HOW does the State Prove it was not George?

[Kentjbkent]

HOW does the State Prove it was not George?

By simply sitting quietly and patiently as Baez' makes a fool of himself.

 

[katherine5]

HOW does the State Prove it was not George?

By simply sitting quietly and patiently as Baez' makes a fool of himself.

The State can prove that it wasn't George by having their closing remarks include Caylee Singing "You are my sunshine". This is the song that George (aka JOJO) taught her. She sang this song to her Great Grandpa on Father's Day.....the last time she was videotaped. Any jury member that hears that precious child sing that song and sees the video, and knows that Grandpa JOJO taught her that would have no option than to find Casey guilty of what she has done.

I was molested by a family member....for real (not like Casey)......I have two kids, and I do everything I can to make a great life for them......retaliation is the last thing that would EVER enter my mind as a parent !!!!!

Baez has already made a fool of himself....otherwise, why would he keep asking for a mistrial, based on his own reputation being ruined...not his client's. He knows that Casey is an AWFUL person and a complete waste of skin and taxpayer money. :maddening:

 

[cecybeans]

They are going to say that Casey said those things about the smell in the car truthfully. Remember she said at one point, MY DAD HIT A DEAD ANIMAL I THINK WHEN HE HAD MY CAR. And she told Tony that she had called and asked her dad to pick up the car at Amscott. So that looks bad fpr George right there. And all he had to do was leave decomp fluids in the trunk, not the whole body all that time.

And Casey was coming and going from that house all of the time. So that gives him means and opportunity to move the body in and out.

Obviously I do not believe it, but they might easily create reasonable doubt with it. imoo

You could be right if she claims GA was ever home at the same time she was, but she was generally over there after he went to work, IIRC. Not much time to do the swap.

I'm starting to think that with the jury knowing without a shadow of a doubt what a nonchalant or even angry liar ICA is (three separate stories so far to explain Caylee's "disappearance" and plenty of jailhouse footage) and also being witness to the bumbling and aimless job JB did on cross examinations, the uncalled for amount of sidebars and attempts to suppress evidence as prejudicial the DT caused, not to mention the morass of overruled objections on testimony, the chance of any "reasonable" type of doubt has pretty much flown out the window. It already sounds like some idiotic conspiracy theory by a girl eager to blame everyone in the entire world but herself. I'd think a jury needs both a sympathetic defendant and a competent defense and they have neither.

 

[SindyBill]

There is an episode of a British Sit com called Absolutely Fabulous that fits this nicely.

Edwina to her mother: "I'm starting suppressed false memory therapy; I'll get something on YOU yet!" "You in a wood in a hood...it's all coming back to me."

Exactly!

Kinda like Casey sitting in jail and penning [paraphrased], "I'm having dreams that Dad may have done something to me too."

Please let these letters come into evidence. Thank you.

 

[RSDhoping for a cure]

I think if GA had ever molested ICA then she would have told CA - from then on GA would have been singing in the girls choir....and would have been permanently out of their lives.
IMO

Snipped

I agree and may I add, if GA had been molesting ICA (or if ICA had even thought about it before she was at the end of the hallway) she would have told CA just to get him out of the house She wouldn't have waited.

 

[Robinez]

The prosecution doesn't have to prove that George didn't do it. They focus completely on linking Casey, step-by-step, to the murder.

The defense, of course, does not have to prove George did it, either--they just have to show that it COULD have been him instead of Casey.

If George didn't do it, it would be damn hard to prove he did. And that means there will be points where only Casey could have done this or that. Putting that together, with the points the defense tries to connect to George, is how they decide if there's a reasonable doubt that George did, instead of Casey.

I don't think they're going to get to the point where they think it might be George, given the preponderance of evidence against Casey, point by point.

I personally don't see any one thing that convinces me that Casey did it, beyond a reasonable doubt. But the preponderance of evidence tells me she did. I do not feel there's a reasonable doubt when you look at it that way. Hope the jury feels the same.

Wasn't there a FBpost or Myspace from Amy saying "you took my duct tape?" If so, why in the world didn't the SA admit that into evidence?

Take care, Robin

 

[mimmy03]

main thing imo is why would GA cover up an accident drowning for ICA? what does he have to gain by that? and in the process cover it up but make it look like ICA did it? makes no sense to me. even *if* he really did sexually abuse her it makes no sense that he would do this. not to mention the amount of time and money he put into looking for caylee.

 

[crimejunkie]

It appears that the main defense strategy will be GEORGE DID IT. And Kronk helped at the end. And Cindy left the ladder up...

They are even going to imply that George is framing Casey because he was abusing Caylee and did not want to be exposed, imo.

So does the state have any solid evidence that can prove his innocence and her guilt?

