IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #14

[azuredewdrop]

This seems like we're getting awfully close to sleuthing this man, IMO.

<snipped>

Agreed...there should be caution not to cross the thin line. Don't want to cross the mods.

What we really need is...something fresh to look at, discuss, etc! Come on LE...give us something already!

 

[otto]

Ok google maps has 1.1 miles from Cornbelt Auctions to Lake Ave.

Shortest route - straight down S Evans.

Time - 4 minutes.

Not sure how to post the damn thing though....

I looked at routes a couple of days ago and it seems to me that there are quite a few intersections. Also, Gilbert is a busy road (according to Ollipop). Why would the girls ride along it to get to Lake Avenue when they could just as easily stay on Evans?

How do you figure out that it takes 4 or 8 minutes for a 65 pound, 4'1", eight year old on a BMX bike to ride from the Collin's Home to the SE tip of Meyers Lake?

 

[Confusion]

I absolutely couldn't agree more! I can not count how many times I have handled the most stressful situation (where others around me are freaking out) and managed to stay very still and calm. I think it must run in my family though. When my grandfather was in the hospital dying (they had just taken him off of life support), my family coped by joking (very morbidly) about what we think each other's funerals should be like and about other very morbid things (and laughing our heads off!). At the mortuary 2 days later, we were in fits of laughter over every little thing. Was it appropriate? Absolutely not. And for some of us...it would seem very out of character! But it was how we coped with the very awful and very real pain that we felt. We apologized to the mortician and he said that he sees this reaction far more often than people would expect.

Are you a distant cousin or something? When my one aunt was dying last year (she was 4 years older than me and one of my best friends all my life), we talked a lot about dying and things (like her wanting a taxidermist to stuff her and put her in a bikini so she could continue to embarrass her sons after she was gone. She'd complain about people always crying around her, saying, "I'm not dead yet, why can't they try to make good memories now instead of wasting the time?" At one point, a few months before she died, she told me it really bugged her that everybody kept telling her they loved her - but had never said it to her before in her life. Being the serious person I am, I just said, "Well, I don't love you!"; she responded by saying, "Well, I don't love you more!" and busting out laughing.

 

[Simp]

I'm gonna say one more thing about the timeline. Then I will hush. Lol
I'd like to see a comparison of times from TG's cell phone time and the time on the surveillance tape. Comparing the owner of the store's phone to surveillance tape is apples and oranges to me. Compare TG's phone to the surveillance tape. Then of course we don't know exactly how much time it took him to ride where he used the restroom, to actually use the restroom, then call his daughter. MOO

 

[FrayedKnot]

I certainly can see your (& hubbies) point ...although terribly sad that others can't watch out for others' children anymore without getting accused of being a pedo.

I remember an incident at the park with my ex when our lil one was about 18 mos. We were seated on a bench at the toddler playground watching her play when an unattended child fell from a ladder and began crying.


My ex went over right away to help him up and make sure he wasn't hurt. I had to run over and tell him that he had better let me handle it because it might look "creepy" for him to help, even though he was just being a caring, vigilant adult, unlike the child's mother.

She showed up a few minutes later as I was giving her little boy a makeshift boo boo ice pack for his elbow and she shot me the look of death and snatched him away without so much as a "thank you".

Still, she might have been worse had it been my ex. .

Sorry for the OT. There is just so little news.

 

[otto]

mr g saw the bikes then road to the rest room and then calld his daughter at 12:27..that means all of that took 7 minutes...sounds reasonable..even if mr g was off by 5 minutes that would mean he saw the bikes at 12:25 which would give the girls 6 minutes to make the trip and get off of the bikes..not likely in my mind. also they didnt stop at 1020 lake they stopped behind the lake 1.3 miles in my estimation.

I understood that the gate where the bikes were found is 1.5 miles from the Collins home.

 

[callyn]

I have a sprinkler system with nine zones. Some zones are set for an hour each and some for less. House is on city water, but sprinklers are on well, so it doesn't cost me anything.

I have well envy.

 

[rjjensen]

I looked at routes a couple of days ago and it seems to me that there are quite a few intersections. Also, Gilbert is a busy road (according to Ollipop). Why would the girls ride along it to get to Lake Avenue when they could just as easily stay on Evans?

How do you figure out that it takes 4 or 8 minutes for a 65 pound, 4'1", eight year old on a BMX bike to ride from the Collin's Home to the SE tip of Meyers Lake?

good question..i took the fastest possible root and still it was 6 minutes..im assuming google does not take in to account stopping for intersections etc..if the fastest possible root does not fit then longer routes would also not fit...just a guess really

 

[FrayedKnot]

Confusion, (((((hugs))))))

 

[otto]

Well, I will try and answer to the best of my ability. Lol
It's been my understanding the bikes were close to a gate, a gate that was unlocked. So, TG could have thought ......... KIDS TODAY!!! They just toss their bikes and go off rambling in the woods. As to why he may not have moved them, I can't say. Maybe for the same reason some people see trash on the ground and don't pick it up. They just step over it. I, on the other hand, pick up trash when it's just tossed about and throw it away. Especially in a park. I never thought if he went home back by the bikes. I always "assumed" he didn't go back the same way. Of course this is MOO!!! I value other people's opinions, this is just mine!

