ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #9

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You know.. This child was 2 and 1/2. Why was he unsteady on his feet per the grandpa he lived with? I have had a 2 and 1/2 year old. I also have worked as a nurse in various positions and one was pediatrics for almost 5 years. 2 and 1/2 year olds dont toddle.. that is a child who is learning to walk. At 2 and 1/2 years old they walk VERY well. To say he cannot walk on level ground without falling down is concerning. Did he have a physician? Was this ever addressed? Did he have a lot of injuries from falling down? I would like to see this baby's medical records if i was LE. JMO

Good friends of ours have a little guy who will be 4 this fall and is just now starting to run. He's still not very steady on his feet. Until recently the dr said he was just slow developing physically. He's now going through genetic testing (can't recall the name of what they're testing for, other than he's still super flexible). Typical development otherwise. Not sure DeOrr walking vs toddling is here nor there but I noticed he looks a little bow legged in the picture, it's possible he wasn't as stable as some other 2 1/2 year olds.
 
I have a bad feeling about this case becoming a cold case.

Unless there is an arrest or unless someone happens to find the boy I don't see how any new information is going to be obtained.

It seems it became a cold case right after it started. This case reminds me of the Lisa Irwin case. It hit a stuck point right after it started.
 
[FONT=Open Sans, sans-serif]"We'll wait until we get the report from the FBI," Bowerman said. "It's going to be critical in this case."[/FONT]

[FONT=Open Sans, sans-serif]So, IMO..there is something that he/LE is questioning that doesnt line-up with witness statements, timelines or something. Behavioral analysis and physical evidence have been sent to the FBI. I am sure that also includes the 4 polygraph tests. It may also include the webcams from the highways. What is "critical"? Death from drowning, animals etc vs criminal disappearance would be critical to the investigation IMO. Ruling IN or ruling OUT someone would be critical. Having enough to make an arrest and a successful prosecution would be "critical". It is not going to matter if the baby was at the red X on the map or the green X on the map.. the polys, statements and behavioral and physical evidence will tell the story..JMO

[/FONT]http://www.kxlh.com/story/29826537/idaho-sheriff-opens-up-about-missing-toddler-case
 
The circumstances described by the sheriff, along with the explanation of where all parties were supposed to be when little Deorr went missing do not make sense to me. The time he was missing has to be wrong or the order of events has to be wrong imo. Looking at the map ClaireNC put up it seems so simple but it is anything but. Five weeks later not one trace of that baby boy.

And for what its worth I think even an adult could have tumbled down that bank with the wrong shoes or a misstep. Again jmo
 
Personally, I think there is something off with the grandfather's comments that little DeOrr can't walk on level ground without falling. I just get an impression that DeOrr sr's father is the type of person that exaggerates when he speaks, like an old time story-teller. There are just some people that generally do that when they speak.

In the long interview, dad said "he's a goer and a mover but he does not go away from his parents" and "He's pretty small for his age but he moves pretty good, and that was our concern." I don't think little DeOrr had that much trouble getting around. He is 2 1/2, not a toddler just learning to walk. IMO

So, who do you believe? We have baby Deorr's GGP who was not on the trip and lives with the baby saying he is unsteady and Dad saying he was a mover and goer? .. Who was trying to convince whom? IMO, this child was not nimble on his feet..and then add the over-sized cowboy boots. Why would the GGP who lives with the baby emphasize the baby falls down a lot and is not steady on his feet? Maybe because it is true...JMO
http://www.ktvb.com/story/news/loca...andfather-believes-boy-was-abducted/30321903/
 
[FONT=Open Sans, sans-serif]"We'll wait until we get the report from the FBI," Bowerman said. "It's going to be critical in this case."[/FONT]

[FONT=Open Sans, sans-serif]So, IMO..there is something that he/LE is questioning that doesnt line-up with witness statements, timelines or something. Behavioral analysis and physical evidence have been sent to the FBI. I am sure that also includes the 4 polygraph tests. It may also include the webcams from the highways. What is "critical"? Death from drowning, animals etc vs criminal disappearance would be critical to the investigation IMO. Ruling IN or ruling OUT someone would be critical. Having enough to make an arrest and a successful prosecution would be "critical". It is not going to matter if the baby was at the red X on the map or the green X on the map.. the polys, statements and behavioral and physical evidence will tell the story..JMO

[/FONT]http://www.kxlh.com/story/29826537/idaho-sheriff-opens-up-about-missing-toddler-case

I think they have nothing. I don't think there is a big piece of evidence we don't know about. My hunch is he wandered off and succumbed to the elements or drowned.

I could be wrong of course. JMO.
 
