ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #10

[rkf]

Against my better judgment I've checked in here. Sadly, I see no new news but still the same speculation. Disappointing. Nevertheless, i have a few comments:



"He went over hills, washes, and thickets. He went through a lot," Search and Rescue spokesman Jeff Newnum told ABC News affiliate ABC 15.

"All together, Emmett probably walked close to three or four miles," Newnum said.http://abcnews.go.com/US/TheLaw/emmett-trapp-wandered-off/story?id=11323106

Emmett was two years old and wandered in incredible temperature extremes through all sorts of terrain until his little body gave out and he died.



Children who die from accidents or tragedies like getting lost in the forest, are not included in those statistics. Those stats only apply to murdered children. And in the case of children found murdered, yes, most are killed by their own families or people they know, especially when under the age of five.

But Deorr has not been found murdered. He has not been found at all. So, a better question would be to ask what are the stats on missing kids? How many are found alive? How many were lost? How many ran away? How many died from accident? How many killed?

There is no doubt that of children who experience foul play, most are victims of those closest to them when young. And in cases of missing kids, when not solved quickly, foul play is always investigated along with those closest to the child.

Nothing suggests that didn't happen here. Nothing suggests the family wasn't fully investigated. By local LE and the FBI. Yet no arrests, no statements regarding suspicion, or a desire for more information or cooperation, etc.

In Noah Thomas' case his parents were arrested a week after he went missing. So LE's initial comments that they didn't suspect the parents there can't really be compared to this case.

Also, the facts are quite different in this case. And none of the theories anyone has proposed make a bit of sense. The friend did something ("see, I'm not accusing the parents!"), but grandpa is lying and so are the parents, and what, covering for the friend for some reason? because there are so many "inconsistencies", or things that don't seem to add up to certian posters because "I would never leave my kid with an incapacitated old man therefore it didn't happen." Or "I would be giving very detailed interviews all the time to the media answering every speculative question of some people on the internet and since they haven't, they did something". Etc.

Bottom line, again, is that LE have done their job. Exhaustively. And there is nothing to suggest they don't know exactly when the family got there or whether there are any discrepancies or that the family has failed to fully cooperate, or give credible information or clear up any inconistencies, etc.

Finally, just because there seems to be nothing left to talk about if we can't speculate about the parents or the friend or whatever, doesn't mean all bets are off. Boredom doesn't make the family any less victims than they currently are.

There are so many other cases that could use some sleuthers.

When looking at statistics for missing children, it's important to focus on under 5 or even under 3. Older runaways skew the statistics in a way that doesn't really reflect the realities/possibilities of DeOrr's case. JMO

 

[rkf]

I appreciate your reply, however, this little boy and his FAMILY and friend are not statistics and should not be treated, at least not here, as though they are. Little Deorr and his family and friend are victims in THIS case and should be treated accordingly, IMO

This is a victim-friendly SLEUTHING site. I don't think most of us can or want to put aside our knowledge of statistical probability when sleuthing a case. That would be like refusing to acknowledge that children don't breathe water because we don't want to consider a child might have drowned. Each case is different, but in the aggregate, certain outcomes are more common than others. It's just my under-informed opinion, but I haven't seen anything to make me think this case is an "outlier". There is no publicly verified information indicating the parents, family and friend are involved, but there's no publicly verified information indicating another scenario. (I have no idea what happened, although my first theory is that he drowned and will eventually be found in the creek or reservoir. Obviously the sheriff knows more than I and has determined that is 100% not possible.) If you want to form your opinions without applying general principals, that is of course your prerogative. Your choice does not dictate others' choices. I respect your right to form and have your opinions and I appreciate having that courtesy returned.

 

[gitana1]

I just don't get the silence from JM and DK. Why are they not out there begging people to help them find their child? Why are they not on national TV shows (Good Morning America, TODAY show etc.) holding up his missing poster and asking for any information that would lead to the safe recovery of Deorr???

I just don't get their though process at all.

And one hinky thing stands out........ Why did they not come out and correct people when they got the timeline wrong about what day they got into camp?

We heard it was a Friday but now it actually was a Thursday........ Hink all around JMO.

Regardless, many families of missing people do not speak to the media. I feel that I would but after seeing how hard people jump on innocent victims, like Somer Thompson's mom, Elizabeth Smart's dad, when they speak to the media, I understand why some do not.

