Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 #3

[snoflake20]

I'm torn on this one.

On the one hand, if they don't know how they left or what vehicles they might be using, I don't see how that would or should preclude asking people to look for people who look like this. Sure, odds of that being fruitful are lower (maybe a lot lower) than if car descriptions and plate number were included, but doing something is still better than doing nothing.

But I also wonder if they're more or less sure that this won't bear fruit, but it is sending a message to Chad and Lori and possibly others who are helping them. It might also be helping keep them from moving from place to place, or at least more cautious doing so. While I hadn't gotten this vibe previously, the press release last night felt like it was aimed specifically at anyone who might be helping or covering for Chad and Lori, making sure they realize that things aren't as they might have been told.

Moo, lots of moo.

Moo lots of moo as well!
It seems that LE must know the location of all known vehicles Chad and Lori have access to. Otherwise, LE would say what vehicle to look for.

With the amount of security around plane travel, wouldn’t it be fairly easy to see if they flew to another state?

In the newest press release, Rexburg police states: “Lori Vallow has chosen instead to leave the state with her new husband.”

AND that “We know that the children are not with Lori and Chad Daybell and we also have information indicating that Lori knows either the location of the children or what has happened to them. “

MOO MOO MOO
So based on this, it seems to me that LE has spoken to the person that transported Lori and Chad and they said at that time the children were not with them.

 

[GoneGoldfishin']

This is a complicated and far from straightforward situation. I'm talking from the standpoint of ex-Mormon, but not being excommunicated, but living in UT and ID most of my life with lots of family and friends who are Mormon. Since very much MOO, hopefully you'll get answers from people coming at this from a different place to compare.

While I'm sure the church would say they don't encourage cutting off family who have been exed I think it happens from some people in some families. I suspect some of those who do this do it because they don't want the exed family member making them look bad to their neighbors. (I suspect things are much different in regards to all of this if you're outside of the area where Mormons are the dominate religion.)

I suspect there are also situations where people feel like they're being shunned when it is really that they aren't participating in the church activities they were before which was a large part of their interaction with some people, plus it makes them less visible so those people don't think of doing things with them as much.

I'll also point out that if someone is exec there is no public announcement unless it comes from you. There are signs (if you attend church services) that people may pick up on, but otherwise they don't know. So if they don't know, how do they know to shun you?

Just so you know, while there is no "public announcement", the information comes to the ward clerk from Salt Lake to make it official. So at that point, at least 4 people in the ward known ( B, 1 and 2, clerk). I'm sure you know where I'm headed with this . Moo.

 

[BigAl16]

Moo lots of moo as well!
It seems that LE must know the location of all known vehicles Chad and Lori have access to. Otherwise, LE would say what vehicle to look for.

With the amount of security around plane travel, wouldn’t it be fairly easy to see if they flew to another state?

In the newest press release, Rexburg police states: “Lori Vallow has chosen instead to leave the state with her new husband.”

Regarding plane travel ... assuming they don't have a friend who owns a small plane and took them somewhere, so we're talking about flying on an airline of some kind. If we're talking an airline (major or commuter line) then we've got a problem even getting them to a plane. No airline flights from Rexburg. Commuter flights are available from a few towns sort of nearby (Idaho Falls and Jackson, Wyoming). But that requires an hour ride to the airport. Many people flying somewhere from Rexburg, due to cost differentials, drive from Boise or (more likely) Salt Lake, but both of those are more than a 3 hour drive. They could also use a shuttle bus to get there and, if they wanted the shuttle company that runs to Salt Lake could take them all the way to Las Vegas. I'm not sure what hoops LE has to jump through to get passenger lists (can we assume they're flying under their own names?) and if doing this from lots of airlines at lots of airports is a problem. But if we thought they flew somewhere (HI?) then finding the flight could require a bit of digging.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Fox news just now. At least it's getting national attention. Lori's lie about Tylee was brought up.

Great, I was wondering when the two new details would hit national news. Looking forward to FB or YouTube broadcasts. Many news stations are moving to Youtube and facebook for their broadcasts to follow.

Thanks

 

[BigAl16]

Just so you know, while there is no "public announcement", the information comes to the ward clerk from Salt Lake to make it official. So at that point, at least 4 people in the ward known ( B, 1 and 2, clerk). I'm sure you know where I'm headed with this . Moo.

Even though these are the top 4 church officials in the congregation, they aren't above gossiping because while (some claim) the church is perfect, the people aren't.