So, who do you believe? We have baby Deorr's GGP who was not on the trip and lives with the baby saying he is unsteady and Dad saying he was a mover and goer? .. Who was trying to convince whom? IMO, this child was not nimble on his feet..and then add the over-sized cowboy boots. Why would the GGP who lives with the baby emphasize the baby falls down a lot and is not steady on his feet? Maybe because it is true...JMO















http://www.people.com/article/idaho-parents-search-toddler-missing-5-days

Maybe he's unsteady because he wears shoes/boots too big for him?
 
I think they have nothing. I don't think there is a big piece of evidence we don't know about. My hunch is he wandered off and succumbed to the elements or drowned.

I could be wrong of course. JMO.

If there is truly nothing, why did they bring in the "big guns" (FBI)? Is that typical in cases where LE thinks a child just walked off and succumbed to the elements? IMO, not.
 
Good friends of ours have a little guy who will be 4 this fall and is just now starting to run. He's still not very steady on his feet. Until recently the dr said he was just slow developing physically. He's now going through genetic testing (can't recall the name of what they're testing for, other than he's still super flexible). Typical development otherwise. Not sure DeOrr walking vs toddling is here nor there but I noticed he looks a little bow legged in the picture, it's possible he wasn't as stable as some other 2 1/2 year olds.

Could be testing your friends' little guy for Ehler-Danlos syndrome -- which is really not diagnosed as often as it occurs, ime. (I have hypermobility type and wasn't diagnosed until this year -- and I'm old, lol).

But yeah, DeOrr may be a little unsteady due to genetic or other problems, which may not have even been diagnosed yet due to his age.
 
So, who do you believe? We have baby Deorr's GGP who was not on the trip and lives with the baby saying he is unsteady and Dad saying he was a mover and goer? .. Who was trying to convince whom? IMO, this child was not nimble on his feet..and then add the over-sized cowboy boots. Why would the GGP who lives with the baby emphasize the baby falls down a lot and is not steady on his feet? Maybe because it is true...JMO

http://www.people.com/article/idaho-parents-search-toddler-missing-5-days

They could have both been telling the truth. Kids can get around in a lot more ways than running and walking. I had one who literally rolled everywhere until he finally started crawling.
 
I have a bad feeling about this case becoming a cold case.

Unless there is an arrest or unless someone happens to find the boy I don't see how any new information is going to be obtained.

It seems it became a cold case right after it started. This case reminds me of the Lisa Irwin case. It hit a stuck point right after it started.

There is at least some physical evidence of something as well as some kind of "behavioral" evidence (whatever that means). I think they either strongly suspect or have some evidence of something, which really gives me hope that this will be solved. They may even be able to apply pressure using that evidence to get their suspect to bring them to DeOrr.
 
IR looked like he was just woken up. If someone interviewed me before coffee they'd be lucky that anything was coherent and I didn't growl and grumble the entire time. No one talks to me before coffee.
I know I wouldn't answer the door half naked and possibly just fresh from a wake and bake then talk incoherently.
I might open the door and say "no comment"

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
 
Good friends of ours have a little guy who will be 4 this fall and is just now starting to run. He's still not very steady on his feet. Until recently the dr said he was just slow developing physically. He's now going through genetic testing (can't recall the name of what they're testing for, other than he's still super flexible). Typical development otherwise. Not sure DeOrr walking vs toddling is here nor there but I noticed he looks a little bow legged in the picture, it's possible he wasn't as stable as some other 2 1/2 year olds.

My middle daughter is dyspraxic and has hyper mobility. She is 16 and can still fall over nothing. At 2.5 years old she was on her butt (usually in a puddle) more than she was on her feet. She couldn't ride a bike without stabilisers until she was 7 and even then she would fall off more than stay on. She would run about at 2.5 years old, she could get to where she needed too, but not without tripping over nothing, her own feet, a shadow, falling into EVERY puddle that was near and so on.
 
They could have both been telling the truth. Kids can get around in a lot more ways than running and walking. I had one who literally rolled everywhere until he finally started crawling.

Haha, I had a roller too! It was so cute and funny! I love the "commando crawlers" too!
 
IIRC, the FBI does not investigate missing persons unless there is evidence of a kidnapping (ransom note or other firm proof). When I mix that with the sheriff referring to the site as a crime scene, I believe there is proof of foul play that we are not privy to. There is something in the physical evidence that the sheriff turned over to the FBI that points toward that, IMO. Behavioral evidence is one thing and is open to strong interpretation even by experts but physical evidence is compelling. Thank you to those of you that also found the sheriff's description of the site as a crime scene to be a red flag.

For those that have pondered the relationship between GGP and IR, the RUMOR is they are acquainted through AA. This could very well be the reason why the form of their relationship has not been disclosed because those engaged in AA are to remain anonymous.
 
