ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 29

[Sandra Ade]

Can anybody chip in and comment about MM at the Grub Stop?

I re-watched the videos and to my mind, speaking as someone who has worked in many clubs and bars, it looked like MM was really really wasted and barely able to stand, wavering around, staring into space, moving her arms and hands incongruently, and holding onto / leaning into a part of the service area of the truck that was kind of in the way of people being served. Her friend is just kinda standing with her and they make the odd conversation but not much. MM also seems to spend a lot of time glancing over towards the guy with the chunky knitted woollen sweater, grey baseball cap, long hair, and beard who is chatting with a female in a white jacket (who ran up and hugged and jumped up and kissed him). Is it me thinking this?

I've read that apparently she was making a phone call? I don't see her making a phone call, was she, what am I missing?

Was she drugged? She looks really really unstable. Did she eat the food? Anyhow my point is that someone who is that far gone they just need to get home and lay down before they fall down. At work, I would remove this person to a safe place, get them off their feet, give them some water, arrange for them to be safely taken to their home, pray they're not going to vomit everywhere and pray they're not going to be taken advantage of by some hideous creep who are on the lookout for these vulnerable women (happens all the time).

Anyhow when she got home, I'm sure she'd have been out for the count and be almost impossible to wake. JMO MOO What do others think about the videos

I think the same

 

[WildWest]

There are actually two “Good Vibes” signs: one in the living room area, and one in Kaylee’s room.

I thought that was Maddies sign her Sorority bedroom that she moved with her to 1122?

 

[SteveP]

Why put put a press release for a vehicle without any identifying markers like a license plate, dent on passenger door, special rims, etc ? A model year and color is not a lead and dangerous info to put out. If there are 20000 of those vehicles in Idaho, potentially 20000 people are suspects without an identifying marker. The vehicles occupant(s) may have witnessed something is not a lead.

Perhaps the people reporting seeing the white Elantra near the home, or any video showing it, were not clear enough to show any "identifying" markers, or perhaps there were none. LE clearly did not have a valid license plate for the vehicle, or they would have shared it. And respectfully, LE was not asking anyone to confront anyone driving a white 2011-2013 Hyundai Elantra, but merely to phone in any information they thought may be helpful. I do not see a great deal of danger in that, for either the caller or the vehicle owner/operator. A very general description of a vehicle often results in the vehicle being found. A couple of examples in cases I followed here were the car in the Sierra LaMar case, and the pickup truck in the Naomi Irion case, fairly recently. And respectfully, that the vehicle's occupant may have witnessed something could not only be A lead, but could prove to be THE lead LE needs to break this case. JMO

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Moscow is considered part of the “Quad Cities” for economic development and many other things, including some law enforcement (mostly drugs from what I can tell).
Here is a link from the Pullman city site and a map from the same link:
Business Climate
View attachment 387141

yes, I'm pretty familiar with the area, and plenty of reasons to cross state lines IMO. I think the killer had access to Moscow, but I'd be surprised if they're actually a resident of but again, jmo.

 

[MountainDad]

Just to be clear, there are probably only about 800 such Elantras in Idaho, based on sales data previously published in these threads.

Ok. Thanks for the info. Police should release the photo/video of suspected vehicle. Not a stock photo, color, and model. Imagine an innocent person living in Moscow ID driving your 2012 Hyundai Elantra. Is that fair? Too vague for an official press release. If only 800, then investigate internally.

 

[Janeumayer]

Internet sleuths spot mystery group walking in background of bodycam footage two doors down from Idaho murder house just ten minutes before cops announced gruesome deaths of four students​

• A group of people could be spotted walking hurriedly past police near the home where four Idaho University students were slain
• Bodycam footage of officers stopping three students for suspected drunk driving, revealed the group passing by in the background
• The incident took place just moments before police suspect the murders took place, and only two houses down from the crime scene
• Police have said bodycam videos hold no evidence in the case, but it remains unclear if they've identified and interviewed the group walking by
• Little headway has been revealed in the case as a month has gone by without arrests, leading to rampant theories spreading on social media

Several people spotted near home of slain University of Idaho students

A group of people could be seen walking hurriedly past police near the home where the four Idaho University students were brutally murdered..

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[WildWest]

I had the thought of someone lifting the window off its track.

Jmo

I wonder the same thing!! Just high enough to clear the lock.

 

[Aquarian]

Both K and M's rooms were on the third floor at the back, yes.

IMO I don't think that's the image SG is talking about. I feel the pic of K's room was likely a pic taken by crime scene photographer.

It may not be The photo, but I was posting for those who may have thought her room was empty and therefore she Had to sleep with Maddie. And additionally with SG’s comments about her clean room etc.

