Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #47

[gumchew]

When I first started here I was guilty of posting and replying to every little detail about a case. These crimes bring out strong feelings in most of us. Posts like “I agree”, “good post”, “you’re right”, “good idea”, etc. add to your post count but brings nothing to the discussion. From there it’s easy to get caught up in emotions and go on a power posting spree.

I was guilty of doing the same when I first got here. Thankfully I received a private message from a veteran who gave me excellent advice. If you’ve been paying attention you’ll see that some of the veteran sleuthers have backed away from these Vallow threads. That’s sad and diminishes the quality of the content. I hope people spend a little more time thinking about what they post before pressing the “send” button. Not every little detail about a case requires your input. So many of these threads are full of “scroll and roll” posts. Im sure you’ve noticed but these threads have slowed way down. Some of its because there is a lull but for me and others it’s probably poor content. WS is normally a cut above and I hope it stays that way. Cheers ...

Sage advice as I look in the mirror. I've been a little too "in my head" lately, which leads to getting very entrenched in some really narrow arguments about things that don't really move the ball forward. As the wise websleuths philosopher once said, "It's raccoons all the way down".

I apologize, everyone, for my occasional tunnel-vision and intransigence and hope to provide richer and less argumentative contribution in the future. Pray for rain... and more case news!

 

[RexburgSleuth]

FBI mobile command unit is no longer behind the Rexburg PD.

Not sure when they left or what this means.

 

[kshultz06082]

BBM I strongly disagree. Most definitely there is not a clear site line from there to murder. I am not in the slightest excusing what CD or LVD did. But growing up in a dysfunctional home or by parents who treat their children with emotional or physical cruelty absolutely does cause personality disorders and mental illness. There are multiple studies on this subject and if you are truly a student of the human condition you would know that. I know from personal experience. By your statement you are giving all emotionally or physically abusive parents or caregivers a pass. IMO

From Abused Child to Serial Killer: Investigating Nature vs Nurture in Methods of Murder - Psychiatry Advisor

Thank you! You seem to be the only one to understand what I was trying to explain.

 

[CSIDreamer]

FBI mobile command unit is no longer behind the Rexburg PD.

Not sure when they left or what this means.

I'm hoping new charges are wrapping up. Fingers crossed! Jmo

 

[155etta]

Mr Means car was at the courthouse again today. I didn't drive around back to see if the FBI mobile unit is still there. MOO.

 

[155etta]

When I first started here I was guilty of posting and replying to every little detail about a case. These crimes bring out strong feelings in most of us. Posts like “I agree”, “good post”, “you’re right”, “good idea”, etc. add to your post count but brings nothing to the discussion. From there it’s easy to get caught up in emotions and go on a power posting spree.

I was guilty of doing the same when I first got here. Thankfully I received a private message from a veteran who gave me excellent advice. If you’ve been paying attention you’ll see that some of the veteran sleuthers have backed away from these Vallow threads. That’s sad and diminishes the quality of the content. I hope people spend a little more time thinking about what they post before pressing the “send” button. Not every little detail about a case requires your input. So many of these threads are full of “scroll and roll” posts. Im sure you’ve noticed but these threads have slowed way down. Some of its because there is a lull but for me and others it’s probably poor content. WS is normally a cut above and I hope it stays that way. Cheers ...

Could you hop on over to the Covid thread and repost this exact same thing there, please?

 

[wiggy]

Let’s go back to happier times! (Well, not happier, but you get what I mean.)

What was in the orange bag? And was the orange thing even a bag?

Is it Miss Daybell, Mrs. Daybell or Mizzzz Daybell?

And how many darn raccoons were there? Two? Zero?

Not seriously asking. Just trying to lighten the mood with some past quandaries...

In all seriousness, it’s interesting that the FBI unit is gone, as RexburgSleuth just pointed out.

 

[Redvines86]

I have not posted any false information in this conversation. I do indeed have an opinion about the relevance overall of past custody battles to the conviction of CD and LVD. My opinion is not disinformation, any more than yours is. I am not claiming anything to be fact that is not fact. And when and if I do, I admit an error.