And some are just too upset. Like Emmet Trapp's mom. Or Murray Abbott's family. Or the mother of this missing child: http://ktla.com/2015/04/02/gardena-police-searching-for-missing-2-year-old-girl/. Or William Tyrell's parents who didn't give interviews for 7 months. Or the parents of Disen Heu-Aragaki when he was missing. Or the mother of Kierra Stubbs who 7 months after her daughter went missing was still too distraught to speak to the media. http://wiat.com/2014/11/10/fairfield-family-still-searching-after-seven-months-for-missing-mother/.

In any event, this family did speak to the media. A very lengthy interview. Clearly, they spoke much, much more to LE. On several occasions.

At this point I think they know their child is likely dead somewhere in the wilderness. Not one of us know how they feel. I think it would be hard to stand let alone speak. They are lucky not be in the mental ward, frankly. Yet people here insist that if they don't give several interviews to a rapid, suspicious and accusatory public, something's up?

Finally, they have no obligation to "clear things up" with the public. We are unimportant. LE is who is important, and of course search teams. And I'm sure they all know exactly what is needed to be known.

Why anyone thinks this family is of sound mind enough to even be following the mutterings of people on the internet and feel the need to address those mutterings, is beyond me. It's also not like the media is reporting on the discrepancies with any sense of urgency or suspicion. So why on earth would the family of a likely dead little baby even be aware of the "questions" and demands for info of some people on the internet?

I figure they are doing all they can simply to survive these horrible, dark days. It's so easy to declare what is "normal" and what "I would do" when we aren't in their shoes.

God forbid that any one of us should ever be.

 

[rkf]

I do, too. I think all of our personal experiences color our view of the world and how we approach cases.

It also shows that people can have different experiences traveling the same roads. When someone shares a story, it helps me to see a different point of view. And possibly an alternate way of reacting to or handling a situation.

 

[giagreen]

I just don't get the silence from JM and DK. Why are they not out there begging people to help them find their child? Why are they not on national TV shows (Good Morning America, TODAY show etc.) holding up his missing poster and asking for any information that would lead to the safe recovery of Deorr???

I just don't get their though process at all.

And one hinky thing stands out........ Why did they not come out and correct people when they got the timeline wrong about what day they got into camp?

We heard it was a Friday but now it actually was a Thursday........ Hink all around JMO.

I think its funny. You look at some of the parents who have stepped out like the Ramseys and everyone is screaming they did it. So it doesn't matter what they do. Either move they make there will be someone who thinks it points to guilt.
Personally, I think they are off licking their wounds. Sure over a month ago they thought someone may have taken him but maybe they realized the odds are not there. Maybe the fbi has told them not to talk. Maybe the sheriff has told them over and over he doesn't think he was abducted and why and they finally agree.
Maybe they don't feel that they owe anyone who doubts them an explanation for anything as long as the fbi and sheriff knows all they have to say. Some people really do put their faith in the hands of LE.
I don't think its weird at all. Me personally if my child was missing all it would take was one negitive comment about my motherhood for me to shut down and cut people off. They reched out to public at first and they were picked apart. I don't blame them for drawing back. We have all seen how cruel media can be along with misinformation and taking anything they may say out of context. If it were me I'd be off in a dark room crying myself to sleep.

 

[gitana1]

When looking at statistics for missing children, it's important to focus on under 5 or even under 3. Older runaways skew the statistics in a way that doesn't really reflect the realities/possibilities of DeOrr's case. JMO

Yes. I have acknowledged that in a couple different places in my post.

 

[katydid23]

This is a victim-friendly SLEUTHING site. I don't think most of us can or want to put aside our knowledge of statistical probability when sleuthing a case. That would be like refusing to acknowledge that children don't breathe water because we don't want to consider a child might have drowned. Each case is different, but in the aggregate, certain outcomes are more common than others. It's just my under-informed opinion, but I haven't seen anything to make me think this case is an "outlier". There is no publicly verified information indicating the parents, family and friend are involved, but there's no publicly verified information indicating another scenario. (I have no idea what happened, although my first theory is that he drowned and will eventually be found in the creek or reservoir. Obviously the sheriff knows more than I and has determined that is 100% not possible.) If you want to form your opinions without applying general principals, that is of course your prerogative. Your choice does not dictate others' choices. I respect your right to form and have your opinions and I appreciate having that courtesy returned.