 

[CSIDreamer]

That area was certainly not quiet at 3 a.m. JMO

 

[TravelingCircusof5]

Because he is a grieving dad, who very obviously focuses on his own child and is not privy to the details of the investigation. He does not have a full picture and of course for him Kaylee is a focal point of that picture.

Yes! He is looking at it with an abundance of love and attention focused on his child. My dad would say the same: “oh, MY daughter was the best one, if someone had a crush on one, it would be MY daughter, My daughter is most interesting…” Of course, my dad would also be saying the opposite at the same tim: “My daughter is the kindest, sweetest,BEST, faultless! no one could want to hurt MY daughter.” His perspective is colored by his love for her.

i have long thought that the fact that LE keep wanting info on frat party and X&E whereabouts show the the police do not in fact think K was the main target. But of course, this is my opinion, and I don’t know.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Moscow is considered part of the “Quad Cities” for economic development and many other things, including some law enforcement (mostly drugs from what I can tell).
Here is a link from the Pullman city site and a map from the same link:
Business Climate
View attachment 387141

yes, quite familiar with the area. part of my rationale for spitballing places has to do with roads, cameras, etc. I've gone through the maps and examined the camera placements. I chose pullman for two reasons -- very close, silent and remote access (camera free), and what he might 'see' everyday. college town. I chose the other two because larger, still easy access, easy to disappear. This is all JMO and me guessing, of course.

 

[Cryptic]

I suspect there are issues at play to do with the 'greek life' and either secrecy or dealing with things themselves. JMO MOO

Though not familiar with Greek life, I suspect that any secrecy pledges fall far short of hindering a quadruple murder investigation.

Even if there was such an expectation, factor in the very valid pirate / olde west outlaw / biker saying: "Three can keep a secret- if two are dead".

At the end of the day as the pirates, outlaws and bikers observe(d), humans are bad about keeping secrets. If the core motive was connected to Greek Life, or if a Greek "rage" perpetrator was suspected, I think it would have come out by now.

 

[MesquiteO21]

I'm starting to think Occams Razor on this one. So Many other cases have oddities, conflicting info, weird details that don't add up to anything, missing info, missing victims. This doesn't feel nearly as wonky as most cases I read on here (Springfield 3, Asha). Extra MOO.

what's the Occams Razor scenario here? that it was someone who hated all (or most) of them?

*MOO*

 

[ReyInVA]

Can anybody chip in and comment about MM at the Grub Stop?

I re-watched the videos and to my mind, speaking as someone who has worked in many clubs and bars, it looked like MM was really really wasted and barely able to stand, wavering around, staring into space, moving her arms and hands incongruently, and holding onto / leaning into a part of the service area of the truck that was kind of in the way of people being served. Her friend is just kinda standing with her and they make the odd conversation but not much. MM also seems to spend a lot of time glancing over towards the guy with the chunky knitted woollen sweater, grey baseball cap, long hair, and beard who is chatting with a female in a white jacket (who ran up and hugged and jumped up and kissed him). Is it me thinking this?

I've read that apparently she was making a phone call? I don't see her making a phone call, was she, what am I missing?

Was she drugged? She looks really really unstable. Did she eat the food? Anyhow my point is that someone who is that far gone they just need to get home and lay down before they fall down. At work, I would remove this person to a safe place, get them off their feet, give them some water, arrange for them to be safely taken to their home, pray they're not going to vomit everywhere and pray they're not going to be taken advantage of by some hideous creep who are on the lookout for these vulnerable women (happens all the time).

Anyhow when she got home, I'm sure she'd have been out for the count and be almost impossible to wake. JMO MOO What do others think about the videos

I agree that she looked very wobbly. In my opinion, she appeared to be quite intoxicated.

 

[Sister Golden Hair]

Though not familiar with Greek life, I suspect that any secrecy pledges fall far short of hindering a quadruple murder investigation.

Even if there was such an expectation, factor in the very valid pirate / olde west outlaw / biker saying: "Three can keep a secret- if two are dead".

At the end of the day as the pirates, outlaws and bikers observe(d), humans are bad about keeping secrets. If the core motive was connected to Greek Life, or if a Greek "rage" perpetrator was suspected, I think it would have come out by now.

Definitely falls short of that lol, definitely.

 

[Arkay]

Though not familiar with Greek life, I suspect that any secrecy pledges fall far short of hindering a quadruple murder investigation.

Even if there was such an expectation, factor in the very valid pirate / olde west outlaw / biker saying: "Three can keep a secret- if two are dead".

