ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #18

[Rayemonde]

Thanks gliving for sharing this ...also something else in this article that was new to me:


Vilt even said in an interview on Wednesday that during a reenactment of the disappearance held in September at the campsite where DeOrr disappeared, Kunz Sr. and Mitchell were upset when a local TV news crew showed up.

“If you’re the mother or father of a missing child, why wouldn't you want this to be covered by the media?” Vilt said. “You would want to get the word out to everybody. It was all just suspicious.”

Very hinky to me too. If this was a family private moment (i.e. funeral etc.), I can understand giving them space from media, as I have dealt with this, but this situation was another opportunity to get this baby's story more coverage. I don't understand. MOO

Remember when the footage was shown from that... I thought at the time that the family looked like they were sulking and avoiding the cameras. So I absolutely believe Vilt that the parents were upset about the news crew showing up.

 

[bluesneakers]

<modsnip>

He was up there with SAR and they were letting him search potentially dangerous bear dens. Doesn't sound right to me.

 

[ILOKAL]

I did post about this a few pages back, actually. Not even just to hear his story, but to get a better picture of who he is, etc.
I see things that seem conflicting to me about how capable he is. Some things I see paint a picture of a feeble, fragile old man. Then I see that he drove his truck and camping rig all the way up there. Surely someone with dementia and failing memory wouldn't be trusted to do that. I guess it puzzles me because so many were questioning how wise it was to leave an active two year old in the care of this old man. Yet if he was with it enough to be hauling that camper up there he should be capable of watching the baby so close to the parents for a short time.
Which brings me to this thought: if he is in poor mental health that he can't remember things and therefore was expected to not do well on the polygraph then why in the world was he allowed to be driving? And towing a camper at that? Yikes!

I've wondered some of those very same things. First of all, if someone (in this case two people) is expected not to do well on a polygraph, why would it be administered in the first place. In one of Bowerman's interviews, he said that GGPA wasn't very cooperative. He gave an example. But to me it seemed like the example Bowerman gave made GGPA seem deliberately ornery and wasn't going to give a straight answer no matter what. Also odd, when Reinwand's was asked if he and GGPA are still friends, he said he hadn't seen him throughout the winter and that he had "heard" GGPA was on oxygen. Yet, ever since little DeOrr disappeared, it has been reported that GGPA already WAS on oxygen 24/7. IMO

 

[Rayemonde]

The news footage from the re-enactment. With the parents avoiding the cameras.
http://m.localnews8.com/news/kunz-family-reenacts-toddlers-disappearance/35281146

 

[bluesneakers]

IR never stated that he saw him alive. just that he saw him.

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/isaac-reinwand-i-had-nothing-to-do-with-deorrs-disappearance/

EATON: What do you remember what happened up there?

REINWAND: I don&#8217;t want to comment on that.

EATON: Do you remember the last time you saw little DeOrr?

REINWAND: No comment.

EATON: But he was up there?

REINWAND: Yes, he was.

EATON: He was up there, you saw him, you know he was there.

REINWAND: Yes.

23:00
Bessie: I&#8217;d like to go back to the friend, Isaac Reinwand, and, if you can just tell us, you said that he said about 1:00 p.m. was the last time he saw them and that would include Deorr&#8212;little Deorr? Has he said that he saw Deorr alive and well about 1:00 p.m.?

23:24
SB: The mother said that they got back at 1:10 p.m. Isaac doesn&#8217;t dispute that. He&#8217;s not watching a clock or a watch or anything of that sort, but he concurs that it was around that time period. They got back shortly after 1:00 p.m. The parents decide to go down to the creek to go fishing. Deorr remains behind. He&#8217;s not real privy to what the conversation was between grandpa and the parents, but he knows that just the three of them go down to the creek&#8212;Mom, Dad & Isaac.

24:03
Bessie: &#8230;and Isaac. So we know at least as of around 1:00 p.m., 1:10 p.m. or somewhere in there&#8230;1:30 &#8211; 1:10 1:30, little Deorr was alive and well.

