ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 35

[Elliot_Alderson]

LE are investigating a quadruple murder case, not filming a tv show, where ratings determine their success. Respectfully, they don't have time to worry about how we, the uninvolved public, the majority of whom probably do not even live in their state, much less their community, would judge their performance. Also, whether they know "why" or not is ultimately of little importance, as motive does not have to be proven, but I am confident that they will learn "who", if they have not already, and will bring the killer to justice. And again, LE ALWAYS know a lot more than they tell, while an investigation is ongoing. They are going to try their case in a court of law, not in the court of public opinion. JMO

This should get stickied to the top of every new thread.

 

[Arkay]

It's frustrating because cases aren't wrapped neatly in an hour like they are in CSI or SVU. It's a process that is incredibly daunting, they have to comb through tips, evidence and possible suspects. Also, when evidence is released to the public that evidence took investigators awhile to find! The public or these "armchair detectives" online are expecting more, but that's not the reality of an investigation. My father is a detective, he has worked on numerous murder cases, it is not as easy as people online want to make it seem. The Moscow PD are doing their best.

My cousin is a Federal detective working in NYC.

One day I was very startled to see him with other Feds on the news, perp-walking some handcuffed Mafia bigwigs.

It turned out my cousin was deeply involved in an ongoing RICO case (Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organization Act).

Of course he never mentioned any of it, but my point is this investigation took them years. They knew who the Mafia guys were and what crimes they were involved in, but to arrest them they needed unimpeachable evidence. Lots of undercover work and informants involved and it takes a long time to do the sting.

I'm completely aware that bringing down organized crime is not the same as killing four kids, and that these kids weren't murdered by a criminal ring.

My point is that to get an arrest that results in a conviction takes time, and information is kept out of the public arena if it may compromise a case.

My cousin wouldn't tell us any details even after, because of course there are other organized crime guys still out there.

I do think Moscow police don't have the experience that NYC cops have, but they have rightly brought in the ISP and FBI, who do have the experience.

I'm as curious as anyone but willing to wait so that once found, the murderer will get what's coming to him.

All JMO and experience.

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

The coroner is an elected position, correct?

 

[AngTxGal]

In my opinion, LE knows and has proof of the suspect(s) involved. I believe they have received all of the digital forensics (phone, SM, camera) along with crime scene forensics (DNA, prints, etc) and interviews with family, surviving roommates, friends, old schoolmates, and fraternity/sorority brothers/sisters.

MOO LE is delaying the arrest of the suspected killer(s). I believe they have agents under surveillance waiting till after the holidays to make the arrests for the sake of the families (victims and LE).

IMO, LE is releasing tidbits to get information and input from the public on any additional accomplices or witnesses. This crime was a result of pent up rage from a person close to the victims and the killers left a messy crime scene that is making it easy to solve. Just wait till the New Year. IMO.

If LE knows who the killer is, it would logically follow that these people would have been told.
- The two surviving roommates that have likely been living in fear of the killer at large that knows they were in the house when it happened
- UofI students and parents so they can return to campus rather than pay for dorms and a meal plan they are not using
- Owner of the house so it can be cleaned and rented by January
- MSM so they could report that people being harassed are not the killer so that can stop
- All the public looking for a white Hyundai Elantra unicorn and calling in tips

I’m guessing LE doesn’t know, as it would be irresponsible for them to keep such information to themselves over the holidays- and think they are doing so for the sake of anyone.

JMO

 

[NickoD]

The coroner is an elected position, correct?

Correct.

 

[10ofRods]

The body cam video (edited to add, the one where LE came to the house for the noise complaint) we've all seen is from Sept. 1; is there another body cam video from the night of the murder?

Only the one from the police stop near the Band Field, AFAIK.

Certainly no body cam of any house party at 1122 King Road dates to the night of the murders. The noise complaint body cam is indeed on Sept 1.

 

[layer]

Look what her "assumptions" did to the father.

I'm sure the parents of all of these victims are completely devastated, regardless of what the coroner, or anyone else says. It is almost incomprehensible for any parent to have to endure the knowledge that their bright, beautiful children were butchered.

