ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 7

[DizzyB]

But we do not know this for a fact, correct? There is no confirmation of whose bedroom’s are where, who exactly was found where.

Yes, I have mentally chosen M&K’s rooms on the 3rd floor based on their social media postings, but nothing has been confirmed. And if a roommate was moving out, things could have changed. I have zero ideas on which room was X’s.
If the sizes of the rooms on the 2nd floor were different, would she have chosen the larger room? The quieter room? The room closest to the bathroom?

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Well the reporter made an earlier report today about an hour ago where he was walking about the back of the house and showing the area on t.v. and how there may be evidence in that area under the leaves and then he comes on couple minutes ago to show that the police put tape around the area he was reporting from earlier. So the police were watching his reporting on Fox news. You'd think they already would have had that taped off and searched already.

Definitely yeah, the whole surrounding area I'd think should have been checked for evidence! Shame that it wasn't already... Well at least I hope they find something relevant. This case needs to crack. Soon.

 

[Ray_of_hope]

Torturing and killing animals can be a precursor to an individual's crimes against humans, yes.
Can be, but not always.

Also, it's a gradual progression of violence.
Not: kill animal on Tuesday - kill person on Sunday.

I've never seen a case like that.

jmo, FWIW

Fair enough and I agree, but who knows how long the perp that killed the dog has been doing this. People may have found missing animals dead and assumed that death was caused by vehicles, predators, etc. The skinning, IMO, is a further escalation.
Just like the controversial 'MacDonald Triad', research tries to look for predictors to aberrant behavior. We're all just brain storming here. And I must concede that not all killers have abused or killed animals in the past. This incident may not even be related to the student murders. Just looking at every dot to see if they connect.

 

[Jade]

It would take quite a presence of mind to think/remember to lock the doors of all their rooms after such an undertaking.

And then doesn’t lock the outside door?

That is the one that would keep out prying eyes if someone had come early looking for the victims while the survivors might have slept late or otherwise gone on about their way.

IMO

Simplest explanation is that the killer just didn’t care there were two more in the house.

Satiated?

Lazy?

This person obviously thought he was superior to the whole lot of them.

I don’t see where the person carried out any sort of intelligent or tricky feat they brazenly attacked out of nowhere, vulnerable, been drinking, turned in for the night, college students who seemed to not have a care in the world.



All imo

 

[green19]

Stepped away for a while so apologies if I missed any of the information that answers questions below:

(1) First, I know the autopsies were completed, but has an official time of death (TOD) been released for each of the victims?

Second, thinking out loud here, I realize that it is widely thought that it was the victims that were calling the ex perhaps because they could not find the dog or they heard something that scared them late at night. However, I think we are still missing too much information from the timeline to be able to fully understand what happened when, IMO, and hopefully more details on that will be shared by LE soon.

(2) If TOD specifically for MM and KG is determined to be before those late night/early morning calls were made, isn't there a possibility that the killer (assuming he was focused on KG and also knew her ex), could have used the phones to call her ex to either taunt him or try to lure him over to the house to kill him as well?

I think I read some where that KG's sister said that it was normal for her to call a bunch of times, but without TOD we really only know that calls were made to the ex using those phones, but not who actually placed those calls. IIRC the coroner revised the time of attack to 2-5 am, which could have been before the calls which I think I saw occurred between 2:30 and 3 am.

(3) Finally, regarding the stalker scenario, If one of the women had a stalker in the past, perhaps she might have filed a police report with either the university or the local police department. Has someone already looked into this and I missed it?

According to a crime report I located for U of I campuses, there was 1 "non-campus" stalking incident at the U o I Moscow campus in 2019, and none for 2020 or 2021 (2022 was not published in this particular report I looked at). There were no details for the 2019 incident listed (understandable considering privacy considerations), just that one had occurred.

To me the angry stalker seems like the simplest explanation/most likely scenario, and there were probably some red flags in the past. I struggle to believe this was some random act of violence or a serial killer who happened to be wandering the local area at 2 or 3 am on a chilly (well below freezing) fall night. It seems like the perp prepared in advance and cared about not getting caught. I think he was sloppy because he was young and very very angry and this was his first homicide, although he was comfortable with killing because he is an experienced hunter. Just my two cents.

All of this is IMO only.

 

[Warwick7]

My only point is, that in my opinion, not even concerning this case, it is not up to a relative to decide wether or not to call for medical assistance. Thats it.
If a person needes medical assistance 911 should be called.