Their 'evidence' :

George had control of the duct tape. *ICA had access to the duct tape*

He had keys to the Pontiac. *ICA had keys to the Pontiac and was in possession of the car*

He had access to all of the burial items.*ICA had access to all of the burial items*

He knew about the burial site.*ICA knew about the burial site and used it as a child for a pet burial and/or hang out*

He attempted suicide.*ICA was never broken up about the death of Caylee. George clearly was. He loves his granddaughter and the stress of all of this was overwhelming. ICA was out partying and me, me, me-ing her way through the jail convos*

He did not call LE when he left the tow yard. *ICA NEVER called LE. George did not want to believe that either Caylee or ICA was deceased. No body in the car at the tow yard brought relief and hope that the smell was something else. If he admitted the smell was decomp at that time, he had to admit that something serious was wrong and that thought scared him.*

He had no response when he first 'learned' about Caylee being missing.*ICA showed a very flat affect when talking to to the 911 operator and LE during interviews. George was heard to at least say "what" in the background and CA said he was outside and was out of earshot for the phone*

He went secretly to LE and gave incriminating evidence about Casey.*George provided information that could be verified by LE. ICA provided LIE, after LIE, after LIE.*

Casey has all the symptoms of abuse survivor.*ICA also has all of the symptoms as a sociopath and/or a narcissist. George doesn't.*

Red font by me!

The jury has seen most of both sides above. If you evaluated these statements side by side....then you just have to ask yourself who is more believable.....George or Casey? One is a documented liar, proven and admitted in a court of law, the other is accused of things by said documented/admitted liar. George is a victim (imo) of Casey. A victim of her lies and narcissism. Casey is looking for a way out of this and is willing to take George, or anyone for that manner, down with her. I hope the jury can see that!

jmo

 

[leophoenix]

I am not believing what I am reading her :doh: the concept of GA did it, is insane, because if KC can blame him for being
inappropriate with her sexually, she sure would not hold back if he killed her child. This direction is nuts.

GEORGE IMHO definitely cleaned up for her, definitely made sure it would be impossible to convict her.
He tempered with all the evidence and frankly, I think he felt he lost one kid and was not going to lose the other.
I do think he put himself on the line, but as an ex LE, he knew exactly what to do, and how to play the game.
MO

That is what I think too (that he helped clean up) and why he pauses and such when questioned as he tells what he know but, not all he knows. Also my parents and I have discussed this. As GA is a former LE I would assume he would have done a better job of hiding the body if he were the one that disposed of her.

 

[luvmy2grands]

I am sorry to jump in here, but I have a question and don't know anywhere else to ask. I'm new here and can't make new threads yet, so hope someone else can help.
In the 31 day timeline, acandyrose, neighbor said Casey borrowed his shovel at 1:30 and brought it back at 2:30. This was on the 18th. Well George would have been home at that time. He worked that day, but didn't start until 3:00.
Can anyone tell me where this may have been discussed before.
Thanks and I love being here, hope I can add insight and learn also !

 

[Robinez]

It is classic he said/she said- who is the bigger liar???
For the entire list posted for access to items- ICA also had unsupervised access to all of those things as well- duct tape, car, evidence found with the remains...
It will come down to who the jury believes more and there has been a lot of evidence of what a liar ICA is.
Top that all off with each of their behaviors (BOTH very well documented) through the jail house videos, witness testimony of what type of grandfather he is, his searching for Caylee, his contacting John Walsh, his trying to get interviews with ICA and the FBI- not to mention his saying he would do anything for his daughter..
it comes down to this: if the original reason he covered up the crime was to protect ICA from getting arrested for child neglect, would he really sit by and not do anything when she was charged with murder, told the SA would seek the DP AND sat in jail for 3 years? It just defies common sense.
And I haven't even gotten into his knowing of CPR, his knowledge of evidence from being a cop (a cop would not let a dead body sit in a trunk for that long OR use materials from their house OR dump their precious grandchild's body a block and a half from their home. He would have put her body where it would have been never found- including RK.
as far as the duct tape goes, would a cop really use the SAMe duct tape that he used to stage his granddaughter's body ON NATIONAL TELEVISION and in front of a whole bunch of people searching for her?
It think there is PLENTY of evidence that it is not GA. JMOO

My Great-Niece passed away, she drowned in the family pool. It was an underground pool and my Niece was home at the time. We live in Fla. It was an accident and while no decision from the State of Fla eased her pain and the guilt she still feels to this day, the state concurred that it was indeed an accident. Yeah, TY Fla. we already knew.

The reason that I am sharing this is because many folks have commented on his former profession as a cop and how he was trained in cpr, would have immediately called 911 etc...

On the other hand some folks say he was protecting ICA so she wouldn't be jailed for child neglect. < That part is what bother's me. Over and above the CPR training, the instinct to call 911, If anybody know's, a cop would know that accident's happen and not all drownings are cause for jail time.

TC, Robin

 

[katydid23]

I am sorry to jump in here, but I have a question and don't know anywhere else to ask. I'm new here and can't make new threads yet, so hope someone else can help.
In the 31 day timeline, acandyrose, neighbor said Casey borrowed his shovel at 1:30 and brought it back at 2:30. This was on the 18th. Well George would have been home at that time. He worked that day, but didn't start until 3:00.
Can anyone tell me where this may have been discussed before.
Thanks and I love being here, hope I can add insight and learn also !