24:15
SB: Exactly.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Timelines-and-Maps-**NO-DISCUSSION-quot/page4

 

[Rayemonde]

But twice the sheriff stated he's not 100% confident he was there.

Here, grab the other side of my hula-hoop and we'll trace where it goes.

I wonder if the sheriff is just being super cautious, like he is about so many things? In an earlier interview before Christmas, he said he couldn't remember if the clerk said they saw DeOrr or not. He wasn't sure if there was cctv footage. He thinks they probably would have got the receipt from the store. How can you not be sure about that?

 

[Rayemonde]

I was just looking over the media timeline for other things the sheriff hasn't been certain about, and I noticed this from July 13th:

An aunt posts: "Little man is missing and has possibly been abducted. Vehicles to look out for is older light blue GMC/Chevy late 80s early 90s, also possibly a black truck - unknown model."

A black truck. Mentioned right at the start as a vehicle possibly used to abduct Deorr, before Vilt came into the scene... Where did that come from? Was that referring to the "filthy, bawling" DeOrr rumour - the rumour that the parents themselves started, imo?

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Media-Timelines-and-Maps-**NO-DISCUSSION-quot

 

[1&2&3]

Thank you Bluesneakers for remembering the original story about the nap. I remember it distinctly and it sure fell out of the parents story quickly! And if one hasn't been following this case since the beginning, people will think we are crazy.

Another issue that concerns me is how did IR know what time it was when he gave that 1:00-1:30 time frame? He didn't have a watch so someone had to tell him the time period. Right? He was fishing so he could care less what the time was.

The thing with GGP seems like he is being shielded. With a memory problem as claimed, who knows what he will come out with - the truth, perhaps? One never knows with a <modsnip>. If so, what is he doing driving a vehicle pulling a camper?

My opinions only.

 

[gliving]

I wonder if the sheriff is just being super cautious, like he is about so many things? In an earlier interview before Christmas, he said he couldn't remember if the clerk said they saw DeOrr or not. He wasn't sure if there was cctv footage. He thinks they probably would have got the receipt from the store. How can you not be sure about that?

Rayemonde, I imagine the Sheriff visits with the County Attorney for guidance. He's going to be very careful not to say anything that might jeopardize a future trial. I'd love to be in that loop.

 

[Hatfield]

I wonder if the sheriff is just being super cautious, like he is about so many things? In an earlier interview before Christmas, he said he couldn't remember if the clerk said they saw DeOrr or not. He wasn't sure if there was cctv footage. He thinks they probably would have got the receipt from the store. How can you not be sure about that?

I actually kind of like this Sheriff but I do get the impression he is very careful about not saying something if he doesn't know for sure.

The one thing I am happy to hear is it does sound like a large amount of resources have gone into this and also that it is continuing to an extent.

I am holding out hope that the FBI or that other LE department he mentioned will be able to break the case. I am not sure how they will be able to break the case unless either someone comes clean or maybe some physical evidence gets uncovered somewhere.

Ive always wondered if the evidence LE needs is going to be found somewhere other than at that campground area. I guess I feel they have searched it so much that the break in the case is going to come from somewhere else. Maybe quite a distance from that area.

 

[bluesneakers]

Thank you Bluesneakers for remembering the original story about the nap. I remember it distinctly and it sure fell out of the parents story quickly! And if one hasn't been following this case since the beginning, people will think we are crazy.

Another issue that concerns me is how did IR know what time it was when he gave that 1:00-1:30 time frame? He didn't have a watch so someone had to tell him the time period. Right? He was fishing so he could care less what the time was.

The thing with GGP seems like he is being shielded. With a memory problem as claimed, who knows what he will come out with - the truth, perhaps? One never knows with a dementia person, if he really is that feeble minded. If so, what is he doing driving a vehicle pulling a camper?

My opinions only.

If LE know for sure what time they were at the store and what time they called 911 maybe IR putting them at the campsite between the two times is close enough. I agree he probably wasn't checking the time.