 

[PrairieWind]

Clearly E wasn't killed in his bed. And either K or M weren't killed in their bed. (K, if you subscribe to what SG says).

How do you know this?

 

[layer]

How do you know this?

Because E didn't have a bed in that house.

 

[maskedwoman]

Again, I've posted this before.
If you watch that press conference she reiterates "they were all found in bed."
The followup question, later in the same press conference is "They were all found in their beds?
To which she replies "some were found in their beds."
This is pretty precise and straightforward.

I suspect she was trying to avoid giving away the fact that they weren't found in four separate beds, in four separate bedrooms, because it could have been deemed a crucial detail in keeping the integrity of the investigation.

I agree. She answered very carefully and I think some people have either remembered her statement incorrectly or assumed more than she actually said.

 

[gliving]

True crime junkies flock to Idaho murder house

The Idaho home where four students were murdered has become an attraction, with one woman saying she visited after hearing about the case on a podcast.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Visitors are constantly stopping by to get a glimpse of the home in Moscow, Idaho, where Kaylee Goncalves, Madison Mogen, both 21, their roommate Xana Kernodle, 20, and her boyfriend Ethan Chapin, 20, were killed on November 13.

On Sunday morning, Amanda Padgett and her daughter rolled by the house in their station wagon, loaded up with luggage. They were on their way home to Spokane, Washington, after spending the weekend in Moscow to attend a Christmas celebration for her softball team.

'We're just curious,' she said from behind the wheel of her car. 'It's shocking,' she said of the crime. 'It's just more real to see it yourself.'

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The two men recorded as the most recent owners of the property, SP and DE, are staying mum. Repeated attempts to reach the owners were unsuccessful and E told a neighbor not to talk if approached by journalists.

 

[nisco]

Again, I've posted this before.
If you watch that press conference she reiterates "they were all found in bed."
The followup question, later in the same press conference is "They were all found in their beds?
To which she replies "some were found in their beds."
This is pretty precise and straightforward.

I suspect she was trying to avoid giving away the fact that they weren't found in four separate beds, in four separate bedrooms, because it could have been deemed a crucial detail in keeping the integrity of the investigation.

You’re right, my mistake!

 

[CLGM]

So what are some theories about what the killer(s) is doing right now? In other high profile cases, what were the killers doing before they were eventually arrested?

To a certain extent, this relates to what kind of person did this. What do serial killers do when they are being sought after with so much publicity and scrutiny?

If they are somebody that snapped for whatever reason (I know we have different theories about how impulsive this could have been), what are they doing? Are they watching everything? Did they return to their daily life? How are they coping?

Maybe they are somebody who lives in the margins, moves in and out of cities, stays at shelters, motels. Which leads to another question, LE enforcement probably knows the behavior of people who live that way and the kinds of places to ask around at, right?

Anyway, just wondered if others have thoughts based on other crimes like this.

 

[NyxNY]

Ok well the body cam video shows no code lock on one of the downstairs bedrooms…

Which body cam is this? I have not seen any body cam footage of inside the house. Link please?

 

[cottonweaver]

i know we talked about this before, I just don't put any validity to the use of "their" in the context of that sentence. She meant, imo, some were killed/not killed "in beds". The coroner, imo, does not seem to use precise descriptive language.

All about Trial's transcript of the later Banfield interview

Mabbutt: ...'it seems likely that maybe they were sleeping'
Banfield: ' were they found in separate areas of the house?
Mabbutt: ' that hasn't been disclosed yet'
Banfield: ' can you tell me when you say that they might have been sleeping where they found in beds?'
Mabbutt: ' erm yes'


edited to add
Just noticed members have already supplied the quotes

 

[Down To Earth]

The body cam video (edited to add, the one where LE came to the house for the noise complaint) we've all seen is from Sept. 1; is there another body cam video from the night of the murder?

Yes:

Idaho murders: Police release bodycam video from night of killings

Idaho officials released body camera footage Thursday of a police stop recorded around the same time four college students were stabbed to death and near the crime scene.

www.foxnews.com

In rereading the news article, I was mistaken about it being a noise complaint. It was plain clothes officer responding to sight of underage drinking.

