ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 21

[mayhem911]

When LE says the house was maybe targeted(besides a specific individual) I interpret that as meaning- maybe the house, with it's back sliding door, unique layout, sort of secluded location on the dead end of a culdesac, and kind of wooded area, was why it captured the killers attention.

 

[Tillicum]

Why not putting up posters? Like if you have any information or you were in the area before or on 13th and noticed something or someone acting unusually, watching 1122 or behaving suspiciously, please contact that and that numbers?

It will give some purpose, something to do to families.

Can someone explain why that may be a bad idea?

I don't necessarily think it's a bad idea, but if I were a student there trying to calm my fears, I think it would trigger them every time I saw one of the posters. JMO.

 

[Blue_Painting]

Why not putting up posters? Like if you have any information or you were in the area before or on 13th and noticed something or someone acting unusually, watching 1122 or behaving suspiciously, please contact that and that numbers?

It will give some purpose, something to do to families.

Can someone explain why that may be a bad idea?

I think they just don't need to. imo.

 

[Blue_Painting]

Why not putting up posters? Like if you have any information or you were in the area before or on 13th and noticed something or someone acting unusually, watching 1122 or behaving suspiciously, please contact that and that numbers?

It will give some purpose, something to do to families.

Can someone explain why that may be a bad idea?

Also, they have asked for any video from the hours of 3am to 6am in vey specific areas. THIS is extremely telling. imo. They are telling us they have a suspect with an alibi, and they want to possibly disprove the alibi. imo.

 

[Sandy007]

It has been reported that there are certain restrictions to putting up posters in Moscow, ID. I don't know if the parents have thought the business window or poster stacks at checkout route. The posters in cars was gold because there was no law against that as long as you had mirrors to cover what you could not see on the back side windows.

It has been reported that there are certain restrictions to putting up posters in Moscow, ID. I don't know if the parents have thought the business window or poster stacks at checkout route. The posters in cars was gold because there was no law against that as long as you had mirrors to cover what you could not see on the back side windows.

They could print posters and ask volunteers to give them to passersby.

They could also ask locals, friends to put posters on their car windows, they could do same in other towns in the area, what LE said? within 3 hrs drive.

Any other ideas?

Shame i am not close, would love to help.

 

[slanda]

In my experience with my murdered friend, LE at least explained why they could not divulge information. My friend's mother was also upset and angry and channeled her energy to putting up posters in people's cars, business that allowed it, giving carefully crafted interviews.

I would like to hope LE is at least explaining why some things need to be kept quiet. Not being allowed to put up posters (assuming that is anywhere) leaves a gaping hole in the "things a person can do". Some people NEED to feel like they have done EVERYTHING in their power to help catch who did this. It's not just a want. I can't tell you how many businesses I convinced to put a poster in their window when it was "against policy".

I agree. Last night, SG talked about wanting to put up posters and said “they won’t let me” — he basically said that the prospective students that are coming in wouldn’t want to commit to a University and a town that has a dangerous person potentially roaming around and the posters and media spotlight bring bad publicity.

I also agree that SG is one of those people who want/need to do something.

I don’t know how to quote my post for you from the last thread where I talked about this exact thing so, sorry it’s so long, but here it is in case it interests you:

“I sort of agree. Coming from an LE standpoint, I thankfully never had to work on something like this, plus, they wouldn’t have given me a lot, if any investigative details as a VA. I generally worked at crime scenes and other VA’s followed up as the investigation progressed and then the court VA’s pick them up from there.

I met people on their worst possible days and gave them the worst possible news.

I always knew and was conscious of the fact that their lives were going to change from the moment I was let in their door, or hospital room, or wherever I was requested to go and I was sad and cognizant of the fact I was going to be the bearer of awful news and change the course of their lives forever.

I was charged with many death notifications and I was given very few details, but after the notification, I was happy to sit as long as they wished me to.

I also was requested on scene at an unattended death, or any death, suspicious or not to talk with family members, friends, roommates, etc…, whomever found the body.

I also spoke to many live victims and survivors and even witnesses to terrible things could request our presence.

I felt like the grim reaper at times, but I also think my job was important because yes, I was meeting people on the worst days of their lives, but I was also there and trained to comfort them and hold space for them for however long they needed… and I was happy to do that. It became too hard and because I did it around where I grew up, I became paranoid I would come on scene to someone I knew and it started to really bother me.

I chose the job because I’d want someone to be there if I needed on my worst day and someone had to do it, so, if not me, then who?

I completely understand as much as I can, Kaylee’s family public grief. What he said about it basically being bad press for the town and college and that “they” (not sure who they are but I have an idea and I don’t think it’s really LE at all) don’t want him hanging up posters because the entirety of the case could scare prospective students away… — As a human, knowing what he said is probably right, I can understand why he thinks maybe some people are trying to suppress the case is not out of the realm of possibilities. It makes a lot of sense logically.

