if the case would be even bigger if Tammy was more attractive.

3. There is a lot of drama in this case, especially on SM. The drama keeps people hanging around. Look at all the crazy stuff on FB, even after they were arrested. Or all the tension regarding them not being arrested.

 

[PPKik]

This is false and is opposite from everything the law states and jurisdictional procedures. A lazy DA? Hmroo?

It is also false that anyone could be accused of a crime--not by the state without some evidence; though perhaps by misinformed citizens. It is not up to the media to do anything; cases are proved in court using evidence. Juries decide the strength of the evidence and whether the state met their burden.

The above assertions, besides being factually incorrect, have a strong ring of paranoia.

I'm quite surprised that you would say it is " 'false' that 'anyone' could be accused of a crime--not by the state without some evidence..."

The other poster is not factually incorrect. Far from it.

It happens, and when it happens it is always a conscious and deliberate act on the part of the police and/or prosecutor. It has to be when there is no evidence.

The case of Randall Dale Adams is a shining example of the most heinous police, prosecutorial, in fact, total judicial malfeasance and corruption.

What about Tim Masters life being ruined? There was no evidence in his case and the police hounded him for years until they got an "expert," J. Reid Meloy, to make it up by "interpreting" his drawings, thus, "murder."

Nor, whatever your views, was there any evidence whatsoever in the WM3 case. None, except for dishonesty and prejudice among the police and prosecutors.

I don't think it is right or fair to say someone is "paranoid," because they are aware of the terror of an out-of-control judicial system that is becoming more and more a police state.

I think the poster's point, and mine is too, that it could happen to anybody and it does.

People feel secure until the police break down your door and arrest you on false charges.

Imagine spending years in prison, on death row, or in solitary when you are completely innocent. There are many DNA cases, involving freed innocent people. These case are of huge magnitude and consequence and are too numerous to mention.

None of these people was put in prison because of evidence because there was none.

ETA: It is astounding how many cops get convicted of serious felony and even murder charges. Scary to think of the ones who never get caught and are wearing badges.

 

[CHERIE.T]

PPKik,
Good post.
( I don't agree with a couple of your thoughts but you made valid points.)
I'm another person who often says, " Cops wouldn't arrest someone and charge them with murder without evidence." You mentioning WM3 brought my senses back. Yes indeed, people can be arrested and charged for a murder they didn't comment.
However I believe there is a lot of evidence against the M's.
Back on thread topic......
I also don't understand why the skeletal remains haven't been id'd yet.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

I'm quite surprised that you would say it is " 'false' that 'anyone' could be accused of a crime--not by the state without some evidence..."

The other poster is not factually incorrect. Far from it.

It happens, and when it happens it is always a conscious and deliberate act on the part of the police and/or prosecutor. It has to be when there is no evidence.

The case of Randall Dale Adams is a shining example of the most heinous police, prosecutorial, in fact, total judicial malfeasance and corruption.

What about Tim Masters life being ruined? There was no evidence in his case and the police hounded him for years until they got an "expert," J. Reid Meloy, to make it up by "interpreting" his drawings, thus, "murder."

Nor, whatever your views, was there any evidence whatsoever in the WM3 case. None, except for dishonesty and prejudice among the police and prosecutors.

I don't think it is right or fair to say someone is "paranoid," because they are aware of the terror of an out-of-control judicial system that is becoming more and more a police state.

I think the poster's point, and mine is too, that it could happen to anybody and it does.

People feel secure until the police break down your door and arrest you on false charges.

Imagine spending years in prison, on death row, or in solitary when you are completely innocent. There are many DNA cases, involving freed innocent people. These case are of huge magnitude and consequence and are too numerous to mention.

None of these people was put in prison because of evidence because there was none.

ETA: It is astounding how many cops get convicted of serious felony and even murder charges. Scary to think of the ones who never get caught and are wearing badges.

This case has the perfect climate for what you are describing. There was enormous public pressure, it happened in a town that relies on tourism, and there was a possibility someone (especially a child) could end up dead. I can see some LE officer now--talking about the case on some CNN special after the Moorers are acquitted or exonerated---saying, "We had to do something. The whole town was about to erupt."

 

[Aynia]

I saw this today, and thought of the picture TM posted of the ruins in the Arizona desert:

http://www.azfamily.com/news/Human-remains-found-in-container-near-Apache-Lake-254280751.html

"When the men opened the container, they were shocked to discover the skeletal remains and clothing of what Contreras said appeared to be a young small female.

"Her sandals were maybe like this big so I'm guessing maybe anywhere from like 9 to 13," explained Contreras. "She might have been pretty small.""

My heart just dropped... I'm thinking it may be Isabel Celis: ( I hope they identify the remains quickly.

 

[Missing Link]

I'm quite surprised that you would say it is " 'false' that 'anyone' could be accused of a crime--not by the state without some evidence..."

The other poster is not factually incorrect. Far from it.

It happens, and when it happens it is always a conscious and deliberate act on the part of the police and/or prosecutor. It has to be when there is no evidence.

The case of Randall Dale Adams is a shining example of the most heinous police, prosecutorial, in fact, total judicial malfeasance and corruption.

What about Tim Masters life being ruined? There was no evidence in his case and the police hounded him for years until they got an "expert," J. Reid Meloy, to make it up by "interpreting" his drawings, thus, "murder."

Nor, whatever your views, was there any evidence whatsoever in the WM3 case. None, except for dishonesty and prejudice among the police and prosecutors.

I don't think it is right or fair to say someone is "paranoid," because they are aware of the terror of an out-of-control judicial system that is becoming more and more a police state.

I think the poster's point, and mine is too, that it could happen to anybody and it does.

People feel secure until the police break down your door and arrest you on false charges.

Imagine spending years in prison, on death row, or in solitary when you are completely innocent. There are many DNA cases, involving freed innocent people. These case are of huge magnitude and consequence and are too numerous to mention.

None of these people was put in prison because of evidence because there was none.

ETA: It is astounding how many cops get convicted of serious felony and even murder charges. Scary to think of the ones who never get caught and are wearing badges.

Specifically, in this case, there is good reason to believe M 's were involved. While there maybe cases where innocent people were convicted on false pretenses...there are equally a significant # of guilty people who were not convicted and found guilty and live amongst us.

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

 

[PPKik]

Specifically, in this case, there is good reason to believe M 's were involved. While there maybe cases where innocent people were convicted on false pretenses...there are equally a significant # of guilty people who were not convicted and found guilty and live amongst us.

Sent from my VS980 4G using Tapatalk

While I don't disagree with you at all about guilty people not being convicted and they live amongst us, I don't have enough information in the Moorer case to have an opinion one way or another of their "guilt."

I don't presume them guilty, just because they have been arrested.

My reason for responding to the other poster was based on a statement made that police and prosecutors don't charge people without evidence. They can and most certainly do. This has been documented in many cases.

My concern was with the blanket statement that innocent people don't get charged.