ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 67

[LAHOLLA]

I had wondered in a previous thread if the search warrant was initially sealed bc it contained info relating to a possible accomplice.

I LOVE being completely wrong about that

(I was initially bummed about the short list of items seized but then remembered he had 6 weeks to clean, destroy, conceal.)

 

[drmrgrl]

It goes both ways. I have seen acquittals that amount to outright juror nullification in some famous cases. But I have seen a lot of post-conviction juror interviews in which it is clear that they were weighing the evidence like it's a civil case - by a preponderance of evidence, rather than truly beyond a reasonable doubt. In some cases, they have even expressed reasonable doubts in their interviews after they voted to convict someone.

I think it's far more common than acknowledged that there is an attitude that the defendant must be quilty or they wouldn't be charging them. Decent citizens tend to side with LE over those accused of despicable crimes, it's just human nature. But the large number of post-conviction exonerations should weigh heavily on all of us, justice is never served by convicting innocent people.

JMHO

IMO, I wouldn’t want to be a juror on this case.no way.

My impression was that these cuttings were made from the pillowcase that was on his pillow. Could be mistaken, though. Zodiac cut bloody pieces of one victim's shirt and later mailed them to the newspaper.

iMO, yes he did. He shot and killed taxi driver Paul Stine on the corner of Washington and Cherry Streets in Presidio Heights. He proceeded to cut off the tail of Stines striped shirt.

 

[Fontaine]

Well sure. We don't have top sheets at my house. But NO sheets (or TOWELS) at all? (The towels are a big deal for me). He showered without towels and this is a new thing?

Okay. So tear up the plumbing (which should be done anyway).

No pillow cases, no sheets (but mattress covers, which are not as easily washed as a bottom sheet, which is why we have bottom sheets). No TOWELS. Apparently no dark clothing, either.

The more that's missing from a potential crime scene, the more the investigators should use simple and basic procedures (such as taking out the plumbing - which has been helpful in many other cases).

I hope he ends up embarrassed by what they *do* find on his mattress cover. And having it revealed to the world that he doesn't use towels (or a shower curtain). Women have had their underwear taken and analyzed (as rape victims - and indeed, I think that's why the defense wanted those mattresses from 1122 King).

Analyze HIS underwear. Or no underwear, either? No dark clothes, no underwear, no towels. If I'm a juror, this does not remove all doubt, but it sure is hinky and makes everything else look even worse. Did he never wash his hands and dry them off? Did he use paper towels to dry? Towels WITHOUT blood evidence would help him, but no towels at all is weird.

Maybe he will explain no linens or towels with: he asked for new towels and sheets for Christmas so he got rid of his old ones before he went home for the holidays. Just a thought.

 

[10ofRods]

IMO, correct me If I am wrong, but hair or fur with a root is a good thing because mitochondrial dna can be extracted from such. If there is no root, only nuclear dna can be extracted, correct?

It’s the opposite.

 

[Which_pancake]

After reading this Read Bryan Kohberger search warrant: New details about Idaho murder case

I’m feeling uneasy about one part in particular. “cuttings from an uncased pillow of a "reddish/brown stain," according to the warrant.

Makes my heart hurt. Could he have possibly cut out a piece of one of the girls’s pillow cases stained in her blood and kept it as a killing souvenir? I seriously don’t put this past him at all! I could be way off as well, but it was the first thing that came to mind.

Huge shoutout to @Zella for getting me caught up

I think it means LE took a cutting from a pillow at BKs house. If they had just found a stained piece of cloth there, they wouldn't have known it was from a pillow necessarily. JMO

 

[jepop]

I'll spare linking GQ and other lifestyle magazines, but it just occurred to me that it's a common belief in BK's age group that "top sheets are overrated." Moreover, there is the joke / meme that young, single men live in squalor and have mattresses on the floor, instead of a bed frame. If BK had sparse bedding, or only a mattress pad and like a quilt (no sheets), that might not have been THAT unusual... IMO, and food for thought. Could explain the lack of linen taken during the execution of the warrant.

The crime was committed six weeks prior, there was a lot of time to clean up IMO. Some relevant patches of linen were taken IIRC. MOO

 

[Elley Mae]

Appears the black nitrile gloves are thicker.

Nitrile Glove Thickness Chart

When you need a glove to get the job done, how do you choose? It’s easy to think that disposable gloves don’t require much thought. After all, you’ll pull them on for a quick task and then take them off. In theory, any glove could do the job. In practice, though, various qualities of the glove...

www.gloves.com

Glove thickness is generally measured in mils, where 1 mil = 0.001” gauge. A glove of 2 mil and below is considered thin, while gloves above 2 mil are generally considered thicker. Gloves at 4 mil (like our black nitrile gloves) or 6 mil (like our 6 mil black nitrile gloves) are quite thick, with the highest tensile strength.

 

[LAHOLLA]

I'll spare linking GQ and other lifestyle magazines, but it just occurred to me that it's a common belief in BK's age group that "top sheets are overrated." Moreover, there is the joke / meme that young, single men live in squalor and have mattresses on the floor, instead of a bed frame. If BK had sparse bedding, or only a mattress pad and like a quilt (no sheets), that might not have been THAT unusual... IMO, and food for thought. Could explain the lack of linen taken during the execution of the warrant.

