ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 34

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Strong1 said:
So this statement about the car from Moscow LE is very confusing. The owner has no ties to Moscow. Okay you've ruled the owner out. But was the owner driving the car? Is the owner in Colorado or Oregon? But what about the car? If it's not involved, then why not state that. Your leaving your department open for more questions. It's this kind of word salad that leads to rumors and innuendo. Seems like a very hastily put together statement. Unless the car is involved?
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I get what your saying. A simple 'This is not the car we are looking for' would suffice. but if this car was remotely of interest it would have been swooped on, examined at the scene and then towed to a lab. I think clearing the owner was at the forefront of their mind due to doxxing. MOO.
 
The Observer said:
I get what your saying. A simple 'This is not the car we are looking for.' but if this car was remotely of interest it would have been swooped on, examined at the scene and then towed to a lab. I think clearing the owner was at the forefront of their mind due to doxxing. MOO.
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Do we know for sure if the car hasn't been taken to a lab?
 
jumpingjackflash said:
Setting the serial killer speculation aside for the moment, and assuming that all four victims were killed by the same individual, what are the chances that this was the killer's first time taking a human life? I've heard at least one respected profiler hypothesize that the killer had killed animals previously (she was notably less confident that he had killed a human/humans before).

Acknowledging there's a lot we don't know -- how messy or tidy the crime scene was, whether/to what extent the killer was wounded during the attacks (e.g., from knife slippage), whether the killer knew how many people were in the house and which rooms they were in -- I think it is staggeringly improbable that someone who had never stabbed a human before would have the composure/confidence to sneak into a home occupied by multiple college students, kill four of them quickly and quietly enough to avoid being detected by the housemates or neighbors, and then successfully flee the scene and disappear into the night. To execute a mass stabbing under those conditions, I think the killer would need either (a) confidence gleaned from the experience of having killed before, (b) chemical courage that would remove inhibitions/stress during the performance of the killings, or (c) rage so consuming that he (temporarily) did not care about being caught.

I get that the victims were sleeping and had been drinking and therefore were in a vulnerable position. But the killer assumed substantial risk in order to carry out a mass murder in that setting. In my opinion, there's a good chance he had killed before.
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Killer is stabbing prone, sleeping, probably deeply sleeping individuals where he does not have to use just arm and shoulder strength but has his body weight as well. Two of the victims were probably still slightly intoxicated. Three were petite females.

The entire point of a combat knife design -- its large hilt or full handguard -- is that you don't get slippage. In basic we trained thrusting inot high density dummies all day and no one got a scratch. That is where I take issue with the pathology experts that supposedly have a lot of experience with knife assult and murders. The huge majority of those would be kitchen knives or folding knives that have no real hilt. With no hilt you could easily cut up your hand. Also I venture that most stabbings are two standing individuals essentially fighting requiring slashing and movement instead of just smashing down with body weight in plunging attack.

As far as mentality required I just don't think we can take our own feelings, reactions, self control, how we act out frustration or anger, etc and apply it to a mass murderer.

My own feeling is this is someone in their casual circle that was enraged by one of the victims and they are not some kind of serial killer. That you or I could not be enraged enough to kill four people dosnt change the fact that there 350 million people in this country and a tiny fraction of a percent being way off mentally is still a lot of people..
 
There are several very high profile mass or serial murder cases where vehicle of interest has been totally wrong. EG DC Sniper/s where estimated were that thousands of hours of investigators time was wasted chasing down a vehicle color and type that was about as far from the actual vehicle used as possible.
 
IceCreamSundae said:
I think that begs the question…was the car reported stolen
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SUSAN ANN said:
I have a hunch that’s not the vehicle, sat there too long, I would think by now someone would have taken it to a garage. I think Moscow knows it’s not the car. Chief Fry seems very confident in his video of a few minutes ago. Truly think they are zeroing in, my opinion.
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From my reading of the above article, the Police have ruled out the car owner, but not have not explicitly ruled out the actual car being connected to the murder. The female owner lives approx. 1,000 miles away, a man was found sleeping in it, and the license plates were ripped off.

“The vehicle is registered out of Colorado and the female owner is not believed to have any relation to any property in Moscow, Idaho or the ongoing murder investigations. The public is asked to stop contacting the owner”.'
 
NCgardener said:
It wasn't released by police, so yes, imho. I think it was just a random part of a discussion they were having. They're all friends, so they were just talking about something among friends. Just normal college stuff, I think.
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Agreed. Anything is possible. If there is any lead perhaps they said something to him helpful, such as arguing with someone, or someone angry at one of them.
My main take from that video is that hoodie guy is with a virtual certainty not some stalker, but their friend.
 
Diogenetic said:
Agreed. Anything is possible. If there is any lead perhaps they said something to him helpful, such as arguing with someone, or someone angry at one of them.
My main take from that video is that hoodie guy is with a virtual certainty not some stalker, but their friend.
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MOO- That is exactly what was most important takeaway of the video to me as well. Hoodie guy looks like a friend, the girls do no appear to be uncomfortable with him at all , they seem to be acting like a bunch of friends walking to get food after a fun night out having had several cocktails.
 