MOO is they didn't know if he needeed medical assistance. What they wondered was why he wasn't responsive.

It stands to reason if his siblings are right across the street or anywhere in town they would be called.

These kids aren't thinking murder. They are thinking they can't get their roommates/boyfriend to respond.

I do think they were banging on a locked door and could hear a phone ringing and or alarm constantly pinging off...and yet no one answers it. No one responds to the locked door.

This is all MOO

 

[AngTxGal]

Well Kayla Bourque (a promising Criminology university student at one time) here in Canada went to jail for animal torture and killings. She was deemed high-risk to the public when released for parole - as the courts know it's a matter of time before she escalates. I think she's electronically monitored now and out but not sure. She's a freaky one... I think animal torture and dismemberment is a huge red flag JMO

Agree, it is a huge red flag!
There is a small leap from torturing a pet to killing a human.
It may not be related, in that the person who skinned this little dog may not have killed those four young people, but that only means there are two wacko psycho murderers in the area that need to be brought to justice= or it will happen again.
IMO and OMO

 

[lrhoover]

I think it is an easy fix, E and X were in the bedroom marked vacant.
If one of the two from the basement “saw a roommate” and thought they were passed out, they did not see E if it was a ‘roommate’. So it was X they saw, or K or M on the stairs?
The coroner said some died in the bed- I’m thinking that was K and M
X is to have defense wounds- maybe she was in the RR and returned to find the killer on E?
If that is blood seeping, it could be E’s
MOO
Prayers for the families, and friends, and school and community, this is heartbreaking to imagine what everyone is enduring

I agree, the room marked vacant is where the exterior had blood and is likely where E and X were. I studied the floor plan and the images and the floor plan is not drawn accurately and isn’t quite right in scale. When you look at it on paper the room labeled vacant looks smaller but in the Zillow image #13 you can tell by the window and door alignment with the shared wall of the bathroom it is larger than what is on the plan. That would make it more desirable than it appears on the floor plan compared to the other one on the same level. If I had to guess it’s larger. I draw floor plans as a part of my job so I’m pretty good at understanding floor plans from pictures and not being fooled by real estate angles.

 

[North_Idaho_Nony]

Extremely sad for your loss, ST, and sincere condolences….

I also find it very odd that no paramedics were called ….and agree it is the correct procedure for both to attend .… even for a deceased person … the equivalent of a 911 operator usually arranges for all services to attend …

Does anyone know if it was just a case of Paramedics arriving on scene a little later than the initial first responders, Police??

(The Police may have been in the local area and therefore arrived first??, closely followed by paramedics .?? ) Would have to check the very early images to clarify ….

IMO

MPD arrived first (we have volunteer FD & EMS):
“
The Moscow Fire Department also responded to the home, located just off the U of I campus, fire Chief Brian Nickerson told the Statesman on Monday morning. Nickerson said a crew was sent to the residence on a medical call, also just before noon Sunday. His volunteer department sent an ambulance and a fire engine, which he said is standard for such calls, but none of his team entered the home because police were already there and medical treatment was deemed unneeded. “We weren’t there very long,” Nickerson said by phone. “The (police department) was there prior to us arriving, so we determined we didn’t need to do anything at that point.”

Read more at: https://www.idahostatesman.com/news/northwest/idaho/article268734882.html#storylink=cpy

 

[Warwick7]

Police update yesterday:

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid0mB4izc5LUgsQmxFRhuGCsCULzd7W3cWPMkmqfAdnQfuEJyH86DCBLrSPNbCvRCCl&id=100082550200493&sfnsn=mo&mibextid=RUbZ1f

 

[AneutherSleuther]

I cannot parse how a killer could move from room to room, creating a blood bath in each one, lock the door behind each one, and get back out of the house without creating a mess in the hallways/communal area. In which case it makes no sense for the downstairs housemate to be banging on a door in the late morning unable to rouse them and then calling friends.

The only way it seems possible is if the perp entered and left each room from outside the house (going in and out of windows/patio doors /balcony doors.) That doesn’t seem likely looking at the view of the house.

 

[seasideForest]

I've only seen it discussed once. It said the neighbor was having some guilt that they didn't go check on things. I can't imagine the number of people with survivor's guilt from this. It's terrible.

