IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #33

[Bootsctr]

Ok...help me understand the scenario with the second set of bikes please.

Some believe that the bikes that the biker saw were possibly NOT the bikes of the girls, correct?

Do you believe that the girls were apparently riding two "mystery" bikes that didn't belong to them (possibly the two bikes caught on the video) and those were laying across the path at the back of the lake at which the biker saw?

So then would we deduce the perp went to the Collins house, picked up the girls bikes, staged them at the lake, and then took the two bikes the girls were actually riding with him and also took the girls?

I just want to make sure I understand how the 2nd set of bikes would play into the scenario.

Yeah, thanks 3CK. I'm not getting it either. I think the scenario with with going back to the Collins house and picking up the girls' actual bikes is pretty complicated. I, for one, believe the bikes the bicyclist saw and the ones found by the firefighter at 4:00 at Meyers Lake were the girls bicycles. I think it was the girls on the CCK video. To me, it looked like Elizabeth was in the lead and Lyric behind and they were going at a pretty good clip.

 

[cindersoot]

I'm happy to see so many new pages here, new discussions moving in a few directions. Hopefully something will come of it.

Roger, it is great to have you posting here. When you speak with LE will you be mentioning the possibility of a white truck with a white topper?

I have contacted LE about the truck two months ago.

 

[cindersoot]

threecrazykids and Boots, I agree, those were the girls bikes for sure.

 

[carbuff]

Yeah, thanks 3CK. I'm not getting it either. I think the scenario with with going back to the Collins house and picking up the girls' actual bikes is pretty complicated. I, for one, believe the bikes the bicyclist saw and the ones found by the firefighter at 4:00 at Meyers Lake were the girls bicycles. I think it was the girls on the CCK video. To me, it looked like Elizabeth was in the lead and Lyric behind and they were going at a pretty good clip.

Well, no, it's not complicated. Nobody's saying the girls rode different bikes; they're very unlikely to have been riding any other bikes than the ones they always rode (though I suppose they might have ridden each other's, that doesn't really affect the timeline).

But I think the bikes on the trail at 12:20 most likely belonged to some other kids who were playing by the water, fishing, or whatever, and left before the girls got there. Nobody else reported any bikes on the trail, and L&E's bikes were found off the trail.

I am making a big assumption here -- I'm assuming L&E weren't the only children in town out riding their bikes on a lazy summer day.

 

[Bootsctr]

I have contacted LE about the truck two months ago.

Good going cindersoot! :drumroll:

 

[Bootsctr]

Well, no, it's not complicated. Nobody's saying the girls rode different bikes; they're very unlikely to have been riding any other bikes than the ones they always rode (though I suppose they might have ridden each other's, that doesn't really affect the timeline).

But I think the bikes on the trail at 12:20 most likely belonged to some other kids who were playing by the water, fishing, or whatever, and left before the girls got there. Nobody else reported any bikes on the trail, and L&E's bikes were found off the trail.

I am making a big assumption here -- I'm assuming L&E weren't the only children in town out riding their bikes on a lazy summer day.

Yes, that is absolutely possible that the two bikes seen on the trail at 12:20 might have belonged to other children in the area. If a child or a couple of kids had witnessed L&E at the lake, I don't think LE would release that information being the witnesses are children. Was it possible that L&E were rushing to the lake that day to meet whomever the other two bikes belonged too, if indeed they were not L&E's?

 

[carbuff]

Yes, that is absolutely possible that the two bikes seen on the trail at 12:20 might have belonged to other children in the area. If a child or a couple of kids had witnessed L&E at the lake, I don't think LE would release that information being the witnesses are children. Was it possible that L&E were rushing to the lake that day to meet whomever the other two bikes belonged too, if indeed they were not L&E's?

Given when the first set of bikes was seen, and the time at which L&E could reasonably have arrived at the lake, I think it's more than possible their paths didn't even cross.

But you're right, if they did, LE would almost certainly not release the information.

I don't have the impression that LE took the early bike sighting very seriously to begin with.

 

[threecrazykids]

Yes, that is absolutely possible that the two bikes seen on the trail at 12:20 might have belonged to other children in the area. If a child or a couple of kids had witnessed L&E at the lake, I don't think LE would release that information being the witnesses are children. Was it possible that L&E were rushing to the lake that day to meet whomever the other two bikes belonged too, if indeed they were not L&E's?

This would of course mean that the biker has now missed TWO sets of children who were possibly in the area at the same time.

How can no one have seen these girls be abducted when we're trying to place all sorts of people in the area at the same time the girls were reportedly there.

:banghead:

 

[Sunlight]

I don't see how they could have been seen on Brovan at 12:23 and been on the trail and off their bikes at 12:20.