MOO

 

[dixiegirl1035]

For an Author who writes to a mostly LDS audience, being excommunicated will definitely hurt their sales, not because we (I'm LDS) shun them, but because it makes members worry about the content, that it's suspect and not something they should then be reading, and that's just a natural consequence. Who wants to give a friend a book written by someone who was excommunicated from the church? The books Chad wrote and those he published are on the fringe, they appeal to a small sub set of LDS, but those people will buy books, they will attend lectures and listen to podcasts, so being excommunicated will definitely impact sales and profitability. I was told we aren't able to talk about this person directly, but the truth is, Chad's relationship with his most famous author is what put his business on the map, made it successful and brought him into contact with other like minded people who are into prepping, having 'safe refuge' properties, stocked with supplies, and who could be helpful in hiding someone who didn't want to be found. I hope my comments are general enough that I haven't broken any rules. MOO>

Excellent first post, welcome. For being a newbie, you have toed the line within TOS very well! MOO

You stated "Who wants to give a friend a book written by someone who was excommunicated from the church? ". Yeah, and the issue of being associated with the death of his wife, disappearing with someone whose ex was killed, and his wife dead... on top of the issue of being excommunicated.

Which is worse, excommunication or association with questionable deaths?

Hopefully, the most recent LE release will nix the income stream for all reasons.

 

[snoflake20]

Interesting comments under the newest Rexburg Police Press Release Facebook Post, claiming Chad Daybell is still active/communicating on the AVOW website. I won't post them since its against the rules. I don't have a Facebook account, and I can still read them without logging in. Rexburg Police Department

 

[Jethro4WS]

Fox news just now. At least it's getting national attention. Lori's lie about Tylee was brought up.

This is very good. The most recent stuff is getting out via to the right areas and the right audiences.

Moo lots of moo as well!
It seems that LE must know the location of all known vehicles Chad and Lori have access to. Otherwise, LE would say what vehicle to look for.

With the amount of security around plane travel, wouldn’t it be fairly easy to see if they flew to another state?

In the newest press release, Rexburg police states: “Lori Vallow has chosen instead to leave the state with her new husband.”

AND that “We know that the children are not with Lori and Chad Daybell and we also have information indicating that Lori knows either the location of the children or what has happened to them. “

MOO MOO MOO
So based on this, it seems to me that LE has spoken to the person that transported Lori and Chad and they said at that time the children were not with them.

Yes, I think this will be correct.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

If getting life insurance money is this fast, maybe insurance companies need to look into a different way of doing this—like maybe small payouts at first but also making sure funeral expenses are covered to help while there is some kind of waiting period for the big payout. This might prevent some future homicides.

The vast majority of homicides are clearly homicides, and the manner of death is listed as such in the death certificate, and in that case the insurance company won't pay out until the case is resolved.

Most jurisdictions require an autopsy for any unattended death, which should have happened with Tammy. I'm very surprised one wasn't done immediately.

 

[alter idem]

Interesting comments under the newest Rexburg Police Press Release Facebook Post, claiming Chad Daybell is still active/communicating on the AVOW website. I won't post them since its against the rules. I don't have a Facebook account, and I can still read them without logging in. Rexburg Police Department

From what I know of this website, this would be the place to go for support and resources for Daybell to be able to stay out of sight. The private subforum allows for conversations that are not seen on the public, pay to view portion. MOO, but if he's active on the site, he's likely giving his version of events.

 

[mickey2942]

The vast majority of homicides are clearly homicides, and the manner of death is listed as such in the death certificate, and in that case the insurance company won't pay out until the case is resolved.

Most jurisdictions require an autopsy for any unattended death, which should have happened with Tammy. I'm very surprised one wasn't done immediately.

I am not, it is Idaho, where everyone "knows" everyone else. They all go to church together, it is beyond incestuous. Same as Utah.

 

[BigAl16]

I am not, it is Idaho, where everyone "knows" everyone else. They all go to church together, it is beyond incestuous. Same as Utah.

I thought they claimed to have done an autopsy on Tammy originally. I think they might have, but didn't dig as deep as they would have if the death was thought to be suspicious.

 

[Jethro4WS]

The vast majority of homicides are clearly homicides, and the manner of death is listed as such in the death certificate, and in that case the insurance company won't pay out until the case is resolved.

Most jurisdictions require an autopsy for any unattended death, which should have happened with Tammy. I'm very surprised one wasn't done immediately.

According to Idaho Statutes ...