My original feelings were that the sweet baby drowned. But after seeing pictures of the search teams in the creek, and knowing they are very experienced ID searchers, I felt they would have found him by now in the creek. They looked under rocks and in tide pools and under branches. He would have risen by now, imo.

And I don't see how he could have made it to the reservoir without being seen. It surely would have taken him more than 10 minutes to toddle up the hill to the reservoir. And they began searching very quickly. Didn't the adults go to the water first thing? I'd assume it would be the first place to run or drive to when a toddler goes missing. But either way, he would have surfaced by now if he was in the reservoir, imo.

So the next thought is that he might have wandered into the thick woods and died from exposure or dehydration. Poor baby. But it surprises me that the cadaver dogs and search crews have not found him. I know it is a big huge place and he is a very tiny boy, so I guess it should not be that surprising. :cry:

 

[gitana1]

All this has been done and yet the sheriff has not changed the POI designation of family and family friend who were at the campsite. Yes, I understand he modified POI with "because they were there", but there is some reason he called them POIs "because they were there and not witnesses "because they were there. They are not suspects, so it's not necessary for LE to mirandize them whenever they speak with one of the POIs. To call them "suspects" is to invite everyone to lawyer up. If LE had enough evidence to arrest someone, LE would have named a suspect. Clearly at this point, they do not. They may never. If the sheriff believed there was no foul play, MOO is that he would not have called in the FBI, he would not have sent drones up "just in case", he would not call the campsite a "crime scene" and he wouldn't say he is 99% sure DeOrr was at the campground. He would not have announced that other counties offered to help in a criminal investigation, with those counties subsequently helping in the investigation (in Idaho Falls, for example, an hour and a half from where DeOrr "disappeared". I doubt they were checking to see if DeOrr managed to find his way home on his own from Timber Creek.) If he didn't think foul play had occurred, I don't believe the sheriff would have methodically "ruled out" drowning (100%), said he is convinced it wasn't stranger abduction and dismissed an animal attack. Whether people agree with him or not, he seems to believe if DeOrr was there, his and the Salmon SAR dogs would have found him.

As much as we aren't supposed to draw conclusions from the use of terms such as "person of interest", terms such as "good with them", "solid" and "cooperating" don't have legal definitions, either. I'm most interested in the things the sheriff says that are not in direct answer to a question. What information does he provide freely when speaking about the case? As much as he's trying not to let details leak out when speaking to the press, saying "I'm 99% sure" about anything, when not asked "how sure" he is about something, tells us a great deal. I am surprised that he is 100% sure DeOrr isn't in the creek or reservoir, but 99% sure DeOrr was there. I would expect those numbers to be reversed. Even seven weeks after DeOrr went missing, I wouldn't be at all surprised if his body is found in the "that" water.

IMO, not wanting something to be true shouldn't preclude us from looking at what could be true, or what is most likely true (given statistics, evidence or lack there of and time elapsed) even if these hypotheses prove ultimately to be wrong.

BTW, parent or family abduction is much more common than stranger abduction and a parent, family member or family friend murdering a child is much more common than a stranger abduction.

Well respectfully, that's just totally untrue. I cited weeks ago on this thread the protocols in missing children cases. It would be totally negligent for LE not to run parallel criminal investigations in all missing child cases involving small children (i.e., not teens who may have run away). Ruling out criminal activity can only be done if any such activity is investigated.

Anyone who thinks that LE has not vetted and research and scrutinized this and every other family of a missing, kid, up one side and down the other, whether there is evidence of foul play or not, or whether LE suspects it, or not, is simply uninformed.

LE is able to voice confidence about eliminating certain theories or in family members in cases like this precisely because they conduct thorough, parallel criminal investigations when a child is lost for more than a couple hours. Always.

 

[Elena]

Oh I must disagree. To my knowledge there has been no change in the "we are good with the parents" - no change at all. All persons that were present are considered POI and we have been assured they are not suspects. It is unknown why the sheriff used the term crime scene, but what we DO know is that the sheriff has given no indication whatsoever that he believes a crime took place. The sheriff asked for assistance from the FBI to review everything and to make sure nothing was missed, because based on what the sheriff has said, he has no clue what caused the disappearance of little Deorr. And, even the deputy offered his dismay regarding the rumors about the victims on SM. Needless to say I agree with him 100%.