"“Today marks two months since the disappearance of 11-year-old Lyric Cook and 9-year-old Elizabeth Collins,” Rick Abben, chief deputy at the Black Hawk County Sheriff’s Office, said in a statement Thursday. “Both girls were last seen on July 13 at 12:15 p.m. riding their bicycles away from the Collins residence in Evansdale. We have information that the girls were seen approximately 12:23 p.m. on Brovan Blvd. and between 12:30 and 1:00 p.m. on Gilbert DR. in the area of Meyers Lake in Evansdale.”

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/headline...lead-for-help/

 

[carbuff]

This would of course mean that the biker has now missed TWO sets of children who were possibly in the area at the same time.

How can no one have seen these girls be abducted when we're trying to place all sorts of people in the area at the same time the girls were reportedly there.

:banghead:

Possibly. Though if the first set of bikes belong to other kids, and L&E didn't arrive at the lake until later, he really only missed the first set.

 

[iamnotagolem]

I don't know why we assume he missed the bikers. He saw two people fishing, why is it so hard to put 2+2 together and assume that the two people he saw fishing were the owners of the 2 bikes?

 

[Sunlight]

I may be way off on this, but I think he saw people fishing while at the park bathrooms, not down by the trail. MOO

The girls could not possibly have been on Brovan at 12:23 (per Abben) AND have been at the trail at 12:20...just could not have happened that way. See my post #607.

MOO

 

[SapphireSteel]

Sooo frustrated with this case.

Give us some more information, please, LE!!

AFAIK the "last seen" is still officially 12.15.

:twocents:

 

[Bootsctr]

I don't know why we assume he missed the bikers. He saw two people fishing, why is it so hard to put 2+2 together and assume that the two people he saw fishing were the owners of the 2 bikes?

Would 2 people fishing have left their bikes haphazardly in the bike trail where someone would have to swerve to miss them? Would make sense to take your bike to as close to the water and where you were going to fish. The bikes should have been close to the water if they belonged to the fishermen. I don't know. The story is just fishy.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Would 2 people fishing have left their bikes haphazardly in the bike trail where someone would have to swerve to miss them? Would make sense to take your bike to as close to the water and where you were going to fish. The bikes should have been close to the water if they belonged to the fishermen. I don't know. The story is just fishy.

The case of the Fishy Fishermen...:websleuther:

 

[carbuff]

Would 2 people fishing have left their bikes haphazardly in the bike trail where someone would have to swerve to miss them? Would make sense to take your bike to as close to the water and where you were going to fish. The bikes should have been close to the water if they belonged to the fishermen. I don't know. The story is just fishy.

If they were 12 they might have just dropped the bikes where they were without thinking they were blocking the path, and they might have wandered from fishing hole to fishing hole without noticing how far they had gone from their bikes.

Or maybe the bikes went with someone else.

 

[Snowbunny]

Ok...help me understand the scenario with the second set of bikes please.

Some believe that the bikes that the biker saw were possibly NOT the bikes of the girls, correct?

Do you believe that the girls were apparently riding two "mystery" bikes that didn't belong to them (possibly the two bikes caught on the video) and those were laying across the path at the back of the lake at which the biker saw?

So then would we deduce the perp went to the Collins house, picked up the girls bikes, staged them at the lake, and then took the two bikes the girls were actually riding with him and also took the girls?

I just want to make sure I understand how the 2nd set of bikes would play into the scenario.

The two bikes TG saw were laying across the bike path. The bikes LE found were leaning up against the fence. If the two bike TG saw were the girls, then someone moved them before LE arrived.

 

[Bootsctr]

Who moved the bikes? I thought a fireman found the bikes. As far as I am concerned, Tg might have moved/touched the bikes. Abben would not say where the bikes were found.

 

[Sunlight]

TG may have seen two bikes at 12:20, but Abben made a statement that they have information that the girls were seen on Brovan at 12:23 (3 minutes AFTER TG says he saw the bikes). He could not have seen the bikes belonging to the girls IMO, unless Abben made that up, which I'm sure he did not. In addition, TG made a call to his daughter at 12:27 from the park bathrooms at Gilbert and Elmer.

MOO

 

[Bootsctr]

If they were 12 they might have just dropped the bikes where they were without thinking they were blocking the path, and they might have wandered from fishing hole to fishing hole without noticing how far they had gone from their bikes.

Or maybe the bikes went with someone else.

I don't think the boys were 12. . . I think they were more like 15, 17 and 20. Hypothetically, of course, if the girls were to be meeting 2 boys Just to ride their bikes with, perhaps race!!