ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow #3

[NeverPersonal]

Am I remiss to think that your average college student wouldn’t even know how to use a knife. Most kids I know in this age bracket barely know how to cook, let alone, how to maneuver a massive knife. Unless they had hunting skills. I’m not putting down people in this age bracket. To me, it simply seems a crime committed by someone out of their age bracket.

I think you just don't know the kids who do know those things. I'm friends with people of many different ages and most of the college kids I know are very capable and independent. If they don't know how to do something, they look it up on YouTube. The knife LE describes however makes me think the perp may be a veteran or have veterans in their family (imo, just a possibility).

 

[sleuth_truths]

i truly do not believe they are "suspects". I believe LE is just using "suspect vagueness" to try to disarm the killer, to some degree.

If killer thinks that the roommates are possible suspects, killer could possibly feel some bit of "relaxation".

I'm just going to hope this isn't true, because I cannot imagine dangling 2 deeply traumatized young women in the off chance a killer would relax...putting those girls' lives at risk by the public. That's just incomprehensible to me.

 

[sumzero]

I have been baffled by the statement yesterday by the Chief PD. He said, I paraphrase, they know it was a targeted attack by what was left behind at the scene. What could that be?

Cash and valuables? Since nothing was stolen, the killer(s) didn't come to burgle the place but to kill. That's how I'd interpret it.

 

[uburoi1]

Am I remiss to think that your average college student wouldn’t even know how to use a knife. Most kids I know in this age bracket barely know how to cook, let alone, how to maneuver a massive knife. Unless they had hunting skills. I’m not putting down people in this age bracket. To me, it simply seems a crime committed by someone out of their age bracket.

I think the choice of weapon is a huge 'tell' here; but I'm uncertain just what exactly it's telling.

 

[KonaHonu]

Am I remiss to think that your average college student wouldn’t even know how to use a knife. Most kids I know in this age bracket barely know how to cook, let alone, how to maneuver a massive knife. Unless they had hunting skills. I’m not putting down people in this age bracket. To me, it simply seems a crime committed by someone out of their age bracket.

I have never stabbed someone but my understanding is that it takes a lot of force to stab a human deeply and also a lot of effort to withdraw the knife. And it can easily get lodged on bone, between ribs, etc. A hunter with good knife skills would not necessarily have any stabbing skills. In hunting, knives are generally used primarily to skin and gut. They are also a good general purpose tool in the outdoors.

 

[Emj]

I’m looking at what PD are omitting from the information they release. From the Moscow Police FB update, this sticks out to me; LE have not divulged where X and E were between the party and arriving home at 1:45. The timeline shows their whereabouts between 8-9pm at the frat house. The FB report says:

Investigators have determined that Ethan Chapin and Xana Kernodle were seen at the Sigma Chi house on the University of Idaho Campus at 735 Nez Perce Drive. At approximately 1:45 a.m., Ethan and Xana are believed to have returned to the residence at 1122 King Road.

So, my guess is LE only knows/can say for certain that X&E were seen at the party from 8-9. But LE does not say for certain where they were between 9-1:45. Why? Does LE not know for sure where they were in that time? Or is their whereabouts during those 5+ hours possibly a key to who did this?

We keep focusing on K&M as the targets. But their whereabouts that night are totally accounted for. Meanwhile, with X&E there is this huge gap. That gap creates opportunity for something out-of-the ordinary to happen. That time gap is a big black box and those are where strange things happen. Did they go somewhere that put them in someone’s radar? Did they cross paths with a suspect?

A lot can happen in 5 hours.

 

[Stratford258]

Respectfully, A LOT of people who are college age know how to use knives, specifically for hunting, fishing, camping, etc.

What stands out to me is that this knife is, specifically, manufactured to be a weapon. To me, that says it's less likely a knife the killer found in the house and used; it's more likely their personal possession.

I am convinced this is a person who, if they have friends or family, is seen with the murder weapon 24/7.

Given that the local store doesn't sell this brand/type of weapon, the killer bought it somewhere else, was issued it for combat or was given it by a relative or friend, or, perhaps, stole/took it.

If they bought it somewhere else, it's likely the killer is also FROM somewhere else. JMO

 

[Alethea]

Am I remiss to think that your average college student wouldn’t even know how to use a knife. Most kids I know in this age bracket barely know how to cook, let alone, how to maneuver a massive knife. Unless they had hunting skills. I’m not putting down people in this age bracket. To me, it simply seems a crime committed by someone out of their age bracket.

Also I think we're missing the physicality of stabbing to kill four adults, including a grown man. It takes considerable strength.

People have brought up cases of one woman in a rage or during a breakdown killing one other person. But to make that choice 4 times moving through multiple rooms takes time.

I think this is either someone very strong or very determined. It's not a spur of the moment thing because it's a series of events.

