ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 57

[chrisinmd]

A previous poster (hard to keep up, I know) suggested it was BK who said "it's okay, I'm going to help you" to Murphy the dog, which I think (imo) is a great suggestion.

That is possible as well. But in discussions earlier in this thread suggest the dog was locked in room the whole time and never interacted with killer

 

[pittsburghgirl]

MOO — when a late night food delivery arrives, I’m more likely to say “the food is here” than “there is someone here.” Even just “FOOD!” or “Door Dash.” Of course, this doesn’t mean anything and I can’t project that behavior upon anyone else. This is another aspect of that evening I’m anxiously awaiting more details on, to complete the timeline of what we already know.

I do think the Door Dash delivery was probably one reason why the surviving witness wasn't absolutely sure something bad was going on. People coming in late, the dog barking, people talking---all of that was a lot going on that could be just normal. The Door Dash delivery established that the night's normal "comings and goings" weren't over. Someone trying to sleep through the commotion might default cognitively to "it's normal--Door Dash was just here."

 

[CSIDreamer]

I have been pondering his awareness of her presence both before and after the murders. He walked toward her, then right past her.

Her story is eerily reminiscent of Nita Neary's. Ted Bundy walked right past Nita Neary on his way out of the Chi Omega house in strangely similar circumstancs. He even paused at the door as she stared at him, before slinking off into the night.

Something else I've been thinking about is the lighting. I guess I have a unique skill set in some ways. It's almost impossible to see someone's face in the night with backlighting only. Due to my circumstances BK would have had to be under some light source or had a light source in front of him, no matter how dim or the source. Im assuming between a source in front of him and concentrating his attention on his exit path, he never saw her peering at him. JMO

 

[gizmobtj]

Thank you CSIDreamer!

1. I do not necessarily agree with this one.

The PCA on the bottom of page 1 states:
As I approached the room, I could see a body, later identified as Kemodle's, laying on the floor.
[...]
Also in the room was a male, later identified as Ethan Chapin [...]

This sounds as though the body can be seen on approach to the room. In this context, "also" could mean "in addition to this" or "following on from this", as opposed to only meaning "also" as in "as well as".

I do not believe it is 100% that X was in the bedroom on this basis.

2. True. Perhaps he didn't mind if she did, as perhaps his intention was to leave some witnesses alive. JMO

I've had to skip numerous posts myself over the past few days so you may not know the whole bedroom or not was discussed extensively last night. So, I'm not going to go there past what I said.

It might be awkwardly worded but I think @CSIDreamer is right, @thoughts101 . Right after talking about Xana's body, the affiant writes "Also in the room was a male, later identified as Ethan Chapin." I think the relevance is Xana could be seen from the hallway and Ethan could not be

 

[10ofRods]

I would like to know everyone's opinions on the August 21 traffic stop when BK was by the Kings Road residence. Did a neighbor call in a suspicious vehicle that was spending a lot of time in the area? Did BK simply draw a patrolling officer's attention? Is it known if he was cited for a violation?

From the affadavit:

One of these occasions, on August 21, 2022, the 8458 phone utilized cellular resources providing coverage to the King Road residence from approximately 10:34 pm to 11:35 pm. At approximately 11:37 pm., Kohberger was stopped by Latah County Sheriff's Deputy CPL Duke as mentioned above. The 8548 phone was utilizing cellular resources consistent with the location of the traffic stop during this time (Farm Road and Pullman Highway).

I'll go out on a limb and say that out-of-state plates do seem to up the chances of being stopped, especially if away from an interstate and in a small town. We've been stopped for minor things (one tail light out caused three stops in Arizona and Utah before we could locate a bulb in Vegas and head over there to fix it). I've been stopped 4X in Arizona in the past 6-7 years, for example, and not once in the state where my plates are from.

I'm guessing he was driving around in some manner that LE found suspicious and he had that out of state plate, maybe his WSU parking sticker.

Someone suggested BK was in the neighborhood to buy drugs, but IMO, it would be the opposite. Moscow PD has a zero tolerance policy for drugs. Idaho is still very bent on cannabis suppression. The list of people in jail in Moscow includes maybe 5-6 in for possession of cannabis-related paraphernalia, probably from a traffic stop that led to probable cause.

But Pullman, where BK lives, has dispensaries and advertisements for buying cannabis. One needs to be a resident of WA, I believe, to legally buy in Pullman, but it is the Pullman students who sell drugs to the U of ID students, IMO, after weeks of reading student forums and SM media posts. Moscow PD knows this.