At the end of the day as the pirates, outlaws and bikers observe(d), humans are bad about keeping secrets. If the core motive was connected to Greek Life, or if a Greek "rage" perpetrator was suspected, I think it would have come out by now.

I know I'm being pedantic, but it was Benjamin Franklin who coined that phrase.

Still applicable, though.

 

[Dre]

I think they walked back “stabbed in their beds” and changed it to “were likely asleep before the attack”
I think they realized they had to change it because Kaylee was with Maddie and Ethan and/or xana made it onto the floor (presumably by their bed)
Moo!

ETA: I’m nearly positive those were blood rivulets down the side of the house, very shoddy construction as the sill plate was not sealed to the foundation whatsoever!

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Though not familiar with Greek life, I suspect that any secrecy pledges fall far short of hindering a quadruple murder investigation.

Even if there was such an expectation, factor in the very valid pirate / olde west outlaw / biker saying: "Three can keep a secret- if two are dead".

At the end of the day as the pirates, outlaws and bikers observe(d), humans are bad about keeping secrets. If the core motive was connected to Greek Life, or if a Greek "rage" perpetrator was suspected, I think it would have come out by now.

Could there be a bunch of people who are feeling ashamed and guilty of themselves because maybe they knowingly wound up a situation? Obv nobody in their right mind would imagine someone's going to slaughter a bunch of people but youngsters do perpetrate pack mentality bullying, malicious gossip, and some types of personalities love to triangulate and watch stuff go off with a bang. It's all part of growing up that we learn along the way, these people were just really kids in a tiny bubble. Is (dysfunctional) group dynamics sitting behind this I wonder? And if so, could some people have solid reasons to feel so ashamed they don't want the truth coming out? Or are there people (in responsible job positions maybe) who are fully aware there's been terribly serious issues that should have been notified to authorities long before this incident happened?

JMO MOO

 

[TravelingCircusof5]

Though not familiar with Greek life, I suspect that any secrecy pledges fall far short of hindering a quadruple murder investigation.

Even if there was such an expectation, factor in the very valid pirate / olde west outlaw / biker saying: "Three can keep a secret- if two are dead".

At the end of the day as the pirates, outlaws and bikers observe(d), humans are bad about keeping secrets. If the core motive was connected to Greek Life, or if a Greek "rage" perpetrator was suspected, I think it would have come out by now.

I agree that a murder overcome a fraternity loyalty oath- one would think. But also think that if a student knows who did this, that student might be terrified of being next if they ‘blab’. I’m hoping that once all the students leave for the holidays, more of them will start talking to police.

I am reminded though of the tragic death of a Clemson University student about seven years ago during what was a hazing accident, as far as we know. To this day none of those boys has spoken about what happened even though there were dozens of them there that night. That really really saddens me.

 

[WingsOverTX]

Can anybody chip in and comment about MM at the Grub Stop?

I re-watched the videos and to my mind, speaking as someone who has worked in many clubs and bars, it looked like MM was really really wasted and barely able to stand, wavering around, staring into space, moving her arms and hands incongruently, and holding onto / leaning into a part of the service area of the truck that was kind of in the way of people being served. Her friend is just kinda standing with her and they make the odd conversation but not much. MM also seems to spend a lot of time glancing over towards the guy with the chunky knitted woollen sweater, grey baseball cap, long hair, and beard who is chatting with a female in a white jacket (who ran up and hugged and jumped up and kissed him). Is it me thinking this?

I've read that apparently she was making a phone call? I don't see her making a phone call, was she, what am I missing?

Was she drugged? She looks really really unstable. Did she eat the food? Anyhow my point is that someone who is that far gone they just need to get home and lay down before they fall down. At work, I would remove this person to a safe place, get them off their feet, give them some water, arrange for them to be safely taken to their home, pray they're not going to vomit everywhere and pray they're not going to be taken advantage of by some hideous creep who are on the lookout for these vulnerable women (happens all the time).

Anyhow when she got home, I'm sure she'd have been out for the count and be almost impossible to wake. JMO MOO What do others think about the videos

She made at least three phone calls after arriving home so she was somewhat cognizant I would think? Arrival at home is stated as 1:45 a.m. with phone calls between 2:30 & 3:00 a.m. we don't know what proof LE has that she made those calls, though.

Nothing has been released about whether she and/or KG ate the food KG bought.

It would be helpful to know more about her behavior before she left the Corner Club but that video is not being released.

The more I consider the ease with which someone drunk or drugged can be attacked & end up a crime victim, the more I wonder if the perp in this case had that as his main advantage. Perhaps instead of that being happenstance, maybe the killer used that knowledge to stalk & murder.

JMO

Edit: typo