 

[SkyeBerry]

I actually looked for carbonara on the menu too! Maybe it was a special not on the regular menu. The menu linked above shows a special mac for this weeks dates Nov 16-18.

Hey there, this is my first time posting! Yes, the carb was probably a rotating special. The grub truck is iconic in Moscow (pronounced Mos-coe btw, rather than Moscow!) Grub truck is smack in the middle of about 8 different bars and has delicious food. I'm not surprised to see that many folks there so late in small town Idaho. Almost nowhere else serves food so late in Moscow or in Pullman.

 

[mysteryfan96]

I respect your theory but of the 4 victims Kaylee is of course not the only one described as truly special, all 4 sound like they were well loved. Part of why we know so much about Kaylee is that her sister has been very vocal about sharing what she had uncovered about Kaylee’s last activities and routines.

So just because we know Kaylee may have used her phone to call someone multiple times shortly before the murder is estimated to occur, does not mean that the other 3 were not using their phones. Just that Kaylee’s sister chose to disclose that to the media while nothing about the other victims’ phone activity in that time frame has been disclosed.

I didn’t mean to imply that the other 3 weren’t special as well. But, like you said, we only really know at this point what has been shared by family members. And we do know Kaylee was one of those extra special people who lights up a room, so to speak. As I said in a previous post, people that special can often attract a lot of jealousy and resentment through zero fault of their own. And while it’s possible others in that house also placed calls or texts around the time of the murders, we haven’t been told that yet. So we have to make theories based on what we do know, and we do know quite a bit about Kaylee. She would not have been in the path of the killer but rather in an out of the way location the killer would have had to make extra effort to access. That says to me her death was important to the killer in some way. And the fact that she was moving away permanently soon is at the very least a curious coincidence.

 

[journey9tails]

Interesting seeing local journalists are frustrated with

I actually looked for carbonara on the menu too! Maybe it was a special not on the regular menu. The menu linked above shows a special mac for this weeks dates Nov 16-18.

If you watch all of the food truck video, I think you’ll find carbonara mentioned more than once.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

I'm just going to hope this isn't true, because I cannot imagine dangling 2 deeply traumatized young women in the off chance a killer would relax...putting those girls' lives at risk by the public. That's just incomprehensible to me.

Agree. If that's what happens, I hope Snell and whoever told him to do that get suspended over it. I think Internal Affairs needs to be involved if that's what happened here.

MOO.

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

I respect your theory but of the 4 victims Kaylee is of course not the only one described as truly special, all 4 sound like they were well loved. Part of why we know so much about Kaylee is that her sister has been very vocal about sharing what she had uncovered about Kaylee’s last activities and routines.

So just because we know Kaylee may have used her phone to call someone multiple times shortly before the murder is estimated to occur, does not mean that the other 3 were not using their phones. Just that Kaylee’s sister chose to disclose that to the media while nothing about the other victims’ phone activity in that time frame has been disclosed.

This exactly. The other families haven't been as vocal is all, though we do have an interview with Xana's dad and Ethan's parents. Have we heard from Maddie's family yet?

 

[acutename]

I read that more as they were at home hanging out when they were murdered as opposed to when he called. Plus, it’s entirely possible she could have just told her dad she was at home for a quiet night so as not to worry him about his daughter being out late at night. Wouldn’t be the first time a kid fibbed to his/her parents about whereabouts at a late. Maybe she knew she would be home soon anyway, so she just told her dad they were already there.

a bitter irony to me is that they might have been safe if they never went home... or do people think the killer would have waited to attack a different night? was this timed because the semester was ending and it "needed " to be done in the killer's mind, or was it more of an impulse?

 

[Barry]

Idaho murder victim's sister says she called man 7 times night of slayings: Report

The sister of Kaylee Goncalves, one of the four University of Idaho homicide victims, says she called a man named Jack six times before she was killed.

www.foxnews.com

"At 2:26 a.m., Kaylee starts to call J," AG told "Inside Edition," which described J as a young man. "Kaylee calls J six times between 2:26 a.m. and 2:44 a.m. From 2:44 to 2:52 Maddie calls J three times, then Kaylee makes a final call to him at 2:52 a.m."

 

[whiskers]

I think you just don't know the kids who do know those things. I'm friends with people of many different ages and most of the college kids I know are very capable and independent. If they don't know how to do something, they look it up on YouTube. The knife LE describes however makes me think the perp may be a veteran or have veterans in their family (imo, just a possibility).

Oh, I agree. But I wouldn’t be surprised if it was someone out of their age bracket. It’s a very particular knife.

 

[sleuth_truths]

They have said conflicting statements regarding this. Nothing is off the table yet, JMO

Oregonmama, you're gonna need a bigger table.

