IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #9

[whittymom4]

It bothers me so much that a few days earlier the police were called because Lyric ( and another cousin/friend) were late/ missing.

WTH besides non existent supervision, what was the trend here? -Being late? why??? What else had she been doing lately? I know we have mentioned- " running away" meeting a secret friend and or acquaintance( grooming?), I keep thinking they could have been sneaking off to smoke cigarettes or something "off the beaten track"? do kids make "Forts" these days?

In any scenario they could have encountered any number of perps.

:-(

My girls and their friends do. They are all 8-10, about 12 of them in their little "click" will ride bikes together everyday. They like to go exploring, especially in a Forrest or wooded area. They make-up stories and play act the parts...
One thing little girls do, at least these girls do- when they ride their bikes and stop to get off--they always use the kickstand. Never just thrown down. The boys in my neighborhood just throw their bikes down and go.

Then the purse, these girls when taking stuff with them, tie their purse to the handlebars so they don't have to hold on to it and steer the bike at the same time.
Just thinking...interesting the way the bikes and purse were found.

 

[Marilynilpa]

Ollipop said the families were contacted by the Dr. Phil show. (think I read that correctly)

I think Dr. Phil would tear Lyric's mom up! Where is her emotion? I would love to see this happen. It would be huge exposure for the girls!! He has the largest audience in daytime talk shows...plus worldwide exposure!!

I believe Ollipop said his wife heard from family that Dr. Phil had contacted the families. He didn't know whether this was true or not, he was just passing along the info. IMO

 

[TxLady2]

I'm thinking that T's bombshell could be because Lyric spent more time with gma , could have been allowed to go to lake area. Elizabeth,being younger may not have had so much freedom. This may be why we are hearing "the girls never went to the lake" Maybe
Gma doesn't want Heather to know she did let them go further than Heather would have allowed. And Tammy knows where they were going . I dunno. Just thinking of why one would say one thing and the other the opposite. I don't post much here, I'm on the iPad but some nights I am up till 5 am catching up. Where can they be? Did I read that TES is
coming or was I dreaming?

Could be that grandma is kind of clueless about what the girls do when they're together. Some grandmas are like that, they just turn the kids loose, get lost in their soap operas and don't ask where they've been or what they've done once they come back. Kids can be sneaky, and a lot of parents/grandparents find out years later that their kids or grandkids were doing stuff they never dreamed they would do. Maybe she had warned them not to ever go to the lake without an adult, and since they didn't tell her about it, she assumed they never did.
I babysat my grandson one summer who was about 9 at the time. He kept his bike here but was told every day not to get out on the highway and not to leave the yard without permission. Our driveway was pretty long with a curve in it and also went uphill toward the road, it should have been plenty room for him to ride his bike where I could see him. Yet he ended up a half a mile up the road at a neighbor's house a couple times. He thought that if I didn't find out he wouldn't get in trouble.

 

[whittymom4]

I believe Ollipop said his wife heard from family that Dr. Phil had contacted the families. He didn't know whether this was true or not, he was just passing along the info. IMO

Thank you for clarifying. Sorry about that, guess I was excited to hear about Dr. Phil!
I hope it is true, if not maybe a bunch of us can send him an email? I will...

 

[Sunlight]

Didn't she also say ' The police have his name.." or something like that.

I have serious doubts about that witness as well. Nobody else seems to have seen the girls, but the first random guy she spoke with saw them riding their bikes. But I don't understand why the girls would have been riding around the lake on the trail, when they know they were supposed to have been home by 1 or 1:30. They had already been out riding since 11:30 am. So why would they just keep riding around the lake like that?

I know kids are often late, but usually because they are at a friends or at the mall or something. But why would they just keep riding around the lake like that, knowing the trouble Lyric had just been in for being late a few days earlier? I think that witness was mistaken or he saw the wrong girls.

