Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #42

[155etta]

So maybe the area is not a full three acres?

It sure seems small for three acres. We live on two acres. Maybe just because it is so uncluttered and open and not overgrown. No fences, no animal pens, not many outbuildings. A lot of people who have a few acres have random piles of this and that, sheds, automobiles in various states of disrepair, things they've collected or things they need to take to the junkyard. You know, stuff. It's clean, minimal, and seems small.

 

[trujac]

I think there is an element of pseudo religion involved in the CD and Lori murder saga...they seem to be practicing a similar belief system as several of other mass suicide religious groups followed..i.e. groups like Heaven's Gate, Jim Jones, etc. The religious component supports the belief system that they are entitled to take someone's life under the guise of anointment...the money part is what lubricates their motivation.

 

[The First Article]

I do not think Lori or Chad are serial killers. I think they have shared psychotic disorder, or Folie à deux. This is yet, another reason this case is compellingly bizarre.

But there is no way they can plead insanity.

From the American Psychological Association, in reference to a murder case Idaho v. Delling:

“In 1982, the Idaho Legislature repealed Idaho's insanity defense statute and enacted a law that states that "mental condition shall not be a defense to any charge of criminal conduct”.

“The U.S. Supreme Court declined to hear Delling's case; thus, the insanity defense remains unavailable to criminal defendants in Idaho.”

Which if there is proof or suggestion that either of them was doing depraved or murderous things prior to getting together would disqualify them for a shared psychotic break.

Chad sexually assaulting people, and if he has desecrated corpses before that would suffice. I'm guessing he might have cut up a body before possibly in his job just for fun.

Lori's callous disregard of deaths and possibly being involved in them prior to Chad would also remove that defense.

Starting to find prior depraved or criminal acts seems important. I don't know that I agree they are psychotic - they are too organized and manipulative.

 

[Spartygirl]

As a minor, the social security benefits would go to Lori. The bank card may have been access to an inheritance.

Correct.. which means she would still be receiving the benefits since nobody even knew the kids were missing until Kay and Larry started questioning about JJ

 

[scapa]

In the document found on IP's computer he states that Melanie told him that she was afraid "Alex may have had to take care of the kids"

Knowing all the details we now know, Reading the document found on IP's computer again makes so many more things makes sense, MP 100% knows more than she's letting on.
READ: Exhibit from Brandon Boudreaux's court filing | East Idaho News

Agree. And I note the extra qualifiers in MP's phrasing, and the distancing language/ mobspeak of "take care," excusing AC of any real choice in the matter.

"Had to"
"Was moved to"
"Felt I should"
"Was called to"
"Received a revelation/vision to"

No, [insert callous murderer's name here], nothing made you do those things. You did it for you.

 

[Spartygirl]

MOO, this is a case of Chad telling Lori what she wanted to hear. MG (or maybe April from Kauai?) said Lori started acting more like a girlfriend to Colby once he became serious with his now wife. Lori saw her as taking affection away from Lori, Lori was jealous, Chad explains it all away with "she's a dark spirit." Lori hears what she wants to, assigns spiritual gift or intelligence to Chad for saying it, and goes further down the cult tunnel.

Chad said that Colby's wife was a DARK spirit ??
Do you have a link for that ??
I missed reading about this.
Thank you

 

[Spartygirl]

Also in the document found on IP's computer he states that Melanie told him that she learned some of these things in the temple and some from chad and lori, How many others are in this temple teaching this crazy stuff? and how many other believers are out there?

JMO.. but I think there are way more than 7
everyone keeps saying there are only 7 but IMO-- there are more CD followers

 

[Knox]

Hmmm, When Lori left CV, didn't she take certain things with her, including JJ's meds? I seem to recall that CV refilled the prescription. We only know that the script wasn't refilled in Idaho, it may have been refilled elsewhere though.

I believe it said LE checked the national database. I thought that was interesting because they likely weren't just looking at that database for JJ's meds.

 

[Irish_Eyes]

It seems like every day I come on here, this all just gets crazier.

After getting caught up on all my reading I have a few thoughts about Tylee and a few about Alex.

Tylee:

Colby says he last facetimed with Tylee around 8/30, which was right before the move, correct? Can we even confirm if Tylee had use of her phone at all in that last week?

It's enough that Tylee witnessed Charles' death. But there were other risks too. How much did she know, or suspect, about Lori and Chad? If Chad was wearing a wedding ring, she'd notice. If she'd been allowed to make friends, who knows what info might get around? They wasted no time once Uncle Alex got there, I think that shows what a priority it was for them to get rid of Tylee.

Regarding Alex, I imagine he'll be named an unindicted co-conspirator. Unindicted because he is of course, deceased. That may have certain evidentiary benefits i.e. possible exceptions to the hearsay rule, especially if someone flips.

Is there an 'everything Alex' post floating around anywhere? I really want to know more about his life than I do.

Consider:

Alex attacked Joe Ryan.
Alex killed Charles Vallow.
Alex is suspected of being involved in the death of Tylee Ryan.
Alex is suspected of being involved in the attempted murder of Brandon Boudreaux.
Alex is suspected of being involved in the death of JJ Ryan.
Alex is suspected of being involved in the death of Tammy Daybell.

Alex was a truck driver.

Anyone else hoping they've run his DNA through CODIS?

 

[fred&edna]

Who would report them to the Bishop? I guess what I'm trying to understand is who, outside the circle of people involved, knew about this and would have been willing share it with someone?

I can only speak for myself -- if I had concerns that someone in my ward was involved in criminal behavior, I might tell our Bishop, but I absolutely would tell the police. But I can't tell either of them anything that someone is trying very hard to make sure I don't know.

