ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #6

[wondering25]

You're right. Thanks.

After "5 campers" was changed to "4 campers" the meaning was clear.

I like the way Jules thinks.. my ? now is what about the diaper? Is that proof of anything or was that a "plant"?

 

[SweetT]

Odd you should say that. I got the same feeling right after LE gave the first presser. Also odd you should mention Kyron; if I remember correctly weren't some people suggesting some things should not be talked about right at the get go? Don't mean to go OT, just thought I heard a bell ringing.

I'm starting to get rather upset by this case and the memory of a few others.


:cow:

I guess I missed that conversation...wish I knew what that was about.

 

[ILOKAL]

I don't think this is a case of an animal attack.
I don't think this is a stranger abduction.
I dont' think the child wandered into the water.
These are things that I think did not happen. That leaves me with... (?) IDK what happened then. ......Or I cant say.

Do you think he got lost in the forest?

 

[wenwe4]

Still no information? I have been checking in from time to time.

 

[BeeFriendly]

I'd expect dogs to pick up a scent in that case.

Which day were the dogs brought in? The 10th or the 11th? I read somewhere they were brought in the second or third day. Does anyone have that information? Per Dk's statement on the 13th, he said he made some calls and 75 people showed up. I'd like to know if the dogs were used before the area was trampled. If this has been discussed before I apologize.

 

[katydid23]

To me, it makes more sense to compare this "case" to the "cases" of other children who disappeared in a forest, campground, state park, woods, etc, some whose bodies were eventually found and others who have not been found.

Yes. That would be one way to categorize them. But another way might be to categorize them as minors who went mysteriously missing while in their family's care. And in that sense it does not necessarily matter if they went missing from their crib or their car seat or the fire pit. JMO

 

[TeaTime]

If the child was NEVER at the campsite then GGP and IR would have to lie to LE and say that he was there, because they were asked. But, LE continued to search. If either one of them said "I never saw him at all" this whole thing would have been conducted differently. Although I can't imagine it to be true, GGP might lie and take the position of being the one who last saw the baby, there is absolutely no reason for IR to lie about seeing the baby there - he didn't know the parents at all.

The dogs put the baby at the campsite and no where else. They only went to the reservoir because the smell of the cremains in the air drew them there. They didn't follow DeOrr's track/scent there.

He was taken from the campsite, carried away or in a vehicle. It is the ONLY explanation.

 

[katydid23]

If the child was NEVER at the campsite then GGP and IR would have to lie to LE and say that he was there, because they were asked and LE continued to search. If either one of them said "I never saw him at all" this whole thing would have been conducted differently. Although I can't imagine it to be true, GGP might lie and take the position of being the one who last saw the baby, but there is absolutely no reason for IR to lie about seeing the baby there - he didn't know the parents at all.

The dogs put the baby at the campsite and no where else. They only went to the reservoir because the smell of the cremains drew them there, they didn't follow DeOrr's scent there.

He was taken from the campsite, carried away or in a vehicle. It is the ONLY explanation.

That is quite possible. But I wonder why GGP and IR never saw or heard that happen?

 

[Trident]

That is quite possible. But I wonder why GGP and IR never saw or heard that happen?

It sounds to me like GGP and IR never saw or heard anything, not even that they were supposed to be watching the child.

My opinion only

 

[ILOKAL]

Yes. That would be one way to categorize them. But another way might be to categorize them as minors who went mysteriously missing while in their family's care. And in that sense it does not necessarily matter if they went missing from their crib or their car seat or the fire pit. JMO

I have to disagree. Since we have the information that Little Deorr disappeared/vanished from a forest, that information surely needs to be used in comparing his disappearance to others. Of course, if one prefers to look in another direction and omit the circumstances in this and other very similar cases, they will certainly be drawn to a conclusion, valid or not. JMO

 

[IDTater]

If the child was NEVER at the campsite then GGP and IR would have to lie to LE and say that he was there, because they were asked. But, LE continued to search. If either one of them said "I never saw him at all" this whole thing would have been conducted differently. Although I can't imagine it to be true, GGP might lie and take the position of being the one who last saw the baby, there is absolutely no reason for IR to lie about seeing the baby there - he didn't know the parents at all.

The dogs put the baby at the campsite and no where else. They only went to the reservoir because the smell of the cremains in the air drew them there. They didn't follow DeOrr's track/scent there.

He was taken from the campsite, carried away or in a vehicle. It is the ONLY explanation.