I can’t say I wouldn’t do what he’s doing and start screaming from the rooftops. I mean, what does one do when something like that happens? I’ve been around a lot of victims, but never a crime like this. I cannot imagine there’s a good answer or solution to this, either.

I think the PD needs to offer him some kind of compromise and trauma/grief counseling. He could really say something’s that could hurt the integrity of the investigation. IMO, he needs to be heard more by them and I understand that maybe it’s a sort of nuisance because I also believe that LE 100% cares and are absolutely doing their best… I mean, if they’ve done their due diligence so far and have come up with nothing, then, unfortunately right now, they have nothing… You can’t get blood out of a turnip. You don’t know what you don’t know. That’s just a fact but I’m sure they know a lot more than they did and it’s not for a lack of trying.

It’s a very difficult situation for both sides. I believe her father when he said maybe some people (and I personally don’t think it’s LE, it’s sounds to me more political pressure) don’t want to keep the media spotlight on the town. It tracks it with my sensibilities especially if that’s their economic backbone. I don’t know how to reconcile those two juxtapositions and make both sides better trust the other but I think someone has to try with SG because he’s not going to stop. So someone, somehow needs to come up with a solution.

IMO, this idea about not wanting to have the media spotlight and the previous comments by some like the Mayor stating it was a “Crime of Passion” invariably makes people believe they’re not in danger of it happening to them. And maybe that’s why we have all this back and forth with target or not targeted messaging. IMO, it does seem a little like LE is getting pressure to ease the public tension and fright when maybe the public might have every reason to be at least alarmed.

IMO, this is not a crime of passion. A killer doesn’t bring his own weapon to an unmediated stabbing spree.

I don’t know. This of course are all just thoughts I have after really thinking about what he said and my own work with previously helping victims.”

 

[layer]

His speech was ambiguous but the CC says she did. This would have been disconcerting. Thanks.

CC is regularly wrong. Has @Allabouttrial made us a transcript?

 

[thatssoamy]

Why not putting up posters? Like if you have any information or you were in the area before or on 13th and noticed something or someone acting unusually, watching 1122 or behaving suspiciously, please contact that and that numbers?

It will give some purpose, something to do to families.

Can someone explain why that may be a bad idea?

Jmo because I can't remember in detail what Steve said but something about posters putting off prospective students. He felt like the uni were trying to cover it up.

 

[Sandy007]

Also, they have asked for any video from the hours of 3am to 6am in vey specific areas. THIS is extremely telling. imo. They are telling us they have a suspect with an alibi, and they want to possibly disprove the alibi. imo.

I am thinking of what families could do, to give them purpose and to help them keepinv the case in public domain.

LE are doing what they have to do, they own the investigation. Of course, families have to communicate with LE.

Am i missing something?

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

CC is regularly wrong. Has @Allabouttrial made us a transcript?

right. that's why I asked what others thought.

 

[Blue_Painting]

right. that's why I asked what others thought.

The context is what is important. Listen to what he says after that. He says her texts do not imply distress. Hence, why would she have called 911? imo

 

[seasideForest]

Why not putting up posters? Like if you have any information or you were in the area before or on 13th and noticed something or someone acting unusually, watching 1122 or behaving suspiciously, please contact that and that numbers?

It will give some purpose, something to do to families.

Can someone explain why that may be a bad idea?

One reason that I think keeps being mentioned here on the threads against putting up posters with REWARD is that the possibility of getting money for a tip will inspire people who have nothing to do with the crime to contact LE with made-up information. This just makes more work for LE and doesn't lead to anything useful. But idk why no posters at all.

 

[captnchuck67]

The strangest thing to me so far from the Le standpoint is usually when the FBI BU is called in one thing they stress is to release at least a minimal profile detailing some standard things for the public, ie pre and post offense behavior . I might have missed it but usually that sort of info is constantly repeated at any PC that is had by LE. I think,could be wrong, they have someone on radar and do not want to spook him ,yet

 

[mayhem911]

I'm scared of this murder and I'm over 1,500 away. Can't imagine putting posters up will do any good in Moscow. It's got to what everyone there is thinking about already Let LE do their job they say they are painting a picture which takes time could take months to paint a picture.

 

[Snoop Sister]

He says she didnt' call 911.

I edited my post. I misunderstood him.

 

[MsBetsy]

There were questions in the last thread about targeting. Here is the FBI's definition of targeting in one of their handbooks (page 41) via link:

https://www.fbi.gov/file-repository/making-prevention-a-reality.pdf

Note that targeting does not necessarily mean a specific victim or victims and can be due to a variety of offender explanations. I have also included an attached image of the page.

"Opportunistic victims may be targeted at the time of the offense for any number of reasons, including convenience and availability, high visibility and potential for maximum shock value, or because a desired target is unavailable."

