IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #10

[LittleMissContrary]

I think that many of us who post here begin to feel very helpless when these investigations begin to peter out, and eventually go cold.

What can we do to help???

I have a few ideas. Lets just assume that this was a crime of opportunity and that it has nothing to do with the family.

I think it has been demonstrated in the past that some of these violent serial offenders abduct and kill across counties and state lines, sometimes spanning long distances across the U.S. It could be a truck driver, or simply someone who travels for work. It could be someone who is willing to travel purely for the sake of abduction and murder. If that is the case, it is often difficult to find a pattern to recognize.

What I am proposing is that everyone begin to search for, document, and provide links for recent abduction attempts, unsolved disappearances, missing people(including supposed runaways), as well as non family abductions across the U.S., and we can create our own set of data that will not only be informative but may also show a pattern. If we can connect one or two events together, the chances of finding pertinent details through our own sleuthing increases tremendously. Attempted abductions are just as important as the successful abductions in my mind.

I think it would be a good step towards getting a better idea of the magnitude of the problem. You will be shocked to find out how many of these things are actually taking place every day.

I am not sure about the logistical aspects of this proposal yet, I just wanted to throw it out there and see if anyone would be interested in participating.

thanks

 

[GrainneDhu]

Counseling would never be able to control anxiety attacks. Never.

IMO, JMO, MOO

I'm not an expert but I think it can help.

Somehow I taught myself to stop anxiety attacks after I was traumatised when I was 12. When I was 17, I stopped having them.

Then they started up again when I was hospitalised in 2005.

Most of the time, I can stop them if I catch it before it escalates. Once it gets past a certain point, though, all I can do is hang on, practise breathing and wait for it to be over. It's not a great feeling but I can deal with it.

If I could somehow teach myself to stop them, I have to believe that professional counselling would be even more effective.

 

[RNER]

Wonderful post! I do think, however, the movement against the drug use in our nation must start at a grassroots level. It is going to have to be individuals and families who are sick and tired of the "crap" (attracting unsavory type characters, friends and family OD'ing, kids turning up missing, theft, arrests, addiction) that drugs bring into their lives, their communities, their towns and don't put up with any more. More people like Mr. Carpenter and his wife are needed, they get ouside and are familiar with their neighbors, the neighbors' children and the activities that are going on around them. To end it, you gotta stay on it like stink on a skunk.

I agree...but you also have to have support and enforcement by the LE, Judicial System, and Children's Services, otherwise your "neighborhood efforts" go nowhere. Which appears to be the case with this family in this community! MOO

 

[Bootsctr]

Here is something interesting to note regarding the above comment and Wyeth park...I found this post on craigslist.

It seems very similar in writing style to the pervie/puppy guy...



bike trail in george wyth - m4w - 30 (waterloo)

Date: 2012-07-12, 8:50PM CDT
Reply to: kbptj-3135922019@pers.craigslist.org

i passed by you we caught i contact, you were wearing a blue tank top and black shorts. you had glasses on. if this is you and you remember this happening tell me what color bike i have or something u noticed about me. i hope you see this cause i would like to talk to you
Location: waterloo
it's NOT ok to contact this poster with services or other commercial interests
PostingID: 3135922019


its possible our pervie puppy guy was also at the park. He did say he was getting desperate.

I admit, I'm not too familiar with CL. It sort of creeps me out. Maybe because of that guy that was named the CL killer and the serial killer in New York... I dunno! But, I admit, those ads are very strange! :beagle: Surely LE is looking at CL. Does anyone think LE might place some catch-you type ads aimed at luring someone involved with the girls' abduction?

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

My father finally drank himself to death in 2009. Why? Because he used alcohol to escape reality. He never had to cope with anything when there was a beer in his hand. Using drugs and alcohol is the very opposite of coping. It is unhealthy and there are consequences. At the end of his life, my dad had lost almost everything dear to him because the only thing that mattered to him was alcohol.

Life is hard. It's hard for all of us. I've had many crappy things happen to me and I chose to fight my way through the difficult times. It is, to me, a bunch of BS to use problems as an excuse to drink/do drugs. I grew up with no father because he started drinking as soon as his feet hit the floor in the morning. I don't touch a drop of the stuff because I would never want my son to think he comes second to anything. Just my opinion.

 

[Bootsctr]

I think that many of us who post here begin to feel very helpless when these investigations begin to peter out, and eventually go cold.

What can we do to help???

I have a few ideas. Lets just assume that this was a crime of opportunity and that it has nothing to do with the family.

I think it has been demonstrated in the past that some of these violent serial offenders abduct and kill across counties and state lines, sometimes spanning long distances across the U.S. It could be a truck driver, or simply someone who travels for work. It could be someone who is willing to travel purely for the sake of abduction and murder. If that is the case, it is often difficult to find a pattern to recognize.

What I am proposing is that everyone begin to search for, document, and provide links for recent abduction attempts, unsolved disappearances, missing people(including supposed runaways), as well as non family abductions across the U.S., and we can create our own set of data that will not only be informative but may also show a pattern. If we can connect one or two events together, the chances of finding pertinent details through our own sleuthing increases tremendously. Attempted abductions are just as important as the successful abductions in my mind.