 

[Stratford258]

I’m looking at what PD are omitting from the information they release. From the Moscow Police FB update, this sticks out to me; LE have not divulged where X and E were between the party and arriving home at 1:45. The timeline shows their whereabouts between 8-9pm at the frat house. The FB report says:



So, my guess is LE only knows/can say for certain that X&E were seen at the party from 8-9. But LE does not ssy for certain where they were between 9-1:45. Why? Does LE not know for sure where they were in that time? Or is there whereabouts during those 5+ hours possibly a key to who did this?

We keep focusing on K&M as the targets. But their whereabouts that night are totally accounted for. Meanwhile, with X&E there is this huge gap. That gap creates opportunity for something out-of-the ordinary to happen. That time gap is a big black box and those are where strange things happen. Did they go somewhere that put them in someone’s radar? Did they cross paths with a suspect?

A lot can happen in 5 hours.

Interesting and important notes, IMO. Thank you for this post.

Idaho murder victim's sister says she called man 7 times night of slayings: Report

The sister of Kaylee Goncalves, one of the four University of Idaho homicide victims, says she called a man named Jack six times before she was killed.

www.foxnews.com

"At 2:26 a.m., Kaylee starts to call J," AG told "Inside Edition," which described J as a young man. "Kaylee calls J six times between 2:26 a.m. and 2:44 a.m. From 2:44 to 2:52 Maddie calls J three times, then Kaylee makes a final call to him at 2:52 a.m."

Who is J and why are they both frantically calling him???

When I call someone multiple times like this, it's because I think they're in trouble, or I think I'm in trouble.

For BOTH K and M to be calling J multiple times at this time in the morning, (when we know they are together in their house,) says, to me, that they knew they were in trouble (JMO).

And, IMO, J was someone they trusted to help - i.e. he could get there quickly and be of aid to them.

The question is whether or not he did get to them quickly and, if not, why?

 

[Retired_grumpy_bastard]

The way you work a criminal case is not to just ask who did it? You also ask who could not possibly have done it? Who can we prove was in Florida, in the hospital having open heart surgery, in jail, at work and on camera, etc.? Everyone is a suspect. Scratch out their names, from your list, as you confirm they could not possibly have been present, for whatever reason.

Of course, you also ask who could have had a reason to harm this person? Who had an opportunity? Who owned the type of weapon used in a particular crime? Who has said negative things about the victim recently? Murder is usually one of the easiest crimes to solve. Notice, I said usually.

Often an arrest is made at the scene, nearby, or some place else within hours. I’ve driven up on scenes and found the perpetrator waiting for us, crying his eyes out.

All that aside, police in Idaho, just like everywhere else, know everything I just said. They have knocked on a lot of doors. They’ve taken thousands of phone calls from people well meaning people, trying to help.

The police are exhausted and totally worn out. They’ve had very little sleep. They are eating unhealthy junk and drinking a lot of coffee. This is hard on them physically and emotionally. They’ve seen things that no person should ever have to see. Those images will haunt them forever. Those images are permanently burned in their minds.

This happened almost a week ago. I’ll bet my life savings that everyone in their circle of friends, the creepy kid in their English class and the guys the girls went to their junior high dance with, have been interviewed. I feel if this was someone they knew, the walls would have been closed in, by now. Just my personal opinion.

Autopsy results answer a lot of questions. In homicide cases I’ve worked, where the victim was a female, I always wanted to know if she was pregnant? Other things such as the presence of alcohol and drugs are important as well. The list goes on and on.

My gut tells me this is a stranger on stranger crime. The longer this drags on, the stronger I will feel that way. It’s my opinion that an arrest would have already been made, if the victims knew the perpetrator.

 

[Snoopster]

Another Idaho murder - and one in my hometown at the time - involved a High School girl, Sarah Johnson, who enlisted her BF to help kill her parents. Granted they were shot. But I do find it very peculiar that LE is currently casting suspicion on the survivors in such explicit words. I understand that sometimes LE will do such things as a strategy, but I just can't imagine they would do it to these two young women after surviving something this horrible and in a community so confused and fraught with fear. So it makes me think maybe LE really is looking at those two girls and those they know. There must be something there, a fight, an argument, a text message, weird behavior, idk. I would chalk it up to LE miscommunication as has been constant in this case so far, but it was the ISP comms expert Snell who said this, right? So less likely a case of misspeaking.

This.

I am shocked that LE mentioned that the roommates were possibly victims or suspects. That is incredibly insensitive if they are victims. A more typical comment is a generic statement that they "will not exclude any avenue of investigation".

The fact that they made the comment that they did about the roommates gives me pause. It also reminded me of the presser from the other day where they were asked about others in the house and he hesitated before he said there were 2 others living in the house. It made me wonder if there was a guest staying over and he was avoiding saying that.

I hate that Daily Mail has named the roommates. I am presuming they are innocent (until I hear futher) and it would be devastating to be cast in the light that LE has now cast them. I hope this is resolved soon!