And it would not surprise me if BK ingratiated himself into U of ID student life by being "that older guy" who always had bud to sell. Hangs around bars and parties, etc.

 

[JohnBull]

The limits of planning in any kind of conflict have been described by a number of military theorists as something like: No plan survives first contact with the enemy. Mike Tyson, the boxer, put it this way: “Everybody has plans until they get hit for the first time”.

So BK could have done all sorts of planning--from what to do with his cell phone to his routes for getting to the house and escaping the crime scene--that has turned out to be not very smart. But no matter how many scenarios he ran in his head as he planned and envisioned the attacks, his plans were almost certainly not going to describe the real life situation of multiple murder in small spaces, with actual humans who in some cases could fight back and make noise, with a dog that started barking and probably disrupted his mental time line. Even if his plan seemed flawless to him on paper, it would not have survived the reality of murdering four people. My opinion only, of course.

Your opinion, and also the opinion of many others. There's a popular expression, too vulgar to repeat here, but which can be paraphrased as "situations transpire."

 

[rsd1200]

Ted Williams, Fox News.

Thanks! Not really much of a news watcher here.

 

[DianeElaine]

Something I’ve been wondering about— with all the effort (and motion) it would take to kill two people with a knife, two people in a twin bed—and then for the knife sheath to be found lying next to one of the bodies on the bed—that’s just not much space for all this to have happened on. I find it surprising both girls were found in the bed (as opposed to at least one on the floor), and that the sheath wasn’t on the floor. They must have died or been totally incapacitated very, very quickly and didn’t get a chance to move around very much during the attack.

It must have been an incredibly furious attack. It’s sickening to think about. I hope he gets what’s coming to him in short order.

 

[rsd1200]

It might be awkwardly worded but I think @CSIDreamer is right, @thoughts101 . Right after talking about Xana's body, the affiant writes "Also in the room was a male, later identified as Ethan Chapin." I think the relevance is Xana could be seen from the hallway and Ethan could not be

Her body was also on the floor. I found that relevant.

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/122922%20Affidavit%20-%20Exhibit%20A%20-%20Statement%20of%20Brett%20Payne.pdf

Link to Exhibit A

 

[RANCH]

Here's a photo of my Ka-Bar sheath showing the stitching and eight rivets holding it together. The top three rivets hold belt loop in place.

 

[bestill]

"I think the treasure trove is in that apartment and in the car," former FBI agent Jennifer Coffindaffer told Newsweek on Friday. "In my experience you just really can't hide blood evidence, it sinks in. Just imagine the upholstery of your car, the gas pedal....I know he was probably gloved, we know he was covered all in black in terms of his face and all, but he would have been bloody."

Bryan Kohberger's home could have "treasure trove" of DNA: Ex-FBI agent

In addition to DNA evidence, former FBI agent Jennifer Coffindaffer told Newsweek that digital evidence could also be found on his electronic devices.

www.newsweek.com

We know he had bloody shoes because he left a print in the house.

 

[BUF]

But why would X say that to mean the DoorDash delivery? That makes no sense to me since she would have placed the order (I believe?) and would know who the person was at the door. I think it could have been X saying it in the living room as she noticed the perp in the house, exiting through the kitchen or otherwise. I believe it was audible to DM because it was a phrase that was being said by X in the living room.

It could be that Xana was in the living room on her phone waiting for the DoorDash to arrive, saw the car headlights pull up to the front of the house from the window in the living room.

jmo

 

[gizmobtj]

How did he know the sliding door would be unlocked?

1. Could have done surveillance
2. May have planned to try and if it did not work, try another night
3. Could have had a plan to break it open
Etc, etc.

In other words, there is nothing to say he either knew or needed to know

 

[gizmobtj]

We know he had bloody shoes because he left a print in the house.

Or that someone did. The PCA appears deliberately vague beyond that being potentially consistent with the roommate's story (I am guessing, but it does not say, they know the people in the house, investigators and paramedics were not wearing Vans)

 

[TheGardener]

The limits of planning in any kind of conflict have been described by a number of military theorists as something like: No plan survives first contact with the enemy. Mike Tyson, the boxer, put it this way: “Everybody has plans until they get hit for the first time”.