Exactly...unless he is the perp. I'd like an interviewer to ask her about this..i.e., what did he look like? Was he a paddleboater? There is no way those girls were riding around anywhere by 2:30 IMHO. MBB

 

[cluciano63]

I'm not sure what you mean by "professional searchers."

I keep wondering if the perp is someone who moved away from Evansdale at some point in the last five years or so.

That would account for the local knowledge but might help avert suspicion.

I was referring to Texas Equisearch, etc...

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

I am trying to get past the girls riding to the lake. I mapped out 1.5 miles in all directions from my childhood home. My mother would have kicked my butt if I was that far from home at age 8. Or 10 from that matter. I can tell you that my brother and i pushed many boundaries, but at no time did we ever go NEAR that far.

I grew up in a very safe area. Not far from the elementary, jr. High and high schools. and approximately one mile from my grandparents home.

I think 1.5 miles is a ridiculous distance to be with no adult. I would have had a heart attack if I had ever found out my son was that far from my home at age 8. "safe" area or not.

I truly believe that the family knows that the distance is unacceptable for those two kids, which might explain the reluctance of Grandma and other members of the family to admit they may ride their bikes to the lake.

COOK-MORRISSEY: I don`t think they have a normal bike route, but they are not allowed to just ride freely for hours or until dark. They do have a little bit of freedom, so they`re allowed to go, you know, maybe two or three blocks away and stay within those blocks. An hour, check back in is kind of the standard that we hold with them, and mostly, they stick with it.


And so it was at 11:30, they asked me if they could go for a short bike ride, and I said yes. And they`ve done this millions of times. And they`ve never, never went that far. I could go outside and yell their names, and they would eventually hear me.-Wilma Cook

 

[whittymom4]

Could be that grandma is kind of clueless about what the girls do when they're together. Some grandmas are like that, they just turn the kids loose, get lost in their soap operas and don't ask where they've been or what they've done once they come back. Kids can be sneaky, and a lot of parents/grandparents find out years later that their kids or grandkids were doing stuff they never dreamed they would do. Maybe she had warned them not to ever go to the lake without an adult, and since they didn't tell her about it, she assumed they never did.
I babysat my grandson one summer who was about 9 at the time. He kept his bike here but was told every day not to get out on the highway and not to leave the yard without permission. Our driveway was pretty long with a curve in it and also went uphill toward the road, it should have been plenty room for him to ride his bike where I could see him. Yet he ended up a half a mile up the road at a neighbor's house a couple times. He thought that if I didn't find out he wouldn't get in trouble.

Exactly! Kids do things thinking if mom/gmom doesn't know it won't be a problem. Plus kids see other kids and they get together. Or see something "really cool" and investigate while going outside the area they were told to stay. At least mine do along with the other kids in this neighborhood.
Example, a new family moved in 4 blocks from our house. My girls wanted to go over and see if they had any girls that wanted to play, of course I said no, too far from here. I thought they would never go over there. Then I notice just about everyday this bunch of girls, (including my 2) riding bikes together would all have Popsicles. I finally asked where they were all getting the Popsicles, they told me "FROM THE POPSICLE MAN". The Popsicle man was the family that moved in 4 blocks away (where I told them not to go) turns out it is not a family at all, just one man in his late 40's. He got the girls attention with his huge dog, a Great Dane, then he would talk to all of them and offer Popsicles.

They don't go there anymore, all of the mom's got together and now we all keep an eye on the group and call each other if there is a problem. I still believe in the saying "it takes a village to raise a child".

 

[Ms Pragmatic]

"it takes a village to raise a child".-whittymom4

Indeed, it does. Had I gone where I wasn't supposed to be, you had better believe at least a half dozen people would have called my mom to tell her all about it before I got home.

 

[Sunlight]

This reminds me of the ultimate stranger perp story..Little Red Riding Hood. The big bad wolf disguises himself as the grandmother (usurps authority)..I dunno Who around these girls would they listen to above and beyond Gma? Or, is it someone saying Gma said it is okay..