 

[1&2&3]

I wonder if the sheriff is just being super cautious, like he is about so many things? In an earlier interview before Christmas, he said he couldn't remember if the clerk said they saw DeOrr or not. He wasn't sure if there was cctv footage. He thinks they probably would have got the receipt from the store. How can you not be sure about that?

It is beginning to sound like he is not remembering facts - on purpose, I imagine.
We, who have followed this case know these answers. I am not going to post them. Perhaps he is trying to confuse a few people to see if their story changes.

 

[Onebest]

The news footage from the re-enactment. With the parents avoiding the cameras.
http://m.localnews8.com/news/kunz-family-reenacts-toddlers-disappearance/35281146

Ok so this is September 15 and Vilt states he is sure there was an abduction and he is positive the parents had nothing to do with baby Deoors disappearance and then TEN days later, he writes them a scathing letter accusing them of committing a possible crime one.
http://590kid.com/2016/01/27/letter-from-investigate-for-the-deorr-kunz-case/

So what happened in 10 days to totally change his opinion? I wonder if this was the time the reward was going to be offered and the parents declined? Perhaps he was waiting payment for expenses and it didn't come so he was angry? I wonder what he is referring to what he says he had told them he would withdraw from the investigation if in his professional opinion, both of you (the parents) lied and misrepresented true facts.....Sorry can't cut and paste from this link with the letter but you can read it there. I am wondering? What happened?

JMO

 

[scmom]

From the transcript of last night's radio show with SB.
02:13
SB: Well, after a pretty intense investigation and what I consider a lengthy investigation, we asked all the parties involved to take polygraphs. We were expecting a couple of them to come back inconclusive, and that would be the grandfather and the grandfather&#8217;s friend. However, the first polygraph indicated that the parents were being less than truthful, and that concerned me, but you know I take polygraphs with a certain grain of salt so&#8230; I sent out their interviews to the FBI, their Behavioral Team. They examined them and found multiple inconsistencies, and so we asked them to re-polygraph, and they said they would, and the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th polygraphs, the same conclusion was made by the experts that they are being less than truthful. They know what happened and where Deorr is currently.
03:35
SB: You know I dwelled on that fact for a long time but I have to trust the experts. They say when both people failed the same questions multiple times, there is something there and they&#8217;re being less than truthful, so I have to trust the experts.

20:07
SB: Absolutely. I didn&#8217;t want them to think their whole polygraph was deceptive. It wasn&#8217;t. They passed portions of it, but the portions on whether they knew where Deorr was or knew what happened to him, they were not being&#8230;they were being less than truthful . So that&#8217;s why I changed it. I didn&#8217;t want them to think&#8230;normally you think when someone is deceptive everything they told you is a lie but that&#8217;s not the case.

 

[Rayemonde]

From Vilt's Sept 2015 radio interview:

a lady called me from Swan Valley. She had been in Swan Valley. She lives in the Idaho Falls area, and she said that she has four little blonde boys and they were hiking in the Palisades Campground area... she saw this man who was in his mid 50&#8217;s with grey-white hair staring &#8220;obsessively&#8221; at her boys... He was driving this &#8220;really expensive looking black Rubicon, Jeep Rubicon,&#8221; and so she called in the Tip Line...

So I called Deorr, the boy&#8217;s father, and I said, &#8220;Have you seen any vehicles outside the store in Leadore before you went back to the campground prior to the time your son went missing?&#8221; and he said, &#8220;Yeah, I saw a brand-new, brand new very expensive looking black Rubicon Jeep."

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Timelines-and-Maps-**NO-DISCUSSION-quot/page3

Well! Fancy that! The lady refused to be identified in any way, she happened to be from Idaho Falls, and according to Vilt, she and Vernal used almost exactly the same words to describe the vehicle... Anyone else think this was a set up by the parents?

 

[Aeronomy]

11:10
Bessie: Right, I remember you telling us the last time. One of the other questions that comes up a lot is about the dog searches and the cadaver dogs, and we know that they were thrown off by the cremains in the reservoir, but before or after that did the&#8230;did either the scent dogs or the cadaver dogs alert or show any, you know, find anything that was relevant?