Very good question. I will go scope around and see what else I can find about that. Off the top of my head I seem to remember that the neighbor was never very precise about the timing. I remember him saying ' sometime in the afternoon.' And also I though the said 'AFTER George left." But I will go see if I can find those interviews.

Oh, and WELCOME :fireworks: to the Forum.

 

[Never4GetCaylee]

No child *advertiser censored*, as far as I know. Just lots of time accessing Escort Services. But being ex-LE they may say he knew better than have anything like that on the computer.

Also being ex-LE he would know not to use items from the home to wrap and dump the body. Or to not dump the body around the corner from his own home. He probably would know too that the police would very quickly figure out there is no nanny and that if he is really trying to hide sexual abuse that there would be MUCH less scrutiny if he calls 911 and reports an accidental drowning rather than Caylee just vanishing and his daughter eventually, when she gets around to it, reporting her kidnapped.

 

[Robinez]

They didn't prove it was a CAPITAL crime, though. This is a capital murder case and the state could not and did not prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Caylee was murdered...meaning that someone intentionally, knowingly and purposely killed her. On top of that...the animated skull with Caylee's face and duct tape superimposed had KC's smiling face in it. That is, without any doubt at all, prejudicial and unnecessary. The state should have cropped KC out of that photo. That single thing warrants a reversal and almost guarantees it. Even if they do find her guilty it is going to be overturned because of that animation.

I don't see any difference in that then using a prop in the courtroom. For example using a replica of a skull and long pieces of wood to show trajectory <sp> . Or in the case where an entire bedroom was rebuilt and brought into the courtroom. Some might say that it is courtroom theatrics ( glove ) but there is certainly a precident for it and for that reason I understood why His Honor ruled that it should be admitted.

Take care, Robin

 

[luvmy2grands]

Thanks katydid23 for your response and for the welcome !
I promise i'm not trying to hijack this thread (lol) I just don't know anywhere else to post this.
I went back to the timeline and noted this also:
17th-GA worked-car backed in garage unknown time.
18th-GA worked-car backed in and ICA borrowed shovels from 1:30/2:30
(GA would be home at that time)
19th-GA not scheduled to work
20th-GA did not work-car backed in garage(per neighbor)around 12-2pm or 3pm (GA would be at home at this time too)

3 times car noted to back in garage and only saw casey one of those times.
Scratching my head on this !!

 

[Robinez]

Hi,

Concerning cropping ICA's image from the pic. They cannot in any way alter evidence. No way, shape or form. If they used that picture to create the animation then they had to keep the picture just as they used it to create it.

I am well aware that they used a picture of ICA and precious Caylee together for a reason when there were many photo's of Caylee alone. And all I can say is, Brilliant!

TC, Robin

 

[BuzzieCat]

Let's say what JB alleged was true. Caylee died accidentally and George demanded it be covered up. What is the motive for that? How does one get from the leap that he abused KC to he hid the body? Why would it be assumed that KC would tell on George even if he did molest her? She would call 911 and say her child drowned, oh and by the way, my father molested me when I was a child. If she didn't tell anyone all those years why was George supposed to think that this would cause her to spill the beans now? One doesn't have anything to do with the other, does it?

ITA. If GA had molested her and/or Caylee, why would she wait to report it until Caylee accidentally drowned in the pool? Also, why would GA fear molestation being discovered during an accidental death investigation?

If the defense is suggesting that it was an accident, it would be insanity to cover it up and hope that the NANNY story and kidnapping would be LESS intrusive, less media coverage,and less involvement by the LEO than just calling 911 and reporting an accident...And if GA WAS the one to cover up an accidental drowning, to AVOID anyone seeing that he was molesting CAYLEE, then he is the stupidest dang cop there ever was. It would be as though he went out of his way to USE everything he could find from the house! I mean, she didn't HAVE to be bagged and duct taped!...

ITA. Also, why would GA initiate a cover-up, whether botched or not, that would just bring more suspicion on the entire family than an accidental death investigation probably would?

 

[Wendy101]

Those other things might be what the FBI discussed with George. You know those bad pics of casey that made george vomit.

Sorry, just started following the case once this trial started ... what were they pictures of?

 

[katydid23]

Also being ex-LE he would know not to use items from the home to wrap and dump the body. Or to not dump the body around the corner from his own home. He probably would know too that the police would very quickly figure out there is no nanny and that if he is really trying to hide sexual abuse that there would be MUCH less scrutiny if he calls 911 and reports an accidental drowning rather than Caylee just vanishing and his daughter eventually, when she gets around to it, reporting her kidnapped.

EXACTLY RIGHT. Which is why the DT is going to imply that he was actually framing her, not helping her. imoo

 

[katydid23]

ITA. If GA had molested her and/or Caylee, why would she wait to report it until Caylee accidentally drowned in the pool? Also, why would GA fear molestation being discovered during an accidental death investigation?


ITA. Also, why would GA initiate a cover-up, whether botched or not, that would just bring more suspicion on the entire family than an accidental death investigation probably would?

During an autopsy, if the state decided to have one, they might look at a child's
body to see if there was any evidence of abuse, [ tearing or whatnot.]

If a child was hidden and stayed hidden then they could bnot be checked for child abuse.