ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 18

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After more thoughts about this case i think maybe E was the target or E and X. I think maybe something happened at the party they went to and it escalated from there. I’m hoping if this is the case I hope those who witnessed anything talk to the police. I think something happened in the 4 hours unaccounted for and more than one person was involved. These are what my thoughts are atm and may change as the investigation moves forward. I don’t think it was a stranger who did this and think the victims knew the killers.
 
(November 30, 2022)

  • Conflicting information has been released over the past 24 hours. The Latah County Prosecutor’s Office stated the suspect(s) specifically looked at this residence, and that one or more of the occupants were undoubtedly targeted.
    We have spoken with the Latah County Prosecutor’s Office and identified this was a miscommunication. Detectives do not currently know if the residence or any occupants were specifically targeted but continue to investigate.
Yes, and In between the initial statement and the revised one @Tippy Lynn mentions above, the DA in an interview earlier this week said “targeting” was probably not the best word—the house was targeted rather than a particular individual. Then yesterday LE released a “clarification” saying the DA (who’s no longer giving interviews) essentially mispoke and the attack was targeted towards one particular victim. Hours later a clarification of that clarification was released saying that the attack wasn’t targeted.

Have a gander through yesterday’s posts for details. It’s been quite the PR roller coaster ride.

Edited for clarity
 
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Let's be real. If you're not already extra vigilant against crime, you need to start being extra vigilant against crime. If LE doesn't want certain information to be known about a crime, they need to keep that information to themselves. If a family member or witness has information about a crime, LE should expect that information will be shared at some point.
 
I have several thoughts regarding the 3 AM police call to the lawn in front of the frat house, just a stone's throw from the crime scene. I think there is a high likelihood that this is relevant to the crime scene investigation.

First, at least 2 of the deceased were in that frat house at least part of the night and 1 of them lived in it and had a brother who also lived in it.

Second, the time coincides almost exactly with the window during which the murders are said to have been committed. How odd that LE would be mere seconds away from the crime scene at the exact time a quadruple homicide is taking place within line of sight. At the very least, one might assume the police presence and commotion could have impacted the killer's plans. It's also possible given the 2-5 crime window LE released at one point that the perp could even have been at the location to which police were called.

Third, is it possible that during the gap in E&X's timeline, the frat party had spilled over to the crime scene and that multiple friends joined them within the house? Is it possible that some of these were with the survivors in the basement? Or that maybe everyone left the house headed for the frat house, but someone lingered behind hidden to commit the murders?
 
After more thoughts about this case i think maybe E was the target or E and X. I think maybe something happened at the party they went to and it escalated from there. I’m hoping if this is the case I hope those who witnessed anything talk to the police. I think something happened in the 4 hours unaccounted for and more than one person was involved. These are what my thoughts are atm and may change as the investigation moves forward. I don’t think it was a stranger who did this and think the victims knew the killers.
If something happened at the party there would have been witnesses to the altercation. If so, I have no doubt this would have leaked out to the public by now. “Blank Blank was arguing with Blank Blank!” and so forth.
 
....There’s some things that don’t add up. I’ve rented a basement apartment. You hear everything!
I think that depends on the acoustics of the house. We have a walk out basement. From the living room, I can easily hear conversations down there. But, if I'm in the basement, the only way I hear anything is if someone actually goes to the top of the stairs and shouts down to me.

Sound can travel in strange ways. Without being in the house and experimenting, there's no way of knowing who could have heard what.
 
After more thoughts about this case i think maybe E was the target or E and X. I think maybe something happened at the party they went to and it escalated from there. I’m hoping if this is the case I hope those who witnessed anything talk to the police. I think something happened in the 4 hours unaccounted for and more than one person was involved. These are what my thoughts are atm and may change as the investigation moves forward. I don’t think it was a stranger who did this and think the victims knew the killers.
It definitely sounds like police are hoping to get more information on the frat party and wanting to hear from those that were there. Makes me think the same as you said — E & X being targets for some reason. So sad.

MOO
 
I agree w/most everything you said. But does the general public really give a hoot whether a bunch of officials make public statements? My impression has always been it’s the individual agencies and gov’t branches driving the segmented approach to ensure all are adequately recognized. With press encouraging the ensemble presentation to have as many officials as possible to hound for exclusive tidbits each news cycle.

Personally I find the press conference parade a bit redundant, a bit awkward and more than a bit unecessary. If they want to have everyone join at the podium to be introduced that’s understandable. And it often makes sense the Mayor or Governor address the community at the initial PC. But other than that I’d prefer a single, fully-briefed speech-savvy LE spokesperson deliver the investigative/public safety details.

That said, you have experience w/the process and I don’t, so perhaps that’s just me.
I agree with you. It just find the public is constantly complaining about no press conferences.
They are not satisfied with a single PIO or an informational press release. They liken it to WH press briefings with prepared sound bites. They figure if they can get the individual LE officers to comment, they have a better chance of getting a juicy tidbit. And, they don’t want to hear, “We can’t comment on that at this time.”
A lot of people want to know, but very few people have the right to know.
 
After more thoughts about this case i think maybe E was the target or E and X. I think maybe something happened at the party they went to and it escalated from there. I’m hoping if this is the case I hope those who witnessed anything talk to the police. I think something happened in the 4 hours unaccounted for and more than one person was involved. These are what my thoughts are atm and may change as the investigation moves forward. I don’t think it was a stranger who did this and think the victims knew the killers.