Can we agree on what we're disagreeing about, at least? I do not doubt the provenance of these documents. I do not doubt that they are real. I do not doubt that they are reproduced faithfully (albeit with a watermark and behind a paywall) by WTAF. I do not doubt that all interested court and LE officials have access--and have had access--to these documents (in fact I have tried to make this point myself repeatedly). I do not doubt that they may have relevance in future (I just don't find it probable).

But yes, I do think that publishing this information unredacted, and posting it here in the public eye, is intrusive in the lives of other people and goes against the spirit of victim-friendliness that seems like a value of this forum, and outweighs any probative value it might have (in this forum). And we can respectfully disagree about that, because hey, we're grownups!

Thanks for listening.

I am just putting this here for ease, but it can go to everyone. Tricia is very excited about these documents, and has explained a lot about them on her youtube show for anyone that would like more information. Tricia is also very much a fan of WTAF. I think these documents are a very important part of the story overall, and my understanding is that Tricia and the Mods are very interested in the info they are providing us. MOO

 

[CSIDreamer]

Let’s go back to happier times! (Well, not happier, but you get what I mean.)

What was in the orange bag? And was the orange thing even a bag?

Is it Miss Daybell, Mrs. Daybell or Mizzzz Daybell?

And how many darn raccoons were there? Two? Zero?

Not seriously asking. Just trying to lighten the mood with some past quandaries...

In all seriousness, it’s interesting that the FBI unit is gone, as RexburgSleuth just pointed out.

I'm starting to wonder if the orange thing held pet remains.

It's LoriD.

Jmo

 

[BeckyF]

I don’t think that is what I was expressing but I’m sorry that I offended you. I may indeed be a very poor student of humanity, as you have suggested here. If so, sure hope I’m being graded on a curve and there is make-up work!

One thing I do know, however, is that correlation is not causation. The fact that 32% of serial killers have endured abuse as children is not the same as saying that 32% of abused children become serial killers. Gob help us all if that were to be the case! And that was the essence of my point, which the article you linked does not contradict.

The second thing I know is that we don’t know any facts about LVD’s childhood that would prove abuse or mental illness in the family. Not saying there aren’t any. Just saying that having an opinion about her family based on observing from afar (and the fact that they rub us the wrong way) does not give any of us magical diagnostic powers.

If you have better facts than these, this student humbly sits at your feet awaiting enlightenment. Better facts and better data make for better ideas and outcomes IMO.[/QUOT

DBM

 

[BeckyF]

DBM - sorry

 

[BeckyF]

I don’t think that is what I was expressing but I’m sorry that I offended you. I may indeed be a very poor student of humanity, as you have suggested here. If so, sure hope I’m being graded on a curve and there is make-up work!

One thing I do know, however, is that correlation is not causation. The fact that 32% of serial killers have endured abuse as children is not the same as saying that 32% of abused children become serial killers. Gob help us all if that were to be the case! And that was the essence of my point, which the article you linked does not contradict.

The second thing I know is that we don’t know any facts about LVD’s childhood that would prove abuse or mental illness in the family. Not saying there aren’t any. Just saying that having an opinion about her family based on observing from afar (and the fact that they rub us the wrong way) does not give any of us magical diagnostic powers.

If you have better facts than these, this student humbly sits at your feet awaiting enlightenment. Better facts and better data make for better ideas and outcomes IMO.

Here was your original post: SBM. I'm having trouble quoting it for some reason.

I've known people from the most horrible childhoods you could imagine who have done some of the most remarkably positive things in their lives and for other people. And I've seen people who come from the most unremarkably normal childhoods go on to commit unspeakable atrocities.
I don't think having an f-ed up family explains mental illness or personality disorders, unless there is a hereditary genetic condition in play, which I don't think any of us can say.

My response was that I do not agree with this bolded statement. I took your statement to mean that if someone, anyone has a personality disorder or mental illness, growing up in a screwed up family is never a factor. Because that's what you said. I know nothing about Lori's childhood and I wouldn't pretend to know what caused her to be the way she is. But this discussion is OT because I am stating that I have no idea what her circumstances were growing up. In fact, I think there was a post from admin awhile back that we were not to discuss any mental condition she may or may not have because we do not know of any professional diagnosis. Discussing the mental condition or psychopathy of other criminals is for a whole other forum. IMO

 

[RickshawFan]

Well, we did have one other poster who claimed to have helped prepare the documents and knew the approximate cost to obtain them from the state of TX, but they were loath to give more details due to not wanting to identify themselves.