Brings to mind "prized possessions" comment by Gma

MOO

 

[Mjskit]

I can't get past the fact that they waited for LE at Myers Lake and never searched. To me it seems one would wait for LE where they last saw the girls. I know TB said a man told her he saw them at 2:30 but that has never been verified. Seems to me they would think oops, just missed them and start driving home looking for them. It has been stated that there are a few ways to get to the lake.

If I KNEW my kids never went further than a couple of blocks, that is where I would concentrate my search. I think something is up with that. It is like they knew the girls went missing from the lake yet knew they would not have drowned in the lake. IMO

 

[whittymom4]

"it takes a village to raise a child".-whittymom4

Indeed, it does. Had I gone where I wasn't supposed to be, you had better believe at least a half dozen people would have called my mom to tell her all about it before I got home.

Me too, and I would have gotten my bike taken away for a week or so. Also when I was that age if I or another kid did something wrong, the neighbor would correct us, then tell our parents. So different now. Awful the way some kids are just left on their own for hours at a time. I see it everyday. The parents are not bad, just busy and clueless to the real world MOO.

 

[cindersoot]

Im off to Evansdale today to do alittle investigating myself. Is there anything you want me to check out?

 

[vasportsmom]

I've debated on posting this for days now but I'm just going to go ahead and do it. Much of what I'm about to say has been batted around as theories but I'm going to share my experiences.

Much has been made of MCM's demeanor and as a loving, devoted mother I too find it baffling but as the daughter of a woman like her I get it. My mother walked off when I was 5. The next time I saw her I was 10 and then I rarely saw her again until I was 13. By the time I moved in with her at 13 I didn't see her as a mother. I felt that I didn't need a "mom" at that point. I was pretty much raised and my grandmothers had did a d@mn good job of it. My mom also felt she had no right to parent me so we developed a sister or friend type relationship. That parental disconnect made for some very interesting dynamics and baffled most people looking in.

Now for the harder point. Again much has been said about the possibility of Lyric being used as a "mule". Both of my parents were involved with drugs, using and selling (growing on one side). Because they dealt in different types of illegals (pot & pills) they liked to trade between the two sets (to further own up to the dysfunction I was raised in my parents married a set of exes). Anyway their favorite way of trading was to put stuff in my brothers' bags as they traded them for weekend visits. My brothers were 10 & 11 when this started and by the time the boys were 12/13 they knew what was going on and were starting to take small amounts out before they handed over their bags.

O/T because I am in no way suggesting this applies to L & E but I just want to share the lasting effects of this. Neither of the boys were 18 when they were busted for having robbed nearly every drug store in 2 counties. At 33/34 they have fathered 8 daughters and never been out of jail for more than 2 years at a time because they can't kick the drug habit they developed more than 2 decades ago thanks to our parents.

Further O/T. I have never gotten anything other than a speeding ticket nor have I ever experimented with drugs. My ex-SIL is one of my best friends and her theory is that I watched my parents fail miserably and learnt exactly what not to do. I lost my dad 6 years ago and while I love and miss him terribly I have always struggled to have a relationship with him and my mother.

I can't believe I'm sharing all this and please know it isn't for sympathy but simply because I think it is nearly impossible for the average person to really grasp that this sort of thing happens. We bat it around in theory but we want to believe that it is so far fetched that it is impossible. It happens far more often than we realize and in families that you would never expect, my dad was a respected, business owner from an upstanding, very religious family.

Now other than MCM's behavior I have no idea if any of this applies to L & E. I have no reason to believe Lyric was being used as a mule or if it is relevant to her abduction even if she was. I have felt from the beginning that the girls are very close to home. I rarely have gut feelings about these cases but I think these girls were lured away by a friendly face and were taken to a nearby home. It won't surprise me if a teenager is involved here. The only thing that gives me pause is the fact that they haven't been found yet. I keep thinking back to the case where the neighbor boy hid the little girl under his bed - teens generally don't hide their victims well so where are these girls?