So BK could have done all sorts of planning--from what to do with his cell phone to his routes for getting to the house and escaping the crime scene--that has turned out to be not very smart. But no matter how many scenarios he ran in his head as he planned and envisioned the attacks, his plans were almost certainly not going to describe the real life situation of multiple murder in small spaces, with actual humans who in some cases could fight back and make noise, with a dog that started barking and probably disrupted his mental time line. Even if his plan seemed flawless to him on paper, it would not have survived the reality of murdering four people. My opinion only, of course.

Excellent and definitely NOT your own opinion. Again, I return to John Douglas (FBI Behavioral Science). He describes these kinds of murderers as fantasists who meticulously devise their fantasies over a period of years.They construct these fantasies a thread at a time until they idolize their concept and build their world around them. He also notes that more often then not, they have no plan in place post murder, which oftentimes results in mistakes that lead to their capture. He may murder, but foolishly transport a body in the passenger seat of his car, at 3:00 a.m., on a well traveled road, with the intention of disposing the body over a bridge or dumping it on the side of the road and driving off - and be caught red-handed by a patrolman looking to write a ticket for a broken tail light. He may successfully murder, but leave handprints and footprints all over the crime scene along with a knife sheath. He may return to his crime scene to clean up his mistakes or soak in the chaos he's created. All of these behaviors are devised incrementally and surreptitiously post murder and have nothing to do with the fantasy developed over time and pre-murder- it is stark reality confronted haphazardly when the killer is most vulnerable.

 

[thoughts101]

It might be awkwardly worded but I think @CSIDreamer is right, @thoughts101 . Right after talking about Xana's body, the affiant writes "Also in the room was a male, later identified as Ethan Chapin." I think the relevance is Xana could be seen from the hallway and Ethan could not be

Sure, although if she was in the room fully that that would surely be more clearly stated. I really believe based on the wording of the PCA that she was found in the entrance to the bedroom, near the bathroom, or similar. I hope that the court case provides more information.

 

[10ofRods]

IMO and in accordance with the PCA, on the night of the murders it was probably not the first time he had been there, tried the door, or inside the property. MOO

Agreed. This guy is a creeper, IMO. He lurks around the fringes of other people's lives, being pretty much an isolated, asocial person himself. I find it very hard to believe that Nov 12-13 was the first time he put himself in the mind of a criminal and acted out. He worked up to it. I don't know if there will ever be evidence of him being in the house before, as I do not think he could easily have joined in a mostly Greek life house party (but maybe - and there were other parties in that same neighborhood frequently). If it's true that the slider was rarely locked, and if the students went to school as students do, he might have gone in during the day and had a good look around - how else does he know where to go to find people in that house?

 

[The Scarecrow]

Here's a photo of my Ka-Bar sheath showing the stitching and eight rivets holding it together. The top three rivets hold belt loop in place. View attachment 393536

I don't see a loop in which a belt would be passed through.

 

[Speculaytor]

I do think the Door Dash delivery was probably one reason why the surviving witness wasn't absolutely sure something bad was going on. People coming in late, the dog barking, people talking---all of that was a lot going on that could be just normal. The Door Dash delivery established that the nights normal "comings and goings" weren't over. Someone trying to sleep through the commotion might default cognitively to "it's normal--Door Dash was just here."

That would be true had she not froze in fear. The freezing in fear tells me she was, her brain was, well aware of the danger.

 

[schooling]

The limits of planning in any kind of conflict have been described by a number of military theorists as something like: No plan survives first contact with the enemy. Mike Tyson, the boxer, put it this way: “Everybody has plans until they get hit for the first time”.

So BK could have done all sorts of planning--from what to do with his cell phone to his routes for getting to the house and escaping the crime scene--that has turned out to be not very smart. But no matter how many scenarios he ran in his head as he planned and envisioned the attacks, his plans were almost certainly not going to describe the real life situation of multiple murder in small spaces, with actual humans who in some cases could fight back and make noise, with a dog that started barking and probably disrupted his mental time line. Even if his plan seemed flawless to him on paper, it would not have survived the reality of murdering four people. My opinion only, of course.

I don’t think his plan going awry surprised him though. If you notice his research questions they are specifically formed to address this.

He realized that no matter how much you plan you’ll never be able to account for the variability from the victims and your own mental state in the heat of the actual crime.

And ultimately he wasn’t able to.

I’ve said it before but I think the “I’m here to help” (paraphrasing) was a result of some of this planning and trying to control the victim.

Also, not to be pedantic but it’s “everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth”. Which means exactly what you quoted it as but much much less eloquent which gives it that extra Tyson charm.