11:43
SB: You know, we had a couple alerts you know that were just kind of, we consider nothing major, but um a dog reacts unusual in a certain area and so we put more dogs in there and then the other dogs alerted so, um&#8230;you know. Actually, it&#8217;s been not real positive from having those dogs in there. We didn&#8217;t have anything that really led us to a certain place within our 3 mile radius.
http://www.truecrimeradio.com/radio-archives/sheriff-lynn-bowerman-radio-archive-jan-2016/

No, I don't know . . . and I really want to know which dogs alerted and why it hasn't been real positive having the dogs in there. Did it cause more confusion?

 

[Rayemonde]

Ok so this is September 15 and Vilt states he is sure there was an abduction and he is positive the parents had nothing to do with baby Deoors disappearance and then TEN days later, he writes them a scathing letter accusing them of committing a possible crime one.
http://590kid.com/2016/01/27/letter-from-investigate-for-the-deorr-kunz-case/

So what happened in 10 days to totally change his opinion? I wonder if this was the time the reward was going to be offered and the parents declined? Perhaps he was waiting payment for expenses and it didn't come so he was angry? I wonder what he is referring to what he says he had told them he would withdraw from the investigation if in his professional opinion, both of you (the parents) lied and misrepresented true facts.....Sorry can't cut and paste from this link with the letter but you can read it there. I am wondering? What happened?

JMO

JMO, but the parent look really really annoyed in that video. Vilt is doing his best to do the re-enactment by himself for the cameras, with the family not co-operating at all. I should think that once the family were alone with Vilt afterwards there was a blazing row about him inviting the media there against their wishes. He wanted a lot of publicity, they didn't. That made him very suspicious. JMO.

 

[bluesneakers]

From Vilt's Sept 2015 radio interview:



http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Timelines-and-Maps-**NO-DISCUSSION-quot/page3

Well! Fancy that! The lady refused to be identified in any way, she happened to be from Idaho Falls, and according to Vilt, she and Vernal used almost exactly the same words to describe the vehicle... Anyone else think this was a set up by the parents?

Yes. Otherwise the expensive looking black Rubicon Jeep would have been on the list with the older, light blue GMC/Chevy and the black truck.

 

[Hatfield]

Ok so this is September 15 and Vilt states he is sure there was an abduction and he is positive the parents had nothing to do with baby Deoors disappearance and then TEN days later, he writes them a scathing letter accusing them of committing a possible crime one.
http://590kid.com/2016/01/27/letter-from-investigate-for-the-deorr-kunz-case/

So what happened in 10 days to totally change his opinion? I wonder if this was the time the reward was going to be offered and the parents declined? Perhaps he was waiting payment for expenses and it didn't come so he was angry? I wonder what he is referring to what he says he had told them he would withdraw from the investigation if in his professional opinion, both of you (the parents) lied and misrepresented true facts.....Sorry can't cut and paste from this link with the letter but you can read it there. I am wondering? What happened?

JMO

It is interesting isn't it. Not sure why he did the 180 but just glad he seemed to be honest about holding to his convictions.

I also am impressed with Klein with agreeing with the Sheriff:

"Our investigation has not uncovered any information that contradicts his statement," he said in a prepared comment."

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/cri...ld-idaho-boy-named-suspects-article-1.2508952

 

[Rayemonde]

Many people with dementia retain learned skills and are able to drive safely for some time after diagnosis. However, as dementia progresses beyond the early stages it has serious effects on memory, reactions, perception and the ability to perform even simple tasks. People with dementia will, therefore, eventually lose the ability to drive. The stage at which this happens will be different for each person but, according to research, most people stop driving within three years after the first signs of the disease...

Someone with dementia may be very reluctant to stop driving even if DVLA/DVLNI has concluded that they are not safe to drive.

https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/site/scripts/documents_info.php?documentID=144