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[whittymom4]

Im off to Evansdale today to do alittle investigating myself. Is there anything you want me to check out?

Do you know the address of the house for sale? I cannot find it. Also wonder if that paddle boat there is locked to the dock, making it impossible for them or perp to take? Sorry if this has been said before...

I should come up and help look too...think I will try to get a sitter, maybe I will see you there! I drive a 2010 light grey Subaru Forrester with Iowa plates ( of course )...

 

[Mjskit]

Im off to Evansdale today to do alittle investigating myself. Is there anything you want me to check out?

I would like to know who the 3rd person is charged with manufacturing meth with DM. The library might have copies of older newspapers.

Anyone remember when the arrest was?

 

[FindtheTruth]

I've debated on posting this for days now but I'm just going to go ahead and do it. Much of what I'm about to say has been batted around as theories but I'm going to share my experiences.

Much has been made of MCM's demeanor and as a loving, devoted mother I too find it baffling but as the daughter of a woman like her I get it. My mother walked off when I was 5. The next time I saw her I was 10 and then I rarely saw her again until I was 13. By the time I moved in with her at 13 I didn't see her as a mother. I felt that I didn't need a "mom" at that point. I was pretty much raised and my grandmothers had did a d@mn good job of it. My mom also felt she had no right to parent me so we developed a sister or friend type relationship. That parental disconnect made for some very interesting dynamics and baffled most people looking in.

Now for the harder point. Again much has been said about the possibility of Lyric being used as a "mule". Both of my parents were involved with drugs, using and selling (growing on one side). Because they dealt in different types of illegals (pot & pills) they liked to trade between the two sets (to further own up to the dysfunction I was raised in my parents married a set of exes). Anyway their favorite way of trading was to put stuff in my brothers' bags as they traded them for weekend visits. My brothers were 10 & 11 when this started and by the time the boys were 12/13 they knew what was going on and were starting to take small amounts out before they handed over their bags.

O/T because I am in no way suggesting this applies to L & E but I just want to share the lasting effects of this. Neither of the boys were 18 when they were busted for having robbed nearly every drug store in 2 counties. At 33/34 they have fathered 8 daughters and never been out of jail for more than 2 years at a time because they can't kick the drug habit they developed more than 2 decades ago thanks to our parents.

Further O/T. I have never gotten anything other than a speeding ticket nor have I ever experimented with drugs. My ex-SIL is one of my best friends and her theory is that I watched my parents fail miserably and learnt exactly what not to do. I lost my dad 6 years ago and while I love and miss him terribly I have always struggled to have a relationship with him and my mother.

I can't believe I'm sharing all this and please know it isn't for sympathy but simply because I think it is nearly impossible for the average person to really grasp that this sort of thing happens. We bat it around in theory but we want to believe that it is so far fetched that it is impossible. It happens far more often than we realize and in families that you would never expect, my dad was a respected, business owner from an upstanding, very religious family.

Now other than MCM's behavior I have no idea if any of this applies to L & E. I have no reason to believe Lyric was being used as a mule or if it is relevant to her abduction even if she was. I have felt from the beginning that the girls are very close to home. I rarely have gut feelings about these cases but I think these girls were lured away by a friendly face and were taken to a nearby home. It won't surprise me if a teenager is involved here. The only thing that gives me pause is the fact that they haven't been found yet. I keep thinking back to the case where the neighbor boy hid the little girl under his bed - teens generally don't hide their victims well so where are these girls?


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The "thank you" button just didn't seem like enough. I appreciate you sharing your personal history which will help many of us understand the different lifestyles/upbringing of these children. I believe Lyric views her grandmother and HC & DC more of her "parents" since MCM and DM were away for such long periods of time. It is scary how drugs and money can cause people to put their own children in harms way. I applaud you for breaking the cycle.