TIGER0822 said:
From my reading of the above article, the Police have ruled out the car owner, but not have not explicitly ruled out the actual car being connected to the murder. The female owner lives approx. 1,000 miles away, a man was found sleeping in it, and the license plates were ripped off.

“The vehicle is registered out of Colorado and the female owner is not believed to have any relation to any property in Moscow, Idaho or the ongoing murder investigations. The public is asked to stop contacting the owner”.'
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So not explicitly ruled out for a day or two, because they are going to do some basic processing to cross t's and dot i's and that takes a bit longer with physical evidence than a person.
That people are directly contacting the owner tells you why the cops are doing the right job in not handing out too much info as it is being widely abused
 
Diogenetic said:
Killer is stabbing prone, sleeping, probably deeply sleeping individuals where he does not have to use just arm and shoulder strength but has his body weight as well. Two of the victims were probably still slightly intoxicated. Three were petite females.

The entire point of a combat knife design -- its large hilt or full handguard -- is that you don't get slippage. In basic we trained thrusting inot high density dummies all day and no one got a scratch. That is where I take issue with the pathology experts that supposedly have a lot of experience with knife assult and murders. The huge majority of those would be kitchen knives or folding knives that have no real hilt. With no hilt you could easily cut up your hand. Also I venture that most stabbings are two standing individuals essentially fighting requiring slashing and movement instead of just smashing down with body weight in plunging attack.

As far as mentality required I just don't think we can take our own feelings, reactions, self control, how we act out frustration or anger, etc and apply it to a mass murderer.

My own feeling is this is someone in their casual circle that was enraged by one of the victims and they are not some kind of serial killer. That you or I could not be enraged enough to kill four people dosnt change the fact that there 350 million people in this country and a tiny fraction of a percent being way off mentally is still a lot of people..
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Maybe it's splitting hairs, but I was meaning to focus not on whether the killer could be a serial killer in the sense of committing killings that fit a particular pattern and criteria, but on the likelihood of the killer being a first-time killer given what we do know about the circumstances of the crime.

I still think an act of rage and a chemically-assisted murder are plausible scenarios, but I also think that in either of those cases the killer would be more likely to leave a trail of DNA/physical evidence behind. So I guess I *hope* it is a first-time killer but as time passes I'm less persuaded that is the case.
 
jumpingjackflash said:
Maybe it's splitting hairs, but I was meaning to focus not on whether the killer could be a serial killer in the sense of committing killings that fit a particular pattern and criteria, but on the likelihood of the killer being a first-time killer given what we do know about the circumstances of the crime.

I still think an act of rage and a chemically-assisted murder are plausible scenarios, but I also think that in either of those cases the killer would be more likely to leave a trail of DNA/physical evidence behind. So I guess I *hope* it is a first-time killer but as time passes I'm less persuaded that is the case.
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With you on the latter. Chemical and rage. I think this is a first time killer and yes it’s not normal. Young guy on drugs I think.
 
Moo...maybe the stabber is a med student or a surgeon? If you were confident of your knowledge of human anatomy..it would just be a methodical kill. Or could just be someone that spends alot of time studying how to stab efficiently....or steroid rage ....moo
 
jumpingjackflash said:
Maybe it's splitting hairs, but I was meaning to focus not on whether the killer could be a serial killer in the sense of committing killings that fit a particular pattern and criteria, but on the likelihood of the killer being a first-time killer given what we do know about the circumstances of the crime.

I still think an act of rage and a chemically-assisted murder are plausible scenarios, but I also think that in either of those cases the killer would be more likely to leave a trail of DNA/physical evidence behind. So I guess I *hope* it is a first-time killer but as time passes I'm less persuaded that is the case.
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The chemicals assistance is alcohol. this was a party night at a school that is counted among party schools.

I agree with you that a first time killer would be more likely to leave behind DNA. <modsnip> Also I am no murder investigator, but I would assume anything about DNA, its very presence or absence would be among the most confidential information the cops would have and not let out in public domains.
 
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AngTxGal said:
Making no assumption that any white car in any footage is the same as any other white car. There are 8 I can count in the parking lots near the house from Google Earth

I believe these are three different sources

1- Ring camera footage of driver dropping off girls- mentioned by Kaylee’s sister, not released
2- Video of white car on Taylor driving west- not released taken from neighbor on Linda Ln
3- Bodycam of police Sept 1 Taylor at Band Field- released
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Also anyone that knows cars at all can clearly tell the one in the September footage is a Chevy Cruz ! Not to be too matter of a fact but my step dad worked at a car dealership my whole life and my husband deals in auto recycling. I may not be good at pinning down years back make and models are fairly easy for me.
 
Porki said:
I watched an unrelated (to this case) police interrogation a few years ago where LE told the subject that they had video/ pictures of his truck by the crime scene.

What they did not want the suspect to know was the fact that the pics were of poor quality and would not be much use as clear evidence so to speak. However, they were useful for convincing the suspect he was caught and it was best to confess.

It's possible the images are not clear and it's best the bad guy doesn't know that.

Just a thought and MOO.
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