BBM. Sometimes people are distrustful of LE or they have things to hide. Maybe they have a criminal history, maybe they're currently engaged in criminal conduct, maybe they're just anti-establishment types who post anti-LE stuff on their SM accounts. All purely speculative reasons about why someone - not anyone in this case - might avoid anything related to LE. Just my opinion, of course.

 

[TeaTime]

I do not think IR was near the campsite at the time of the disappearance based on what he said to the reporter which was "as far as I know, he just disappeared". It seems he is only repeating what he heard.

GGP may have been in the bathroom for a few minutes and he may be hard of hearing. We know very little about the actual location of all the players, we only know that mom and dad say they were 150 feet away (50 yards).

 

[ILOKAL]

That is quite possible. But I wonder why GGP and IR never saw or heard that happen?

Some predators, particularly mountain lions, take their prey instantly without making a sound after having stalked the prey for even an hour or more. The lion sees YOU - YOU don't see or HEAR the lion nor the attack. Instantly - silently - just like that!

 

[IDTater]

Has anyone gone back over all the articles pertaining to the dogs and scent? I just did a very quick search and confirmed they had both scent dogs and cadaver dogs. I also found the articles that said the dogs led searchers to the reservoir twice.

Can anyone find any other articles that say anything about other scent trails or not finding any other scent trails? It was posted in previous threads that the dogs kept circling and coming back to camp. Does anyone know where I can find that?

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk

Apparently Sheriff Bowerman discussed it in a report to the county commissioners.

http://lemhiweb.com/content/search-recap

Bowerman said the trained search dogs found nothing and kept coming back to the camp.

 

[katydid23]

I have to disagree. Since we have the information that Little Deorr disappeared/vanished from a forest, that information surely needs to be used in comparing his disappearance to others. Of course, if one prefers to look in another direction and omit the circumstances in this and other very similar cases, they will certainly be drawn to a conclusion, valid or not. JMO

Where did I 'compare' his disappearance to the others. All I said was that it might never be solved. Like way too many other cases. SOME of those unsolved cases happened in forests, others happened in cities, and others in rural areas. So I am not categorizing this case by 'where it happened' because it has nothing to do with what I was discussing. Cold case files include a myriad of locations, sadly enough.

 

[katydid23]

Some predators, particularly mountain lions, take their prey instantly without making a sound after having stalked the prey for even an hour or more. The lion sees YOU - YOU don't see or HEAR the lion nor the attack. Instantly - silently - just like that!

If a mountain lion walked right up to the campsite, would they see his tracks when they began searching? Woulds the scent dogs have picked up the trail? Would the cadaver dogs have found his scent nearby where they left his scattered remains?

 

[rkf]

I agree but what strikes me about that is..Who and why is someone who is involved in SAR breaking into vehicles and stealing stuff ? I'd want to know who did that...seems like an unscrupulous person IMO

From what I understand, people started showing up to search soon after DK and JM called friends and family. I don't think everyone at the site early on was SAR and LE. 175 or so people showed up to help and one of them was a thief. Now that I type that, I see why they wouldn't want to talk about it. But then who tried to force the subject from off camera and why? What rumor could have included the EMT bag and DeOrr? Maybe the rumor wasn't related to DeOrr at all? Just DK/JM friends and family?

 

[ILOKAL]

If a mountain lion walked right up to the campsite, would they see his tracks when they began searching? Woulds the scent dogs have picked up the trail? Would the cadaver dogs have found his scent nearby where they left his scattered remains?

No - No - and No! (scattered remains?? Nearby?)

IF the lion walked "right up to the campsite" GGP and/or Isaac would have seen it, no?

 

[pappa rob]

If a mountain lion walked right up to the campsite, would they see his tracks when they began searching? Woulds the scent dogs have picked up the trail? Would the cadaver dogs have found his scent nearby where they left his scattered remains?

If the ground is hard, dry, rocky no you'll find no tracks unless it's dusty. Dogs are only as good as the people handling them. Most times you'll have difficulty seeing the remains as cat's cache their kill under leaves and brush.

 

[Mickshawn]

Apparently Sheriff Bowerman discussed it in a report to the county commissioners.

http://lemhiweb.com/content/search-recap

~~The search dogs coming back to the camp: Even if DeOrr walked 5 or 10 steps at the camp, that would be a short trail to follow, right....? But NO trail at all...really weird. I wonder if they actually smelled him (his actual body) at the campsite or was it just his stuff...like his blanket.

<modsnip>