The trail goes around the entire lake, and I think he said that he routinely does the 16 km loop from his house to the lake and back.

 

[Confusion]

Being Captain Obvious here again. Why was LE denying knowledge of TG at about the same time they were using his sighting of the bikes to establish their 8 minute time line? Is it possible that where they were or something else about it is important, but they don't want whatever it is to become public?

 

[ShyViolet]

In this, imo, heartwrenching interview with Drew and Heather, they admit it is possible that Elizabeth had been down by the Lake before without their knowledge. Around 10:00. This does not have the exact quote I was looking for but it covers quite a bit more than most interviews of the family.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...mix_1bc152e0-d767-11e1-bec1-0019bb2963f4.html

I think it is possible that Mr C could be mistaken about the girls riding by that day. I know I have regulars I recognize, who walk or bike past my house, probably daily or close to it, but if the police came to my door to ask if seen one in particular that day, I doubt I would be able to answer with certainty. And Mr C. has a few years on me. I have no reason to think Mr C is lying, just possibly mistaken. Or not. jmo

 

[SapphireSteel]

I looked at routes a couple of days ago and it seems to me that there are quite a few intersections. Also, Gilbert is a busy road (according to Ollipop). Why would the girls ride along it to get to Lake Avenue when they could just as easily stay on Evans?

How do you figure out that it takes 4 or 8 minutes for a 65 pound, 4'1", eight year old on a BMX bike to ride from the Collin's Home to the SE tip of Meyers Lake?

1. it is the way the crow flies...Gilbert may be busier but Lake is not, they would only be on Gilbert for a quick minute.

2. Mr C says he saw the girls "all the time" so one would assume they frequently took that route. There is only one thing Lake Ave is on the way to, and that's the lake.

3. the bikes were found at the lake off Arbutus. I find it easy to believe that they rode 1.5 miles in 8 minutes...that is just over walking pace.

:moo:

 

[Sunlight]

The trail goes around the entire lake, and I think he said that he routinely does the 16 km loop from his house to the lake and back.

Is that from Waterloo and back?

 

[otto]

Agreed...there should be caution not to cross the thin line. Don't want to cross the mods.

What we really need is...something fresh to look at, discuss, etc! Come on LE...give us something already!

I want a reason to believe his tip, as it helps figure out the route taken by the girls. At this time, I'm not convinced that his tip should be included in the route, or timeline. It seems too vague. If he had a beautiful yard, full of flowers, shrubs, trees, lawn furniture or a vegetable garden, I would easily believe that he was routinely outside at that time of day and evening ... since they see her every evening too. That's not the case, so it seems more like a vague idea about the time. Also, I don't think that anyone else has reported that Elizabeth rode her bike to the lake and talked with people every evening.

 

[rjjensen]

Being Captain Obvious here again. Why was LE denying knowledge of TG at about the same time they were using his sighting of the bikes to establish their 8 minute time line? Is it possible that where they were or something else about it is important, but they don't want whatever it is to become public?

if i was LE he'd be a suspect and perhaps for a time he was..but they have access to more details that we do

 

[MotherOcean]

I'm gonna say one more thing about the timeline. Then I will hush. Lol
I'd like to see a comparison of times from TG's cell phone time and the time on the surveillance tape. Comparing the owner of the store's phone to surveillance tape is apples and oranges to me. Compare TG's phone to the surveillance tape. Then of course we don't know exactly how much time it took him to ride where he used the restroom, to actually use the restroom, then call his daughter. MOO

surveillance - 12:11 pm (same "time" as cell, tape was 8 mts. behind cell)
Mr. P's cell - 12:19 pm (same "time" as tape, cell was 8 mts. ahead of tape)

....1.5 miles away.... (7 or 8 minutes minimum) ....

Mr. T's sighting - "about" 12:20 pm (his guess, based on traveling from bike sighting to store/bathroom and call to his daughter)

Mr. T called daughter - 12:27 pm (according to his cell phone)

That's all we have to go on.

 

[otto]

Is that from Waterloo and back?

I think so.

 

[SapphireSteel]

I want a reason to believe his tip, as it helps figure out the route taken by the girls. At this time, I'm not convinced that his tip should be included in the route, or timeline. It seems too vague. If he had a beautiful yard, full of flowers, shrubs, trees, lawn furniture or a vegetable garden, I would easily believe that he was routinely outside at that time of day and evening ... since they see her every evening too. That's not the case, so it seems more like a vague idea about the time. Also, I don't think that anyone else has reported that Elizabeth rode her bike to the lake and talked with people every evening.

Do you also discount Mr G's sighting of the bikes?

Why do you think these two men are being untruthful/inaccurate?

 

[SouthernMom]

I looked at routes a couple of days ago and it seems to me that there are quite a few intersections. Also, Gilbert is a busy road (according to Ollipop). Why would the girls ride along it to get to Lake Avenue when they could just as easily stay on Evans?

From what I could see when zooming in on Google Maps, the sidewalk on Evans ended at Gilbert and Gilbert had a sidewalk to ride on. It's possible that the girls did not want to ride on the shoulder of the road. I think I saw a post that the folks who lived on Lake that reported a sighting of the girls lived on the corner of Lake and Gilbert, so it's possible they never traveled on Lake. I don't know for sure about this tho.
My theory is that they followed the sidewalks to get to the lake. IMHO, as always.