Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Tammy Daybell, 49, Sept & Oct 2019 *Arrests* #59

[LinasK]

The explanation given was that Kay and Larry were too old, but they also had a business to run.

I'll bet they deeply regret that decision.

 

[indicolite22]

Is there a recording we can hear, or is he off-limits for this level of sleuthing?

 

[indicolite22]

I'll bet they deeply regret that decision.

You can't beat yourself up for making decisions based on information you had at the time. Lori was perceived as a good mother.

 

[Midwestmom2019]

BBM. We don't know if he was taking any such medication and (IMO) stopping it wouldn't guarantee his death, especially not on a short notice.

I’m with Kudzu in this point. I could never accept his death as natural when surrounded by all these murders. The autopsy attributed death to PE, so we know his lifestyle was not the healthiest. He could have been taking meds without life style changes. And he could have stopped them say he was on a long haul road trip and forgot them. Or they could have been stopped for him by someone intend on substituting his meds with a sugar pill. And if you stop taking meds, it could happen quickly or it could take a while. All just more to consider in the quest to hang her from the highest tree.

 

[carbuff]

I can totally believe someone else caused AC's death by tampering with his medications or giving him something to cause death.

Committing suicide that way seems unlikely though. It's slow, uncertain, painful, and generally not something most people would want to put themselves through. The man had guns and knew how to use them. That would seem much more likely if he was going to end it all.

 

[indicolite22]

I’m with Kudzu in this point. I could never accept his death as natural when surrounded by all these murders. The autopsy attributed death to PE, so we know his lifestyle was not the healthiest. He could have been taking meds without life style changes. And he could have stopped them say he was on a long haul road trip and forgot them. Or they could have been stopped for him by someone intend on substituting his meds with a sugar pill. And if you stop taking meds, it could happen quickly or it could take a while. All just more to consider in the quest to hang her from the highest tree.

I'm not saying it couldn't happen, but if his death was suicide, stopping his meds likely wasn't the method chosen. There's some speculation that he was either killed or killed himself because of Tammy's exhumation a day earlier. On the other hand, ZP and MBP both claimed that he had been feeling ill for a week (which would support natural causes).

 

[girlhasnoname]

LVD is crazy like a fox IMO. She might very well have a diagnosable personality disorder (or 3), but that does not negate her actions/participation in the deaths of her children and ex husband and goodness knows who else.

She appears to be a master manipulator and it makes me physically ill to even watch her during court hearings. I believe she will be found competent to stand trial and justice will come for her in a big way. I need to believe that.

Have we ever seen or followed a case as convoluted and bizarre as this one???

JMO

 

[Boxer]

The explanation given was that Kay and Larry were too old, but they also had a business to run.

MOO, since JJ was autistic, as he grew he would be too much for an older couple.

 

[HistoryNut]

Zulema's son on the phone to 911 was one of the weirdest 911 calls I've ever heard, i honestly don't know what to think when it comes to any of these people at this point.

I agree. None of them seem to pass the smell test.

 

[Kudzu]

I can totally believe someone else caused AC's death by tampering with his medications or giving him something to cause death.

Committing suicide that way seems unlikely though. It's slow, uncertain, painful, and generally not something most people would want to put themselves through. The man had guns and knew how to use them. That would seem much more likely if he was going to end it all.

I’m not sure if I’d agree that he “knew how to use them” all that well... He shot Charles, yes, but missed both Tammy and Brandon. I could subscribe to the fact that Alex was the hit man in all these deaths, including his own.

MOO

 

[Jolynna]

That's what makes no sense to me. If JJ's parents weren't fit to raise him, why didn't Kay & Larry raise him instead of Lori & Charles?

I've always assumed Kay & Larry gave JJ to Charles and Lori because at that time Charles was more financially able to provide JJ with the best schools, a special needs dog, and anything else available to give JJ the best possible chance in life. Because of Charles, Lori didn't have to work. She could choose to be a full-time mom and also could afford nannies and other help in order to keep up with the demands of a child with special needs.