I thought calling it a 'crime scene' is an indication that he believes a crime took place. For the word to be able to 'slip', it has to be in his mind in the first place. I don't know what the Sheriff knows, what he thinks.

 

[rkf]

Regardless, many families of missing people do not speak to the media. I feel that I would but after seeing how hard people jump on innocent victims, like Somer Thompson's mom, Elizabeth Smart's dad, when they speak to the media, I understand why some do not.

And some are just too upset. Like Emmet Trapp's mom. Or Murray Abbott's family. Or the mother of this missing child: http://ktla.com/2015/04/02/gardena-police-searching-for-missing-2-year-old-girl/. Or William Tyrell's parents who didn't give interviews for 7 months. Or the parents of Disen Heu-Aragaki when he was missing. Or the mother of Kierra Stubbs who 7 months after her daughter went missing was still too distraught to speak to the media. http://wiat.com/2014/11/10/fairfield-family-still-searching-after-seven-months-for-missing-mother/.

In any event, this family did speak to the media. A very lengthy interview. Clearly, they spoke much, much more to LE. On several occasions.

At this point I think they know their child is likely dead somewhere in the wilderness. Not one of us know how they feel. I think it would be hard to stand let alone speak. They are lucky not be in the mental ward, frankly. Yet people here insist that if they don't give several interviews to a rapid, suspicious and accusatory public, something's up?

Finally, they have no obligation to "clear things up" with the public. We are unimportant. LE is who is important, and of course search teams. And I'm sure they all know exactly what is needed to be known.

Why anyone thinks this family is of sound mind enough to even be following the mutterings of people on the internet and feel the need to address those mutterings, is beyond me. It's also not like the media is reporting on the discrepancies with any sense of urgency or suspicion. So why on earth would the family of a likely dead little baby even be aware of the "questions" and demands for info of some people on the internet?

I figure they are doing all they can simply to survive these horrible, dark days. It's so easy to declare what is "normal" and what "I would do" when we aren't in their shoes.

God forbid that any one of us should ever be.

I am new to sleuthing, so I don't know much about any of the cases you mentioned. Other than Elizabeth Smart's case, where she was taken from her bedroom, did the other parents tell MSM that they thought their child had been kidnapped by a stranger? Or did they think something else (runaway, family kidnapping, etc.) happened to their child? Did the other families or friends of the families set up crowdfunding pages to pay for searches, posters and living expenses? Did the other families organize searches if LE gave up where the parents thought their child was lost?

I can't imagine being in the family's shoes. I don't ever want to know what it's like to be them. Since we have virtually nothing to go on, many of us are looking at their behavior to see if it is consistent with how we think we would behave if we believed our child was the victim of a stranger abduction. Of course, most of us can't actually know and hopefully will never find out. So, second option is to compare their behavior to that of families who have/had missing children. Every person and every family is different, so it's not fool-proof. We are admittedly grabbing at straws in hopes of finding DeOrr or finding out what happened to him. Because DeOrr is such a cute little guy and his disappearance is such a mystery, a lot of people care about what happened to him. Strangers are organizing and raising money for large scale searches in place of the parents. (This is in addition to individual searching the family may be doing on their own.)

I'm not sure the family believes DeOrr is dead. If they did, they would not keep asking people to share his photo and call in any sightings to LE, the PI or NCMEC. If they do think he's dead, and they don't plan to use the money collected to search for his body outside the initial area, why would there still be several fund raising sites asking for money? I understand wanting to keep hope alive, but I don't understand asking other people to look for your child in places you don't think he is. I can't infer from their actions what the family thinks happened to their child. I can only go on their words and the actions they've taken, mainly on SM, to ask people to look for their abducted child.

 

[Cardinal47]

It does sound like the parents have done this in this case. The sheriff has said they are cooperating, they've taken PGs, and he's good with them. Now hopefully the investigation IS being directed towards the solution at this point.

I guess I should have included more from Marc's Klass Kids.

"The ideas and strategies laid forth in this workbook are for the extreme cases where it is confirmed or highly likely that a predatory abduction has occurred or there is evidence that the child is in immediate danger of serious bodily harm or death.

The days when a kidnapped child’s family sat passively waiting for a ransom demand are simply the unwelcome memory of failed policy. If your child is missing and you just don’t know where to turn or what to do, empower yourself to engage the battle as if it were a matter of life and death. Unfortunately, those may very well be the stakes when predators kidnap children in 21st Century America.