 

[SRWCF]

So what are some theories about what the killer(s) is doing right now? In other high profile cases, what were the killers doing before they were eventually arrested?

To a certain extent, this relates to what kind of person did this. What do serial killers do when they are being sought after with so much publicity and scrutiny?

If they are somebody that snapped for whatever reason (I know we have different theories about how impulsive this could have been), what are they doing? Are they watching everything? Did they return to their daily life? How are they coping?

Maybe they are somebody who lives in the margins, moves in and out of cities, stays at shelters, motels. Which leads to another question, LE enforcement probably knows the behavior of people who live that way and the kinds of places to ask around at, right?

Anyway, just wondered if others have thoughts based on other crimes like this.

My theories seem to change daily at this point!

I definitely do not think someone's advances were rebuffed and then this person just snapped and decided to kill. To me this crime took A LOT of preplanning.

Then I've been thinking of LE's description of this being a "targeted attack" but they could not say if it was a specific person being targeted or the house itself. I've been chewing on that thinking what in the heck does it mean to "target" a house?

Well, I've decided (at least for today) that this means it could be a mass murderer. If this was not the perp's first time, then we could have a serial killer on our hands.

As always, JMO.

 

[PrairieWind]

In my strong opinion on this, She should only have said homicide by stabbing
She is a coroner and a defense attorney SMH

JMO

All coroners in smaller western counties have other jobs. Why is this such an issue for some?

 

[SRWCF]

All coroners in smaller western counties have other jobs. Why is this such an issue for some?

Correct. Thankfully, we do not have a lot of murders here in Idaho.

 

[10ofRods]

So what are some theories about what the killer(s) is doing right now? In other high profile cases, what were the killers doing before they were eventually arrested?

To a certain extent, this relates to what kind of person did this. What do serial killers do when they are being sought after with so much publicity and scrutiny?

If they are somebody that snapped for whatever reason (I know we have different theories about how impulsive this could have been), what are they doing? Are they watching everything? Did they return to their daily life? How are they coping?

Maybe they are somebody who lives in the margins, moves in and out of cities, stays at shelters, motels. Which leads to another question, LE enforcement probably knows the behavior of people who live that way and the kinds of places to ask around at, right?

Anyway, just wondered if others have thoughts based on other crimes like this.

SPECULATION.

Depends on the serial killer and it's really hard to generalize.

Ed Kemper hung around with police quite a bit, while living his normal life. Keith Jesperson just went right on with his normal life, driving his truck, spending time with his family. Joe DeAngelo found excuses to travel but was otherwise apparently a normal family man (co-workers said he wasn't exceptionally talkative but friendly and organized fishing trips/invited acquaintances or friends along). Dennis Rader kept up his appearances at church, Boy Scouts and otherwise, while his family apparently had no clues about his crimes.

In short, I think many serial killers just tend to go on with their normal lives, using their mask of normalcy as their main way of avoiding detection.

People who "snap" usually snap more than once. I can't say whether this crime involved "snapping" or not.

It's possible that this person does lead a "marginal" life and LE would know some of the locals who fit that description. However, if the serial killer is a drifter, surely they would be long gone from Moscow, ID.

To me, this crime seems well-organized and very specific to the conditions of that neighborhood - and that night. Whoever it is, they spent time planning and watching (more than one evening, IMO). However, I'm open to nearly every theory on this crime, as we have so few details.

We call people "serial killers" because they kill on more than one occasion, over time. So far this crime is a mass murder. Dennis Rader started his serial killing with a mass murder and I'm guessing there are others who did so, but usually a serial killer goes through the rush of the kill, has a "refractory" period where they watch and wait (whether they're terribly worried seems to be in doubt - certainly Jesperson's autobiography shows a man who was able to shrug off what he was doing).

Then the urge to kill becomes uncontrollable once again OR the opportunity for an "easy target" becomes available. I need to read more about killers like Richard Ramirez, who may have been living in stolen cars for part of the time he was in Los Angeles.