ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 15

[GGbankster]

Re-looking at the floorplan with the correct stairs made me think again (sorry, could not quote it, maybe because it was only quote and attachment) about an aspect I have neglected for week(s) now: did the murderer at any point enter the empty bedroom on the 2nd floor?

MOO: If he entered through the 2nd floor patio door and he took stairs between the 2nd and 3rd floor, then it would have been quite odd to skip that bedroom unless he knew 100% that it's empty and/or the 2nd floor people were originally meant to survive. Obviously, depending on the level of stalking, a stranger might be pretty sure about nobody having entered that room, too. But would the stranger not even check, just in case? It is hopefully know to LE if he did or did not enter that room, I have no idea, but just something that stares at me on the plan. I personally would not go to the 3rd floor to kill people if someone right next to my narrow exit path might wake up and surprise me as I come back down.

Similarly, the other questions: did he at any moment enter or try to enter the 1st floor?
And how long did he spend in the house?

MOO: I have no answers nor theories about any of that atm - just something that keeps bugging me. For example, the movements as described with the if's before, they kinda feel off with the "stranger goes to the 3rd floor, E/X hears something, E & X get killed for that reason" theory. I would expect one to watch his back more, so to say. Maybe the movements are wrong, maybe the stranger targeting 3rd floor is wrong. But maybe it's just the level of rage. Argh, the more I think the less ideas I have.

Moo, This floor plan is what reinforces my belief that this was a targeted killing. If the killer had entered an unlocked door, he would have to deliberately make a left, and then another left (basement stairs visible) to go to X and Es bedroom. Same with going to the third floor- an effort were made to get to these rooms. It also makes sense why it’s likely that no one from each floors may have heard anything.

 

[Justice101]

reading the updates... thanks

 

[CityKid]

If a ring camera caught M&K returning home at 1:56 Sunday morning, did it also catch the other 4 when they returned home?
Where is the camera located and what area did it cover?
Did it catch other friends coming and going earlier in the evening?
Did it catch someone going in but not leaving?
If LE could see some of the comings and goings at that house on Saturday evening, but did not see anyone that they believe to be the killer, it stands to reason that he came and went by the area of the house not captured by the camera.
Wouldn’t that at least set them on the direction of his escape route?

I mentioned this a couple of days ago. I hope the police have the Ring video; I speculated perhaps someone else got out of the car with M and K, or the car might be seen on video leaving, then coming back. MOO

 

[Skigirl]

I have been studying the area that Moscow PD has requested video footage from:

West Taylor Ave (north boundary)
West Palouse River Dr (south boundary)
Highway 95 south to the 2700 block of Highway 95 S (east boundary)
Arboretum & Botanical Garden (west boundary)

A couple of things stood out to me:
They are basically looking at the area south of the university and not including the University itself. Is it because there are enough cameras on campus that they didn’t need any more footage or they didn’t spot any unusual movement there?
The north boundary of the area they are looking at is Taylor Rd. This is the road that runs between Greek Row and the victims‘ home.
The west boundary is the Arboretum/Botanical Gardens
The south boundary, W Palouse River Dr, is basically the southernmost east-west road in town.
The east boundary is Highway 95 S. This makes sense and squares off the area EXCEPT they want footage that goes all the way down 95S past W Palouse River Dr to the 2700 block. This is at the approximate location of Wasankari Construction which is at 2730.
When Moscow PD released their map, they showed a squared off area, but they weren’t showing W Palouse River Dr as the southern boundary. Why? Granted the 2700 block is less than a mile from the intersection but I think something, a vehicle, has caught their eye on 95 south of town and they are trying to track its movements that night.
Does Wasankari Construction have a video camera that showed something that caught their interest that night; a vehicle that may have been observed one or more times between 3:00 am and 6:00 am near the crime scene and then seen heading south out of town on Hwy 95?
I’ve attached 2 maps; the one released by Moscow PD and one I drew to explain what I am trying to say. As they say, a picture is worth a thousand words.
Thoughts?