What types of deaths are required to be investigated?
(1) When a county coroner is informed that a person has died, the county coroner shall investigate that death if:

(a) The death occurred as a result of violence, whether apparently by homicide, suicide or by accident;

(b) The death occurred under suspicious or unknown circumstances; or

(c) The death is of a stillborn child or any child if there is a reasonable articulable suspicion to believe that the death occurred without a known medical disease to account for the stillbirth or child’s death.

(2) If a death occurs that is not attended by a physician and the cause of death cannot be certified by a physician, the coroner must refer the investigation of the death to the sheriff of the county or the chief of police of the city in which the incident causing the death occurred or, if such county or city is unknown, to the sheriff or chief of police of the county or city where the body was found. The investigation shall be the responsibility of the sheriff or chief of police . . .

Idaho Code Ann. § 19-4301.

What types of deaths are required to be autopsied?
The coroner may, in the performance of his duties under this chapter, summon a person authorized to practice medicine and surgery in the state of Idaho to inspect the body and give a professional opinion as to the cause of death. The coroner or the prosecuting attorney may order an autopsy performed if it is deemed necessary accurately and scientifically to determine the cause of death. Idaho Code Ann. § 19-4301B.
​

So, one of two things happened. Either a physician determined the cause as a natural death or the Sheriff of Fremont County determined that, at the time, the death was not suspicious.

 

[alter idem]

Excellent first post, welcome. For being a newbie, you have toed the line within TOS very well! MOO

You stated "Who wants to give a friend a book written by someone who was excommunicated from the church? ". Yeah, and the issue of being associated with the death of his wife, disappearing with someone whose ex was killed, and his wife dead... on top of the issue of being excommunicated.

Which is worse, excommunication or association with questionable deaths?

Hopefully, the most recent LE release will nix the income stream for all reasons.

Questionable deaths would make his friends and neighbors worry, but people are good at denial, I'm sure he has friends and neighbors who insist this is all trumped up or blame a custody battle and it's all circumstantial. When the autopsy results come out, that might change. MOO. His famous author was excommunicated in May and announced it publicly, that is when Daybell distanced himself from her (that was reported earlier in the thread in a MSM article) in a business sense, and MOO, but he would have done this to protect his own book sales. He's an active member, he likely didn't want his book publishing company to be associated with her troubles.

 

[CSIDreamer]

I thought they claimed to have done an autopsy on Tammy originally. I think they might have, but didn't dig as deep as they would have if the death was thought to be suspicious.

They did. 3 or 4 hours for a cursory autopsy if I remember correctly. JMO.

 

[GoneGoldfishin']

I thought they claimed to have done an autopsy on Tammy originally. I think they might have, but didn't dig as deep as they would have if the death was thought to be suspicious.

Lori Vallow married Daybell just weeks after his first wife Tammy Daybell died in the family’s home at the age of 49. After Daybell refused to order an autopsy on his wife, which is his right, the coroner listed her cause of death as “natural.”
Doomsday Writer’s Friend Says He Prophesied Wife’s Mysterious Death

 

[MrsWatson]

Perhaps LE should release a very strongly worded statement along the lines of "If you are harboring these children or helping Chad & Lori in any way, you will be vigorously prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law." Put a right scare into them. Is OJ a felony? A lot of jobs, if you have a felony, no job.

Of course, if you're in a bunker somewhere, you may not tune into the news everyday, KWIM?

I'm just trying to think of ways to flush them out into the open.

This is such a crazy case.

MOO

 

[CSIDreamer]

How well was Chad Daybell known to the worldwide, even U.S., Mormon congregation? I mean, we all know the Osmonds are Mormons, right? Did your average Mormon know about him? I'm just questioning what kind of reach he actually has beyond a small group treating him like a celebrity. I'm wondering how soon him and Lori find the help running out if they don't have long term hiding arrangements. JMO.

 

[diggndeeperstill]

I'm not Mormon, but I want to give an opinion on the BBM part. It's my opinion it can put serious strain on marriages. If you've been married in the temple, you're pretty much "sealed" for eternity according to their beliefs. You get ex communicated and now there goes your eternal marriage. That's got to be stressful. JMO.

I don’t understand this if he got ex communicated after his wife died, but if it was before then yes, that could be a precipitating factor in my mind too.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Perhaps LE should release a very strongly worded statement along the lines of "If you are harboring these children or helping Chad & Lori in any way, you will be vigorously prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law." Put a right scare into them. Is OJ a felony? A lot of jobs, if you have a felony, no job.

Of course, if you're in a bunker somewhere, you may not tune into the news everyday, KWIM?

I'm just trying to think of ways to flush them out into the open.

This is such a crazy case.

MOO

Maybe fake up some unclaimed funds lol. JMO