Exactly my point.

 

[RickshawFan]

Post 1128: ..... Here's Rob Woods at 36:19 from the March 6 hearing, where he states: "The defendant has an history of defying court orders. In a 2009 child custody case in Travis, Texas, she was found guilty of seven counts of criminal contempt."

Post 1129.....Not true. Both Hawaii and Idaho prosecutors took note of Lori Vallow's seven convictions for civil contempt in the 2009 court case in Travis, Texas.....

Both snipped from @Sorelle 19
BBM

Confusion is piling up for me here.....

 

[Sorelle19]

I am just putting this here for ease, but it can go to everyone. Tricia is very excited about these documents, and has explained a lot about them on her youtube show for anyone that would like more information. Tricia is also very much a fan of WTAF. I think these documents are a very important part of the story overall, and my understanding is that Tricia and the Mods are very interested in the info they are providing us. MOO

Excellent listen, thank you.

Stuff:

• From Lori and Jospeh Ryan's custody case, JR was required to carry $350,000 in life insurance, payable to Lori as trustee for Tylee.
• Along those lines, Annie Cushing posted on Facebook that, at the time of CV's death, Tylee was living with AC and, in her opinion, trying to emancipate herself from Lori.
• Annie also said she is grateful that the custody docs were released because they vindicated her brother. He is yet another victim.

 

[Redvines86]

(edit-removed quoted post that was deleted)
1. Tricia's Youtube tonight is amazing! So much info about JR and CV and both of their cases which the FBI are looking at now. I've learned more about the case tonight than I thought possible. This info will be a big part of the Vallow/Daybell story moving forward.
2. WTAF has not something wrong, or something that wasn't going to happen. Honestly, thank heaven it was them. But this is all info coming out and there will be so much more, the second husband's story is just coming out, and we lerning so much about Lori and Chad and everyone involved, MOO.

 

[Redvines86]

Excellent listen, thank you.

Stuff:

• From Lori and Jospeh Ryan's custody case, JR was required to carry $350,000 in life insurance, payable to Lori as trustee for Tylee.
• Along those lines, Annie Cushing posted on Facebook that, at the time of CV's death, Tylee was living with AC and, in her opinion, trying to emancipate herself from Lori.
• Annie also said she has grateful that the custody docs were released because they vindicated her brother.

Huge blessing we are learning about JR! I don't care if I'm dead, I want people to know even if they thought I did something wrong I want them to know the truth! MOO

 

[155etta]

1. Tricia's Youtube tonight is amazing! So much info about JR and CV and both of their cases which the FBI are looking at now. I've learned more about the case tonight than I thought possible. This info will be a big part of the Vallow/Daybell story moving forward.
2. WTAF has not something wrong, or something that wasn't going to happen. Honestly, thank heaven it was them. But this is all info coming out and there will be so much more, the second husband's story is just coming out, and we lerning so much about Lori and Chad and everyone involved, MOO.

Well shoot, I missed the part about bachelor, I mean husband, number 2!
ETA: punctuation

 

[Redvines86]

Yes, absolutely, horrible things are coming out about the levels of evil that Lori reached. It is horrible for the people involved, but what a great thing for them to find out the truth! To know they're not crazy, to know that things they remember make sense. Will it take a lifetime for them to figure it out, make sense of it, get therapy? Yes! We will be heavily involved in the case for maybe two/three years? Sure. Do all of Lori and Chad's kids, unlike us, have a lifetime of being heavily involved? Sure. But they need all of this info to be able to understand the evilness of Lori and Chad. Truth hurts but eventually heals. Secrets fester but never heal. MOO. Remember, Aimee and Danielle are not the bad guys here. Lori is the evil person that did these horrible things. Lori is the bad guy. MOO

 

[MsJosie]

I fell sound asleep.....missed Tricia...is there some where I can listen to the podcast tomorrow? Thanks.