I agree, and IMO, more intel on E and X and their night could solve this case soon.

From the City of Moscow Police Department's FB post yesterday, "Detectives are looking for context to the events and people involved in these murders. To assist with the ongoing investigation, any odd or out-of-the-ordinary events that took place should be reported. Our focus is the investigation, not the activities. Your information, whether you believe it is significant or not, might be a piece of the puzzle to help investigators solve these murders."

I hope these students know they can safely speak to LE regardless of any underage activities they were partaking in.
 
More thoughts regarding K's dog. The police have stated clearly that the dog was picked up at the residence by LE the night of the murders. The only way that statement makes sense to me is if they aren't referencing the literal evening of the 13th, but are instead referencing night as in the time period from dusk to dawn. We then see a police report that someone inquires about the dog at 5:30 pm on 11/13. Is it possible that when LE responded to the alcohol related complaint near the lawn of the frat house, they encountered K's dog outdoors? If the dog had tags, they may have even tried to return him to 1122 and received no response, so they took him and turned him over to animal control. Once they are processing the crime scene, they realize the dog they picked up is from that same residence. Perhaps he escaped the house earlier in the evening during partying. Perhaps the perp put the dog outside the house when he entered. Perhaps the dog escaped the house as the perp was leaving. I'm sure they examined the dog for blood or other evidence before releasing him back to his responsible party. There are some other dog-related entries in the police log on the 12th and 13th, but I don't think those are about this dog; they are in other locations, etc.
 
Regarding LE saying they don’t want to give out possible descriptors of the perp because it could cause people to be fearful and begin accusing people…IMO it’s because the general description is vague yet common. Ie, college age, brown hair, male, etc (just as an example). So many people could be a suspect. <modsnip - reference to off limits discussion removed>
 
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Well said. Absolutely. I think the families, it’s part of their grieving process, but I think also they are appealing to armchair detectives to solve this case as well as thinking that they’re continuing to put pressure on LE to solve it quicker. As though, like you say, like those guys are sitting around twiddling their thumbs thinking this is no big deal. They don’t need any more pressure to tell them that they need to solve the case.

And then you have LE playing defense here to all the criticism and also the reporters who are out for their soundbites to try to give new nuggets of info. You hit the nail on the head. Loose lips sink ships. It’s counterproductive to the entire process for them to give any information, as much as we would like to know it. You end up giving the killer a heads up and potentially end up turning this case on its head and ruining it. I don’t understand how all these folks are not told that time and time again. I hope that they just stop refusing doing any interviews and just do press releases so maybe those reporters will go home and stop trying to get a sensationalized sound bite for shows for ratings. They have a maniacal killer to put behind bars.
Reporters are not going to just "go home." We live in a media saturated culture with the good and the bad that comes from that.

Having been on the media side, I would say be careful what you ask for. Historically, the media in America has been relied on to inform the public, protect our U.S. Constitutional rights (especially to know what the government is doing, often in secret) & made an informed citizenry possible.

The landscape is changing now with so many outlets for information (most of it unvetted opinion).

There is a necessary tension in a society like ours between police and the media. It is a strength when compared to places like China & Russia where media is historically under government control.

What many see here as manipulation, I see as the natural outcome of competing rights. It is a very good thing to have an LE investigation that is careful. It is a very good thing to live in an open society where LE has accountability.

When LE in the U.S. says releasing info of any kind beyond the barest facts is protecting their investigation, they are overlooking the larger interests of our open society. Withholding probable cause affidavits, for example, is often done by LE when it is a basic glaring violation of the public's right to know. Without the media going to legal expense & great effort, the public would be left in the dark in many, if not most jurisdictions, in the U.S. in most criminal cases.

I understand the passion on both sides of this issue but blanket shut downs of investigative info and complaints about media behavior are part of living in a country founded on principles that create this tension. We need to be glad for it IMHO.

LE needs to be more transparent & stop behaving like no perp can be arrested because their investigations are too compromised by demands for information.

Media could be more respectful & focus on facts rather than gossip in trying to gain an inside edge on their competition.

But that won't change the basic conflict enshrined by our founders in the multitude of "checks and balances" our freedoms rely on.

Any time any government agency is not held accountable by some outside pressure, we are all in jeopardy of losing basic freedoms we are lucky to take for granted in the U.S.

Getting off the soapbox now.
MOO
 
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Thank you!!!!!!
 
I've read that Ethan was not a resident of the murder house, but was just "visiting" overnight. Does anyone know where he actually resided?
I don't think we ever heard about that, but maybe with his brother?
 
Question; in regards to LE just now having the vehicle towed, is it possible that it could be to delve further into the vehicle's GPS or computer?? That's the only viable reason I could think of for why they haven't done it previously. Maybe they are at "that part" in their investigation.

MOO
 
Coroner is quoted on saying it is incorrect that all were found in their beds, per CBS news. In other words, the coroner said they were not sll found in their beds. CBS news.
thanks for the heads up, I deleted my post saying the above That no, not all were found in their beds.
my theory, not fact, is it could be Ethan defending the girls and found in the hallway after trying to fight intruder.
Not all found in their beds could easily indicate that one (or more) rolled/fell out of bed while trying to fend off their attacker. Given the initial inconsistent answers as to whether they were in bed, I'd say this is more likely than someone being in the hallway.
 
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