If your child is disappearing at the rate of one mile per minute, you must move forward quickly and decisively. Pursuing a holistic approach that encompasses the missing child’s family, law enforcement, media and volunteer services with the common goal of recovering the kidnapped child encourages cooperation and teamwork and may represent your best chance for success.

There is nothing fair about the task that faces you: your child has been kidnapped and needs you more now than ever before. You are entering a frightening emotional and logistical minefield for which you are ill prepared. As tempting as it might seem, escaping from reality is not an option. You have to stay sharp and focused so that you don’t make critical mistakes and that means refraining from alcohol or mind-altering drugs until your child is recovered."

http://klaaskids.org/missingkids/mediarelations/#opportunities

 

[rkf]

Well respectfully, that's just totally untrue. I cited weeks ago on this thread the protocols in missing children cases. It would be totally negligent for LE not to run parallel criminal investigations in all missing child cases involving small children (i.e., not teens who may have run away). Ruling out criminal activity can only be done if any such activity is investigated.

Anyone who thinks that LE has not vetted and research and scrutinized this and every other family of a missing, kid, up one side and down the other, whether there is evidence of foul play or not, or whether LE suspects it, or not, is simply uninformed.

LE is able to voice confidence about eliminating certain theories or in family members in cases like this precisely because they conduct thorough, parallel criminal investigations when a child is lost for more than a couple hours. Always.

I didn't say LE didn't investigate. I said after investigating, they did not change the people at the campsite's designation from POI to "witness" or even "we cleared them". Especially because the sheriff's office has been so sensitive about SM and rumors, I would expect them to say "After a thorough investigation, these 4 are no longer POIs" and possibly mention the passed polys or some other sanitized reason. NOT because they owe the public anything, but because early on they stated they wanted people to stop gossiping (paraphrasing). Their wishes and the parents' wishes appeared to be the same, and I'd think the sheriff's office would provide a meaningful and un-nuanced statement to bring about that desired outcome as quickly as possible. If there had not been so much talk about SM rumors (I've NEVER heard a family or LE in any case talk so much about that, but as I said, I'm not that experienced) I would not expect LE to issue an unqualified statement proclaiming their innocence. JMO

 

[gitana1]

I thought calling it a 'crime scene' is an indication that he believes a crime took place. For the word to be able to 'slip', it has to be in his mind in the first place. I don't know what the Sheriff knows, what he thinks.

Well unless he thinks the child was murdered at the campsite, which seems impossible as there was zero physical evidence found that we know of and four adults would've had to be in on it, based on the timing and facts we know, he probably just used those terms because "crime scene" is the area where physical evidence is searched for and collected. I can see why he would use that term despite no evidence of a crime.

And of course when they first came up to investigate, they had to treat the site as a crime scene or LE would be negligent.

 

[gitana1]

I am new to sleuthing, so I don't know much about any of the cases you mentioned. Other than Elizabeth Smart's case, where she was taken from her bedroom, did the other parents tell MSM that they thought their child had been kidnapped by a stranger? Or did they think something else (runaway, family kidnapping, etc.) happened to their child? Did the other families or friends of the families set up crowdfunding pages to pay for searches, posters and living expenses? Did the other families organize searches if LE gave up where the parents thought their child was lost?

I can't imagine being in the family's shoes. I don't ever want to know what it's like to be them. Since we have virtually nothing to go on, many of us are looking at their behavior to see if it is consistent with how we think we would behave if we believed our child was the victim of a stranger abduction. Of course, most of us can't actually know and hopefully will never find out. So, second option is to compare their behavior to that of families who have/had missing children. Every person and every family is different, so it's not fool-proof. We are admittedly grabbing at straws in hopes of finding DeOrr or finding out what happened to him. Because DeOrr is such a cute little guy and his disappearance is such a mystery, a lot of people care about what happened to him. Strangers are organizing and raising money for large scale searches in place of the parents. (This is in addition to individual searching the family may be doing on their own.)

I'm not sure the family believes DeOrr is dead. If they did, they would not keep asking people to share his photo and call in any sightings to LE, the PI or NCMEC. If they do think he's dead, and they don't plan to use the money collected to search for his body outside the initial area, why would there still be several fund raising sites asking for money? I understand wanting to keep hope alive, but I don't understand asking other people to look for your child in places you don't think he is. I can't infer from their actions what the family thinks happened to their child. I can only go on their words and the actions they've taken, mainly on SM, to ask people to look for their abducted child.