Lori is young and physically fit. Charles was extremely physically fit, even buff, in photos from when JJ would have been an infant. I know grandparents who took over the role of parent that worry about becoming a burden (due to the possibility of aging minds and/or bodies) instead of a help to grandchildren emerging from teenagers into fully independent adults.

Also, Charles was so over-the-moon happy with Lori and Lori is such a chameleon that I think Kay and Larry believed that Charles and Lori were the best possible couple in the world to raise JJ. The video of Lori giggling and Chandler police laughing too — while Charles' body was still warm and nearby — demonstrate that charming people, (even professionals investigating what most of us now agree was a murder), is as easy for Lori as opening her eyes every morning.

 

[nyvictoria]

I’d bet tetrahydrozoline is not on a standard toxicology report. I wonder if it causes foaming at the mouth, like Tammy Daybell?

Drowning. Bathtub?

 

[carbuff]

I’m not sure if I’d agree that he “knew how to use them” all that well... He shot Charles, yes, but missed both Tammy and Brandon. I could subscribe to the fact that Alex was the hit man in all these deaths, including his own.

MOO

I think he knew how to use them well enough to shoot himself if he wanted to end his life, rather than futzing around with meds that might or might not bring around a fatal embolism or heart attack...

 

[887sMtreme]

MOO, since JJ was autistic, as he grew he would be too much for an older couple.

So much of that would depend on his medical care and education.

 

[887sMtreme]

Good grief! That is a horror.

 

[Kudzu]

I think he knew how to use them well enough to shoot himself if he wanted to end his life, rather than futzing around with meds that might or might not bring around a fatal embolism or heart attack...

Maybe he tried that first and it jammed, just like it did with Tammy, and he knew the poison had worked. We’ll probably never know exactly what happened. But I can certainly see a scenario of someone at the cemetery calling Chad to let him know Tammy had been exhumed, Chad immediately calling Alex to sadly inform him that he’d just turned dark, Lori crying on cue because she didn’t want to see him be a zombie, and Alex predictably taking himself out to both spare Lori seeing that and to release his own spirit. I think the pulmonary embolism was triggered by a poison that was not detected in the autopsy. MOO

 

[Midwestmom2019]

Maybe he tried that first and it jammed, just like it did with Tammy, and he knew the poison had worked. We’ll probably never know exactly what happened. But I can certainly see a scenario of someone at the cemetery calling Chad to let him know Tammy had been exhumed, Chad immediately calling Alex to sadly inform him that he’d just turned dark, Lori crying on cue because she didn’t want to see him be a zombie, and Alex predictably taking himself out to both spare Lori seeing that and to release his own spirit. I think the pulmonary embolism was triggered by a poison that was not detected in the autopsy. MOO

Poison or not, medicine, suffocation with a pillow, I just can not believe his death at the perfect moment was a natural occurrence. Maybe CD had something to do with it?
CD should have had Tammy cremated. They’d be so much further down the road.

 

[Boxer]

Poison or not, medicine, suffocation with a pillow, I just can not believe his death at the perfect moment was a natural occurrence. Maybe CD had something to do with it?
CD should have had Tammy cremated. They’d be so much further down the road.

The children may have had a stong opinion.

 

[indicolite22]

Let's say both Tammy and Alex were poisoned. If they feared said poison would be discovered in Tammy's autopsy after exhumation, why use it again on Alex? It would have shown in his autopsy results as well, making his death suspicious. If a stealthier substance was used on him, why not on Tammy? Did they have a collection of poisons lying around just in case? On the other hand, if they believed Tammy's poison was undetectable, then why kill Alex?

ETA: I'm aware that a substance might not be detected either because it is no longer present or because specific tests for its detection aren't performed. Alex was autopsied pretty quickly, so in general there was less chance of something escaping detection.

 

[indicolite22]

Drowning. Bathtub?

If you mean Tammy's case, their son was also in the house when she died, which makes a drowning attempt less likely.