The map also struck me as interesting. I thought it was notable that the Northern boundary is so close to the house. You would think if they were just trying to cast a net, it would have been in a square area with the house in the center (barring any natural barriers, like mountains or bodies of water). Instead, the area is all south of the house. I wondered if they had footage of someone leaving the area, so a general direction was known, but they were looking for better/clearer images (I was actually thinking that the person was on foot, but it would also make sense that LE might be looking for a vehicle heading onto Hwy 95.)

 

[livewiiiiire]

Did the authorities say whether all 4 students were killed immediately? I hate to think that they could have been saved, but with 9 or so hours between the stabbing and when police arrived….ugh

From what the coroner said, they all had a fatal blow to the chest area among the wounds. What that means to me is that they were killed basically immediately, but I don't know that for a fact, and the coroner has been somewhat inconsistent with her public statements IMO. Happy to find a link to her first interview where she said this if needed

 

[JSTANOVICE]

Clever observation! Maybe that's why they call this case complex.

I really hope they can find killers DNA mixed with blood of victims to place him there during the actual murder. However I think it was OJ had this evidence but he still got off!

If They find DNA then they at least have someone, he can say he was there many times, but having A POI is A start, They can grill him to no end And Slowley build there Case and if they’re certain he’s then one, even release his name, First thing they need is DNA

 

[laust23]

I mentioned this the other day aswell.

Wondering if investigators considered looking into any of the previous tenants that lived in the house. After all, they would know the layout, how to get around, etc and may have had interactions with each other previously.

Also, hate to say this but there can be corruption within sometimes. Wondering if any LE are being investigated and/or LE's family members.

 

[JSTANOVICE]

I’m Curious The Dive bar the girls were at that sat nite, No Cameras? Most pubs even dive bars Have remote cameras these days for obvious reasons, Has anyone looked into this

 

[cara23]

Curious now about the restaurant X & M worked at and if there were any back of house/front of house issues. I worked in food service for years and there were many times I was made to feel uncomfortable by staff in the kitchen - one man cornered me and whispered "i just got out of Leavenworth so be careful" Many people are hired and paid under the table and many line cooks have felonies. This is just speculation.

 

[Jealoushe]

im sure they have an accurate time of death cuz the girls ate

I believe this science is no longer considered accurate?

 

[Miss Jennifer]

IMHO, you would also need to look at the population of male students at the private college in Moscow as well as at WSU, if you think the quadruple murderer is a student since they all mingle to some extent. Moo.

Good point. I presumed that the suspect, which I believe to be a male student with a hunting license, was close to the victims and attended the same university. I'll factor this into my search and follow up with new data once I find it.

 

[Bliss_Perth]

If a ring camera caught M&K returning home at 1:56 Sunday morning, did it also catch the other 4 when they returned home?
Where is the camera located and what area did it cover?
Did it catch other friends coming and going earlier in the evening?
Did it catch someone going in but not leaving?
If LE could see some of the comings and goings at that house on Saturday evening, but did not see anyone that they believe to be the killer, it stands to reason that he came and went by the area of the house not captured by the camera.
Wouldn’t that at least set them on the direction of his escape route?

I'm really curious about the ring camera, seems only Kaylee's sister knows about it and nobody else can find it. I watched a very thorough video of someone walking around that area and they couldn't locate a camera.

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

That has not been confirmed by LE so should be taken with a grain of salt, IMHO:
King Road Homicides | Moscow, ID

 

[PriorTheCreator]

DBM
(thanks!)

 

[isabella88]

I’m Curious The Dive bar the girls were at that sat nite, No Cameras? Most pubs even dive bars Have remote cameras these days for obvious reasons, Has anyone looked into this

Haven't heard anything yet, but fingers crossed that the cameras were in working order that night. I'm sure LE is on top of that.