That would suggest that K's dog was a) there that night and b) barking at some point.

Just saying because I haven't seen either point confirmed by LE. Just a bunch of discussion on here and things like the comment from K's sister about letting the dog out for a pee late at night, but idk if that was about what happened that particular night or as a rule. I haven't seen confirmed that anybody else knows that for sure either.

 

[KrisCo16]

I think regardless of who did it or their motivation I think we can assume now nearly 10 days in that it was orchestrated with a degree of capability.

I know one of the parents said that they created a mess and lots of evidence. That doesn’t necessarily translate to reckless and poorly executed.

After 10 days and with no arrests or even suspects it suggests there is no incriminating phone pings, no clear cut cctv or video evidence of them entering or leaving the scene in a highly populated urban area. Probably no definitive finger prints or dna to easily match the perpetrator (Perhaps suggests no previous record to), and with 500 tips not yet eliciting a suspect their post murder behaviour has also probably been controlled - I.e no breaking down and confessing, or the other end of the scale - boasting. Which considering the horrific murder of 4 people maybe suggests a certain type of personality.

The individual has either got very lucky or planned extensively to avoid the usual digital and physical mistakes that lead to quick identification and apprehension. And you feel after 10 days if any of those mistakes had been obvious we would probably already have seen the result.

snipped by me. Just bc LE says they don’t have a suspect, it doesn’t necessarily mean they don’t have a suspect

 

[layer]

Moo..the stabby person.. probably planned this event..since they had a quality knife and stabbed 4 people..but also they would have a get away plan...either a car close by..maybe they live close by. But they are not going to be strolling around aimlessly .....moo

Seems planned to me too, the killer(s) might have even been wearing gloves.

BTW "stabby person" LOL!

 

[FruitTingles]

I've only seen it discussed once. It said the neighbor was having some guilt that they didn't go check on things. I can't imagine the number of people with survivor's guilt from this. It's terrible.

Do you have a link for this please?

 

[Lalalacasbah]

Agree, it is a huge red flag!
There is a small leap from torturing a pet to killing a human.
It may not be related, in that the person who skinned this little dog may not have killed those four young people, but that only means there are two wacko psycho murderers in the area that need to be brought to justice= or it will happen again.
IMO and OMO

Yes and what are the odds of that right? Within 10 days or so, two heinous and graphic incidents? This killer wants the notoriety I think. I can't think they aren't related, again JMO

 

[white rabbit]

Hello, I was reading through the Moscow, ID police daily logs. You can find them published publish here: MPD Press Log 11/18/2022

Icame across a suspicious person report of a male on the 18th November 2022 report.

22-M10080 Suspicious Person/Circumstance

Incident Address: 1100 blk KING RD

MOSCOW ID 83843

Disposition: ACT

Time Reported: 13:31

Cad Comments:
There is a male at the Rp's address who is knocking, asking to come inside, and is refusing to leave. Officers responded and subject warned for conduct.

What I find intriguing is the incident address 1100 blk KING RD. This is literally a stones throw away from this case. Does anyone know any more about this?

MPD Press Log 11/13/2022

www.ci.moscow.id.us

and this one, from the night (edited -night after the murders). "suspicious person" basically at the end of taylor drive (very close to king/queen roads)

Male standing near bike rack looked like he was trying to hide. 20:55
Area checked. Officers responded. No report.

 

[GoneGoldfishin']

Does LE ever say publicly...."YES, we have a suspect", or say we have a POI BEFORE an arrest is made?

If they have...I don't remember.

Yes, most currently the Quinton Simon case.

 

[Lalalacasbah]

MPD Press Log 11/13/2022

www.ci.moscow.id.us

and this one, from the night of the murders. "suspicious person" basically at the end of taylor drive (very close to king/queen roads)

Male standing near bike rack looked like he was trying to hide. 20:55
Area checked. Officers responded. No report.

Officer responded... If this was the killer that would be devastating to know in hindsight

 

[TheEmpTSet]

I think the toughest issue to be reconciled is the motive in this case. The murders were not seemingly sexually motivated and nothing was stolen. If it was a crime of passion against an individual, and the majority of victims were killed in their beds, why would the killer stray so far from the intended victim to kill three others? If it was a random attack, is it just the killer's "bad luck" that so many people were in the house? It seems to me that the sorority itself was the intended target and that the killer or killers didn't know about the basement rooms and surviving roommates.