 

[Ghostwheel]

I agree. Last night, SG talked about wanting to put up posters and said “they won’t let me” — he basically said that the prospective students that are coming in wouldn’t want to commit to a University and a town that has a dangerous person potentially roaming around and the posters and media spotlight bring bad publicity.

I also agree that SG is one of those people who want/need to do something.

I don’t know how to quote my post for you from the last thread where I talked about this exact thing so, sorry it’s so long, but here it is in case it interests you:

“I sort of agree. Coming from an LE standpoint, I thankfully never had to work on something like this, plus, they wouldn’t have given me a lot, if any investigative details as a VA. I generally worked at crime scenes and other VA’s followed up as the investigation progressed and then the court VA’s pick them up from there.

I met people on their worst possible days and gave them the worst possible news.

I always knew and was conscious of the fact that their lives were going to change from the moment I was let in their door, or hospital room, or wherever I was requested to go and I was sad and cognizant of the fact I was going to be the bearer of awful news and change the course of their lives forever.

I was charged with many death notifications and I was given very few details, but after the notification, I was happy to sit as long as they wished me to.

I also was requested on scene at an unattended death, or any death, suspicious or not to talk with family members, friends, roommates, etc…, whomever found the body.

I also spoke to many live victims and survivors and even witnesses to terrible things could request our presence.

I felt like the grim reaper at times, but I also think my job was important because yes, I was meeting people on the worst days of their lives, but I was also there and trained to comfort them and hold space for them for however long they needed… and I was happy to do that. It became too hard and because I did it around where I grew up, I became paranoid I would come on scene to someone I knew and it started to really bother me.

I chose the job because I’d want someone to be there if I needed on my worst day and someone had to do it, so, if not me, then who?

I completely understand as much as I can, Kaylee’s family public grief. What he said about it basically being bad press for the town and college and that “they” (not sure who they are but I have an idea and I don’t think it’s really LE at all) don’t want him hanging up posters because the entirety of the case could scare prospective students away… — As a human, knowing what he said is probably right, I can understand why he thinks maybe some people are trying to suppress the case is not out of the realm of possibilities. It makes a lot of sense logically.

I can’t say I wouldn’t do what he’s doing and start screaming from the rooftops. I mean, what does one do when something like that happens? I’ve been around a lot of victims, but never a crime like this. I cannot imagine there’s a good answer or solution to this, either.

I think the PD needs to offer him some kind of compromise and trauma/grief counseling. He could really say something’s that could hurt the integrity of the investigation. IMO, he needs to be heard more by them and I understand that maybe it’s a sort of nuisance because I also believe that LE 100% cares and are absolutely doing their best… I mean, if they’ve done their due diligence so far and have come up with nothing, then, unfortunately right now, they have nothing… You can’t get blood out of a turnip. You don’t know what you don’t know. That’s just a fact but I’m sure they know a lot more than they did and it’s not for a lack of trying.

It’s a very difficult situation for both sides. I believe her father when he said maybe some people (and I personally don’t think it’s LE, it’s sounds to me more political pressure) don’t want to keep the media spotlight on the town. It tracks it with my sensibilities especially if that’s their economic backbone. I don’t know how to reconcile those two juxtapositions and make both sides better trust the other but I think someone has to try with SG because he’s not going to stop. So someone, somehow needs to come up with a solution.

IMO, this idea about not wanting to have the media spotlight and the previous comments by some like the Mayor stating it was a “Crime of Passion” invariably makes people believe they’re not in danger of it happening to them. And maybe that’s why we have all this back and forth with target or not targeted messaging. IMO, it does seem a little like LE is getting pressure to ease the public tension and fright when maybe the public might have every reason to be at least alarmed.

IMO, this is not a crime of passion. A killer doesn’t bring his own weapon to an unmediated stabbing spree.

I don’t know. This of course are all just thoughts I have after really thinking about what he said and my own work with previously helping victims.”

Does anyone wonder if the University tries to downplay this and a new student gets injured by this same person for whatever reason, would the University (or even the city) be liable? It's seems like a really bad idea to try and sweep this under the rug to me.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

The context is what is important. Listen to what he says after that. He says her texts do not imply distress. Hence, why would she have called 911? imo

a lot of reasons, imo. I try not to assume, and since I couldn't clarify, I asked others.

 

[layer]

Interesting change of wording at

King Road Homicides | Moscow, ID

www.ci.moscow.id.us

• Currently, no suspects are in custody, and no weapon has been located.

BBM

That language has been in every Press Release under the Additional Information section since the first one on November 19.

ETA: Correction
On the first one, Nov 19, there was no official Additional Information section yet, and the language was very slightly different. Currently, there are no suspects in custody, and the weapon has not been found.

 

[Tillicum]

"Oppurtunistic victims may be targeted at the time of the offense for any number of reasons, including convenience and availability, high visibility and potential for maximum shock value, or because a desired target is unavailable."

What if the target was the University? Seriously, think how much this has and will affect the university.