 

[katydid23]

Vasportsmom,

I am so glad that you made it through that minefield that you call childhood. Well Done. Many don't make it past those kinds of experiences. Thank you for sharing.

I know a lot of people keep saying that the families criminal drug background is just a distraction or a red herring. but I disagree. As you said, it can affect a child's life in so many ways. In my opinion it opens a child up to so many more vulnerable situations, so many more unsavory people, and rough experiences.

 

[cindersoot]

Do you know the address of the house for sale? I cannot find it. Also wonder if that paddle boat there is locked to the dock, making it impossible for them or perp to take? Sorry if this has been said before...

I should come up and help look too...think I will try to get a sitter, maybe I will see you there! I drive a 2010 light grey Subaru Forrester with Iowa plates ( of course )...

I will get the address and look for the paddle boat, that was my main objective.

 

[Marilynilpa]

I've debated on posting this for days now but I'm just going to go ahead and do it. Much of what I'm about to say has been batted around as theories but I'm going to share my experiences.

Much has been made of MCM's demeanor and as a loving, devoted mother I too find it baffling but as the daughter of a woman like her I get it. My mother walked off when I was 5. The next time I saw her I was 10 and then I rarely saw her again until I was 13. By the time I moved in with her at 13 I didn't see her as a mother. I felt that I didn't need a "mom" at that point. I was pretty much raised and my grandmothers had did a d@mn good job of it. My mom also felt she had no right to parent me so we developed a sister or friend type relationship. That parental disconnect made for some very interesting dynamics and baffled most people looking in.

Now for the harder point. Again much has been said about the possibility of Lyric being used as a "mule". Both of my parents were involved with drugs, using and selling (growing on one side). Because they dealt in different types of illegals (pot & pills) they liked to trade between the two sets (to further own up to the dysfunction I was raised in my parents married a set of exes). Anyway their favorite way of trading was to put stuff in my brothers' bags as they traded them for weekend visits. My brothers were 10 & 11 when this started and by the time the boys were 12/13 they knew what was going on and were starting to take small amounts out before they handed over their bags.

O/T because I am in no way suggesting this applies to L & E but I just want to share the lasting effects of this. Neither of the boys were 18 when they were busted for having robbed nearly every drug store in 2 counties. At 33/34 they have fathered 8 daughters and never been out of jail for more than 2 years at a time because they can't kick the drug habit they developed more than 2 decades ago thanks to our parents.

Further O/T. I have never gotten anything other than a speeding ticket nor have I ever experimented with drugs. My ex-SIL is one of my best friends and her theory is that I watched my parents fail miserably and learnt exactly what not to do. I lost my dad 6 years ago and while I love and miss him terribly I have always struggled to have a relationship with him and my mother.

I can't believe I'm sharing all this and please know it isn't for sympathy but simply because I think it is nearly impossible for the average person to really grasp that this sort of thing happens. We bat it around in theory but we want to believe that it is so far fetched that it is impossible. It happens far more often than we realize and in families that you would never expect, my dad was a respected, business owner from an upstanding, very religious family.

Now other than MCM's behavior I have no idea if any of this applies to L & E. I have no reason to believe Lyric was being used as a mule or if it is relevant to her abduction even if she was. I have felt from the beginning that the girls are very close to home. I rarely have gut feelings about these cases but I think these girls were lured away by a friendly face and were taken to a nearby home. It won't surprise me if a teenager is involved here. The only thing that gives me pause is the fact that they haven't been found yet. I keep thinking back to the case where the neighbor boy hid the little girl under his bed - teens generally don't hide their victims well so where are these girls?


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Thank you for sharing your unique perspective.

We've often discussed the theory that the girls went to the lake to meet up with someone. I suppose a teenager could be involved. That's what is so frustrating, IMO - there is just so little information to go on. :banghead:

Please continue posting.