I'm sure LE knows if there are security cameras in Leadore or not. Our town population is a little less than 4,000 people. Three years ago we got security cameras put inside and outside our small store. The city police actually stopped and told us how pleased they were that we were doing that. They actually noticed them. They have needed to come into our store twice to view our cameras for other things not concerning our business.

This town is 100? Believe me, they know.

I also wonder why they are protecting GGP so much. He was the last person to see Deorr. Isn't that the norm to interview the last person seeing the missing person? He can't be that mentally off/unstable if he is able to do a polygraph.

One more thing...I swear I heard the Sherriff say in the uncut interview it was a 20 minute trip to the Stage shop. We thought it was 40 here. But when I listened to it again, I didn't hear that. Maybe I heard it on a different version? The edited version wouldn't have anything on it that the uncut version had. Or maybe I re-listened to the edited version. I'm confused where I heard that.
 
"If he's in the water up there he was taken up there. He cannot walk on level ground without falling down. His little, short legs they can't walk up hill, he can't walk on level ground. He would have fallen and if he would have fallen he would have been crying. He didn't get up there by himself," DeOrr Kunz said.
This was by GGP who was not on the trip. He lives with the baby. The baby is 2 and 1/2. We are not talking about a child who rolls or crawls.. the GGP is specifically addressing his ggson's ability to AMBULATE..to WALK. . I am confident this child hasnt been wearing cowboy boots exclusively since he was of walking age. While the oversized boots dont help, he doesnt sleep with them on .. walks barefoot, at times i am sure.. and gets out of the bathtub barefoot. Without over-analyzing this.. IMO there is a problem with the boy's ability to walk. The fact that he is bowlegged might indicate rickets or some other problem or might mean nothing when assessing his ability to ambulate. BUT.. we have 2 conflicting statement.. one from GGP and one from Dad. JMO
 
I'm sure LE knows if there are security cameras in Leadore or not. Our town population is a little less than 4,000 people. Three years ago we got security cameras put inside and outside our small store. The city police actually stopped and told us how pleased they were that we were doing that. They actually noticed them. They have needed to come into our store twice to view our cameras for other things not concerning our business.

This town is 100? Believe me, they know.

I also wonder why they are protecting GGP so much. He was the last person to see Deorr. Isn't that the norm to interview the last person seeing the missing person? He can't be that mentally off/unstable if he is able to do a polygraph.

One more thing...I swear I heard the Sherriff say in the uncut interview it was a 20 minute trip to the Stage shop. We thought it was 40 here. But when I listened to it again, I didn't hear that. Maybe I heard it on a different version? The edited version wouldn't have anything on it that the uncut version had. Or maybe I re-listened to the edited version. I'm confused where I heard that.

Perhaps they were at the Stage Stop for 20 min. Because it would really be difficult (impossible?) For someone to drive from the campsite to Leadore in 20 min. You can't drive that fast on that road. I think the 40 min travel time is most correct.

This has likely been brought up before, but could the sheriff handed the case to the fbi due to his personal family connections? That would be a huge conflict of interest and it would be hard to look beyond the people you "thought you knew" to get down to the cold hard facts of the case. The fbi would be unbiased in their scrutiny of the case.
 
I am so happy to see a softening in attitude towards the Sherrif and reporter here at Websleuths last night. This event is also very traumatic for officers that went out to save a baby and came back empty handed. The sherrif doesn't have to be a good speaker or show emotion for me to grasp that this case will mist likely haunt him for the rest of his life.
As for Nate, I think he has to avoid areas of questioning that could compromise this case.
In any event, I wish I lived nearby for one weekend. I would like to get six people together wearing those thigh high fishing boots and carry poles and walk that cursed creek and turn over every damned rock and poke every single bump until I am personally satisfied this sweet boy is not right there just waiting to be found. I don't usually get these urges either. (modsnip) JMO, MOO.

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
 
So, who do you believe? We have baby Deorr's GGP who was not on the trip and lives with the baby saying he is unsteady and Dad saying he was a mover and goer? .. Who was trying to convince whom? IMO, this child was not nimble on his feet..and then add the over-sized cowboy boots. Why would the GGP who lives with the baby emphasize the baby falls down a lot and is not steady on his feet? Maybe because it is true...JMO
http://www.ktvb.com/story/news/loca...andfather-believes-boy-was-abducted/30321903/

We can agree to disagree on this one and that is totally fine. From listening to the interviews, I happen to believe the father on this one. I just get the impression that Grandpa is a bit of a "storyteller". That is not a bad thing, I know some gentlemen that are like that. The type of people that tell great stories when you are all sitting around the campfire. Are they always accurate? No. But they are entertaining to listen to. IMO
 
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