Who knows what those other families were thinking? And who cares? Yes, it is very helpful to examine human behavior. But we can't grasp at straws and come up with gross speculation about people who are not deemed suspects by stating they seem to have done something because they don't act like I think I would act.

When comparing them to other parents of missing kids, yes, there is a lot of variation. So that doesn't help us too much.

However, I can tell you this: Innocent people do not lawyer up and refuse to take polygraphs or cooperate. They just don't. (And please guys, don't post a bunch of posts explaining how that would be the right thing to do and why they would be justified. We are purely talking about what is normal in terms of human behavior, not what someone should do). So I can say at least that they are doing things that innocent people do. Yes, guilty people also do those things but this is a constant - not a variable - innocent people do not refuse to cooperate or lawyer up. As they have not done those things either and as there appears to be no evidence pointing at them, and as no theory anyone has proposed makes a darn lick of sense, I'm going with they are innocent of any wrongdoing.

Also, are you able to link to anything that evidences that the parents or great grandpa set up crowdfunding or are constantly asking people to share his photo and call in any sightings? Because it kind of seems to me that none of them set up crowdfunding or are asking for money and none of them have had much public activity, via social media or otherwise, asking for people to share pictures or whatever - anything at all - since mid-to late July, over a month ago.

Just because we are desperate for info or to find this little boy, doesn't mean we get to accuse people who aren't even suspects.

 

[rkf]

Well unless he thinks the child was murdered at the campsite, which seems impossible as there was zero physical evidence found that we know of and four adults would've had to be in on it, based on the timing and facts we know, he probably just used those terms because "crime scene" is the area where physical evidence is searched for and collected. I can see why he would use that term despite no evidence of a crime.

And of course when they first came up to investigate, they had to treat the site as a crime scene or LE would be negligent.

They didn't treat it as a crime scene when they first came up to investigate. That's how someone slipped in and dumped cremains during the search. If DeOrr was kidnapped from the campsite, I think it would still be a crime scene.

 

[Jamaica Me Crazy]

:tantrum:

 

[ILOKAL]

They didn't treat it as a crime scene when they first came up to investigate. That's how someone slipped in and dumped cremains during the search. If DeOrr was kidnapped from the campsite, I think it would still be a crime scene.

From what I recall the sheriff saying, I don't think the woman who spread ashes at the reservoir did so anywhere near the "crime scene".

 

[Hoosier952]

Admittedly, I jump back and forth between wandered off and human intervention, because those two options make the most sense to me with the limited media/LE information given. My questions and concerns aren't necessarily directed at the parents, they are directed at everyone here. I want to hear others' opinions. I want to see if my thoughts make sense or if I'm losing my mind. I'm curious about the sheriff's statements. I often wonder why the PI disappeared from the public eye. I wonder why the parents chose to leave a busy toddler with an aging grandparent. I wonder why the sheriff chose the day he did for the interview. I wonder why there aren't massive volunteer searches if the sheriff is convinced the child is in the woods somewhere. Does the sheriff really think that or is it just what he wants everyone else to think? We've seen LE mislead suspects before. We've also seen LE make some huge mistakes. We've seen innocent people locked up and we've seen guilty people running free. Forgive me if I have some questions, ya know?

 

[gitana1]

They didn't treat it as a crime scene when they first came up to investigate. That's how someone slipped in and dumped cremains during the search. If DeOrr was kidnapped from the campsite, I think it would still be a crime scene.

I think they did treat it like a crime scene after the first couple of hours when it became clear Deorr wasn't going to found right away. People can breach crime scenes and do.

 

[rkf]

From what I recall the sheriff saying, I don't think the woman who spread ashes at the reservoir did so anywhere near the "crime scene".

Nate Eaton: Talk a little bit about the cremains that were dumped into, because the dogs were getting a scent.

Sheriff Bowerman: Right. Unbeknownst to us while we were doing our grid search, someone came in and wanted to deposit cremains of a loved one at that site, and I’m assuming it’s a favorite site of their loved one, and without thinking, they deposited cremains, not realizing they were in the middle of a crime scene and what it would do.

[video=youtube;FV-h82eVQ1M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FV-h82eVQ1M[/video]