I think it would be a good step towards getting a better idea of the magnitude of the problem. You will be shocked to find out how many of these things are actually taking place every day.

I am not sure about the logistical aspects of this proposal yet, I just wanted to throw it out there and see if anyone would be interested in participating.

thanks

I like it and would be interested in participating, but the magnitude of the proposition seems staggering. Good idea though.

 

[callyn]

I'm not an expert but I think it can help.

Somehow I taught myself to stop anxiety attacks after I was traumatised when I was 12. When I was 17, I stopped having them.

Then they started up again when I was hospitalised in 2005.

Most of the time, I can stop them if I catch it before it escalates. Once it gets past a certain point, though, all I can do is hang on, practise breathing and wait for it to be over. It's not a great feeling but I can deal with it.

If I could somehow teach myself to stop them, I have to believe that professional counselling would be even more effective.

Sometimes a combination of therapy and drugs is needed. If the anxiety is at a high level, sometimes a person really cannot participate in helping themselves. The counseling just cannot get through the wall of anxiety. JMO MOO

 

[Tramp123]

My father finally drank himself to death in 2009. Why? Because he used alcohol to escape reality. He never had to cope with anything when there was a beer in his hand. Using drugs and alcohol is the very opposite of coping. It is unhealthy and there are consequences. At the end of his life, my dad had lost almost everything dear to him because the only thing that mattered to him was alcohol.

Life is hard. It's hard for all of us. I've had many crappy things happen to me and I chose to fight my way through the difficult times. It is, to me, a bunch of BS to use problems as an excuse to drink/do drugs. I grew up with no father because he started drinking as soon as his feet hit the floor in the morning. I don't touch a drop of the stuff because I would never want my son to think he comes second to anything. Just my opinion.

Bravo! Thanks for being a great parent for your son.

 

[BethInAK]

Counseling would never be able to control anxiety attacks. Never.

IMO, JMO, MOO

Of course it could. I overcame panic attacks using my brain and deep breathing.

 

[callyn]

Of course it could. I overcame panic attacks using my brain and deep breathing.

I'm happy for you that you could do that. Not everyone can though.

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

Sometimes a combination of therapy and drugs is needed. If the anxiety is at a high level, sometimes a person really cannot participate in helping themselves. The counseling just cannot get through the wall of anxiety. JMO MOO-Callyn

As a therapist, I can tell you that statement is so true.anxiety can be so debilitating that it makes therapy almost useless. You must first be able to reach the person in order to show them effective coping strategies.

 

[GGE]

Lyric and Elizabeth are 10 and 8 - no wait, 9 - today is Elizabeth's birthday.

My daughter is 9. She just stopped believing in Santa Claus this past year.

These are two sweet innocent children, and they need to be home with the people who love them, with their stuffed animals, watching SpongeBob.

What can we do?

WS is powerful, and smart.

If we can go back to the beginning, start fresh, and try to ignore the family (let's admit it, we've scrutinized them heavily but haven't focussed much on strangers - maybe it's time, it sure can't hurt, it's not like we have anything new to go on) maybe we can, together, think of a new angle to explore.



I just feel so frustrated, and want to focus all this great intelligent energy going on in here on finding the girls like everyone else does, but try as I might, I just can't think of anywhere else to "back up" to but the video surveillance tape.

If they were going west (or northwest) on Brovan on that tape, what other businesses would they have passed?

There has to be another one with a camera... IMO..

 

[cindersoot]

Wouldnt there be fingerprints on the purse if a stranger had tossed it?

Not if they had bicycle gloves on.

 

[Shelby2]

Sometimes a combination of therapy and drugs is needed. If the anxiety is at a high level, sometimes a person really cannot participate in helping themselves. The counseling just cannot get through the wall of anxiety. JMO MOO

True, and there are anxiety attacks and then there are panic attacks, my daughter's are so bad we just got her a service dog, they are debilitating. Cognitive Behavioral Therapy is helping but she is on meds, wasn't functioning before. The problem is the drugs prescribed can lead to addiction, I worry about it.
Sorry for the O/T

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

Why don't we go over what we know to be FACT first, which is very little. just the facts to start.

 

[GrainneDhu]

Not if they had bicycle gloves on.

Respectfully, bicycle gloves are usually fingerless. They're meant to pad the palms of the hands from the pressure of the handlebars (although adjusting the handlebars properly can markedly reduce or eliminate the need to pad the hands).

 

[Shelby2]

Why don't we go over what we know to be FACT first, which is very little. just the facts to start.

I am still trying to come up with a timeline!!

 

[GGE]

Not if they had bicycle gloves on.

bike gloves have the fingers cut off.

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

Ok, we know that they went for a bike ride together, which Gma stated they had done "millions" of times. Last OFFICIALLY seen by surveillance at 12:11 pm, but that time was reported to be 8 minutes slower than cellular time.

 

[Jules71]

Why don't we go over what we know to be FACT first, which is very little. just the facts to start.

Facts:
1. Last seen on cctv at 12:11 (or + 8 minutes slow = 12:19)
2. Bikes found at 3:58
3. Elizabeth and Lyric are missing