 

[PriorTheCreator]

Idaho students' killer may be an "incel" who felt rejected—psychiatrist
Lieberman said the killer could be someone who felt rejected by one of the victims. "Perhaps some would-be suitor of Kaylee Goncalves and Madison Mogen, who felt that the girls were out of their league, felt rejected, whether they had approached them or just looked on from afar," she said.

 

[gliving]

• In an interview with DailyMail.com, Idaho State Police spokesman Aaron Snell, 49, said it is possible all four victims could have been targeted
• 'We still believe it was a targeted attack based on the evidence at the scene and how everything developed, what we know. We believe that's accurate,' he said
• But Snell admitted police are still no closer to identifying a murderer and refused to say which of the victims is believed to be the target
• He said: 'That's a real delicate question and when we're able to say that or if we're able to say that, we'll definitely do that'
• Police are also still unable to corroborate claims that victim Kaylee Goncalves, 21, may have had a stalker
• Goncalves's pet dog Murphy was home at the time of the slayings and is now living with her ex-boyfriend (JD) and his family in Coeur D'Alene, Idaho
• Seen in exclusive DailyMail.com photos, red-haired (JD), 22, had dated Kaylee for six years and was possibly the last person to speak with her
• He has been ruled out as a suspect and has been too heartbroken to speak, with his mom telling DailyMail.com that the family intends to stay silent out of respect

"Snell said the theory plays into the notion that one of the four was targeted but refused to say which of the victims police believe to be the target, describing it as a 'delicate question'.

He said: 'That's part of the ongoing investigation. That's a real delicate question and when we're able to say that or if we're able to say that, we'll definitely do that."

Idaho police can't corroborate claims that victim had a stalker

Police investigating the stabbing deaths of four University of Idaho students have insisted at least one of the victims was targeted - but refuse to say which of the friends could have been the focus.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Lots of photos at link

 

[isabella88]

I believe this science is no longer considered accurate?

IIRC, I've seen stomach contents in cases recently but it is far from an exact science. Lots of things, like alcohol and drugs, can impact digestion.

 

[MsBetsy]

Did the authorities say whether all 4 students were killed immediately? I hate to think that they could have been saved, but with 9 or so hours between the stabbing and when police arrived….ugh

They didn't say but I think it would have been fast since the victims were stabbed multiple times. We don't know whether that means 5 times or 20 but I doubt they could have been saved with those kinds of injuries and the type of knife used.

 

[Charlot123]

Cops are upset that the other roommates called their friends before 911.

Moscow, Idaho community on edge as students return from break, police see more 911 calls pouring in

University of Idaho students Ethan Chapin, 20; Kaylee Goncalves, 21; Xana Kernodle, 20; and 21-year-old Madison Mogen were stabbed several times and killed on November 13.

www.foxnews.com

That speaks volumes about trust in LE. I just checked CNN and the story is no longer in the home page. Fox has it as the third headline but only to say that now that students are back there are a lot of tips. I think it is either a young student who will be caught this semester or it is a juvenile or young neighborhood kid who frequents the woods. He may steal their alcohol or other party items and may be very familiar with breaking into that house. We need footprint analysis and what direction the perp headed when he left the house. His height and weight will also be available from that.

I am not sure anyone was targeted. Whoever resisted most might have invited more anger, but it doesn’t mean, targeted. I don’t see the reason to kill four people if you are after one. Maybe the guy was so cold-hearted that he needed one, killed the other one in the room, and the other two, to complicate matters for the police?

But if someone was, it really makes sense to think of people permanently living in the house. To kill a man in his GF’s room is very mafia-like style, sorry. And really, it takes a lot of stalking.

To kill a person who randomly stopped at the house, like K, “now or never” style, takes a lot of preparation.

The other two girls are more traceable because they live there.

I can imagine someone hiding in the house in advance, but not dressed for murder. I think he walked in. JMO. Good luck to Idaho police and FBI.