If my 28 year old son has sheets on his bed- I'll be shocked. Granted, he's very ADHD (gets it from his momma ) but he never typically takes the time to focus on things like that.

 

[kbckcern22]

I think it means LE took a cutting from a pillow at BKs house. If they had just found a stained piece of cloth there, they wouldn't have known it was from a pillow necessarily. JMO

My thought process went to maybe there was a piece missing from the Victims house and then there was a piece similar found at bk’s with a blood stain. It makes more sense after a lot of people said they took the cutting for the stain lol!!! But you know, wishful thinking to have evidence that good!

 

[ilovewings]

They keep referring to the glove as "nitrite." Don't they mean nitrile or is that how it's spelled in the warrant?

I believe it is a typo

 

[jepop]

It goes both ways. I have seen acquittals that amount to outright juror nullification in some famous cases. But I have seen a lot of post-conviction juror interviews in which it is clear that they were weighing the evidence like it's a civil case - by a preponderance of evidence, rather than truly beyond a reasonable doubt. In some cases, they have even expressed reasonable doubts in their interviews after they voted to convict someone.

I think it's far more common than acknowledged that there is an attitude that the defendant must be quilty or they wouldn't be charging them. Decent citizens tend to side with LE over those accused of despicable crimes, it's just human nature. But the large number of post-conviction exonerations should weigh heavily on all of us, justice is never served by convicting innocent people.

JMHO

I think unconscious bias can be a huge issue with juries (and all of us)...despite the evidence, emotional bias and even emotional needs can pull a person to fit evidence to the bias and the need. MOO. I think it's important to have a highly experienced judge with an impeccable record of impartiality to direct a jury and explain to a jury very explicitly that their personal and gut reactions to a defendent must be put to one side. In an ideal world MOO off topic.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Regarding the discussion of him not owning sheets and towels.

The search warrant was pretty specific. It did not direct anyone to seize "sheets and towels". They took certain bedding pieces (or cuttings) that had stains or evidently tested presumptive for blood.

You can't just go in and take items outside the scope of the warrant.

The assumption he had no sheets or towels is growing wings here when we have absolutely no idea what was left in his apartment vs what was legally seized in compliance with the search warrant.

JMO

 

[newredtabby]

IMO, maybe BK snuck a load of laundry in at his apt after the murders and it’s still sitting in the dryer? Except for his socks. As we all know socks disappear in the dryer.

You think he left his clothes in a dryer for a month and a half?

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

One could also argue that putting trash in a neighbor’s bin shows that he is sneaky.

That wasn't what OP was questioning.

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

He was probably just throwing out the trash because his parents told him to.

Either way, it's not a statement on his cleanliness.

 

[newredtabby]

Police also found shoes with diamond-pattern soles — matching footprints found at the murder scene — as well as “data compilations” of information about the victims.

Search warrants for accused Idaho killer Bryan Kohberger’s home unsealed

Washington State University Police recovered a possibly blood-stained mattress cover, human hairs, a glove and a computer from University of Idaho murder suspect Bryan Kohberger’s apartment, accord…

nypost.com

I think they meant "searched for shoes and data". No source cited for "found".
<modsnip - disparaging comment about an approved source>

 

[jepop]

{snipped for focus]

I'm going back and forth. Today's 'unsealed' warrant info is relatively damning, though consistent with the entire episode, inconclusive, perhaps? The coupling of cell and video, and the various routes, and times etc., seem more than coincidental, but maybe not. If the details of the probable cause and warrant docs are accurate I'm beginning to feel that he did. What I'm having the most trouble understanding is why? I haven't read yet much that I'm inclined to accept. Also, I'm not sure why, but I'm sort of hoping he didn't - although obviously someone did it...

YEs, to me the motive is elusive and only he knows why. I think because motive is at this point unfathomable or maybe I mean it's possibly going to be a motive that will not be easily relatable to most people, maybe that is sensed by people...well I think in that space of the unknown we turn to the evidence and the how of the crime and perhaps some begin to see the evidence as a 'non fit' so as to explain the lack of motive...so if he didn't do it (the how) then we no longer have to sit with this unknown of motive. MOO and I know this probably makes little sense..spitballing is the term from what I've learnt recently. MOO

 

[jepop]

Regarding the discussion of him not owning sheets and towels.

The search warrant was pretty specific. It did not direct anyone to seize "sheets and towels". They took certain bedding pieces (or cuttings) that had stains or evidently tested presumptive for blood.

You can't just go in and take items outside the scope of the warrant.

The assumption he had no sheets or towels is growing wings here when we have absolutely no idea what was left in his apartment vs what was legally seized in compliance with the search warrant.

JMO

BBM Thank you!

 

[jepop]

I think they meant "searched for shoes and data". No source cited for "found". <modsnip - disparaging comment about an approved source>

They made it up MOO. It's stated as fact and it so is not fact.

 

[Pink2017]

No Vans listed on the search warrant document, or any other kind of shoes, but I feel like it's pretty likely that if he is the murderer he ditched the shoes or brought them home / cleaned them and continued to wear them. IMO

I suspect he took off shoes before he got into his car along with the cover suit. Bagged it and made a run for it from there.