I thought the bishop knew. Well, the bishop who was on the phone when Lori threatened to kill Charles... he definitely knew.

Link:

Bodycam video of Lori Vallow's late husband deepens mystery of missing Idaho children

Bodycam shows Gilbert Police interview Lori Vallow after husband tried to get her mentally evaluated

Police ask Charles if Lori has said anything about hurting the children. Charles responds that Lori told their Bishop that she didn't want the kids.


"Today she said, with Gabe on the phone, 'Come take the kids,'" Charles says. "'I don't care what happens to them. Come take them.'"

New bodycam shows Lori Vallow Daybell's late husband Charles feared for JJ and Tylee

 

[scapa]

If I were one of Chad's kids, for Father's Day I would send him a postcard telling him we had all legally changed our last names to Douglas. No other note necessary. The "rot in hell" would be implied.

Yes. In solidarity and in memoriam at once.

 

[Spartygirl]

Honestly, I just watched this last night. I’m sure you guys hashed this out completely. I just have to say that it was so disgusting and hard to listen to.

But, assuming we can discuss this, was it ironic that Jason Mow was in the neighborhood as Lori suggested or normal? How’d he stay out of the limelight and interviews? Sickening seeing Lori and Melanie ooh and ahh over him.

I tried to listen again but all I hear is LVD saying Yada, Yada, Yada, blabber.

 

[RickshawFan]

Which if there is proof or suggestion that either of them was doing depraved or murderous things prior to getting together would disqualify them for a shared psychotic break.

Chad sexually assaulting people, and if he has desecrated corpses before that would suffice. I'm guessing he might have cut up a body before possibly in his job just for fun.

Lori's callous disregard of deaths and possibly being involved in them prior to Chad would also remove that defense.

Starting to find prior depraved or criminal acts seems important. I don't know that I agree they are psychotic - they are too organized and manipulative.

I agree the folie à deux description doesn't apply. From what I can tell, they had disordered thinking long before they met each other. I don't see any "psychotic break"; they just seem to be who they've always been, but they're now a couple.
Also, AxC is in the mix. Deux is not trois. I can't see them all having a joint psychotic break. But they likely all had psychopathology before they began to orbit together. You'd maybe have to add some of the less central characters to this, too, e.g. niece Melani, SSiSSy and Mommy. Something's really off there. IMO

 

[A2FMNST]

I tried to listen again but all I hear is LVD saying Yada, Yada, Yada, blabber.

Like the parents on Charlie Brown...wah wah wah.

 

[Spartygirl]

I’m betting on the Risperdal.

LE searched LVs apartment on Nov. 27th they found JJs prescription STILL IN THE HOUSE.

LE also searched the storage unit the same day. They found the kids personal effects (blankets, photo albums, etc.).

Now why would you NOT throw out that prescription when you are trying to erase any evidence of the kids living there? Even if LV was pretending the kids were with someone else, wouldn’t you still throw the medicine out and say that it went with J.J. wherever she CLAIMED he was at the moment?

IMO, the answer is that you have plans to use the Risperdal AGAIN. It worked pretty effectively on Tylee so they used it for TD. Once it worked on TD, they (LV and CD) kept it handy for whomever was “next”. Maybe it eventually worked on AC?

After the poop show with the attempted hit on BB, they couldn’t risk drawing that kind of attention to themselves again. The death of CV (understandably) brought a huge amount of attention. Not gonna get by LE with the ole, “Well I shot him in self defense” excuse AGAIN.

My other thoughts on the drug are that LV had not filled the prescription since January. LV taking J.J. off of those meds supported her story that he was “dark”, climbing kitchen cabinets, saying he loved the devil, etc.

BBM--but Mommy dearest, JC said that LVD "stockpiled" the meds so we don't know if the prescription had not been refilled since January and he was taken OFF the meds, or if she, according to her Mom, stockpiled and had Plenty of the meds on hand.
We just don't know.... yet

 

[Spartygirl]

Hmmm, When Lori left CV, didn't she take certain things with her, including JJ's meds? I seem to recall that CV refilled the prescription. We only know that the script wasn't refilled in Idaho, it may have been refilled elsewhere though.

According to LVD mom-- LVD "stockpiled" the prescription
Take it with a grain of salt.

 

[Tricia]

Hey Everyone,

Last night I took the night off from the YouTube show so tonight we will discuss the arrest affidavit.

Are you as angry as I am? This really should come as no surprise but seeing it in an official document has left me shaking with anger. I hope you will join us tonight in our chat room on Websleuths YouTube Live. You can vent along with all of us.
CLICK HERE AT 10 PM EASTERN TO JOIN US LIVE

 

[A2FMNST]

According to LVD mom-- LVD "stockpiled" the prescription
Take it with a grain of salt.

Just like AC doesn’t have it in him to be a killer

 

[Knox]

It seems like every day I come on here, this all just gets crazier.

After getting caught up on all my reading I have a few thoughts about Tylee and a few about Alex.

Tylee:

Colby says he last facetimed with Tylee around 8/30, which was right before the move, correct? Can we even confirm if Tylee had use of her phone at all in that last week?

It's enough that Tylee witnessed Charles' death. But there were other risks too. How much did she know, or suspect, about Lori and Chad? If Chad was wearing a wedding ring, she'd notice. If she'd been allowed to make friends, who knows what info might get around? They wasted no time once Uncle Alex got there, I think that shows what a priority it was for them to get rid of Tylee.

Regarding Alex, I imagine he'll be named an unindicted co-conspirator. Unindicted because he is of course, deceased. That may have certain evidentiary benefits i.e. possible exceptions to the hearsay rule, especially if someone flips.

Is there an 'everything Alex' post floating around anywhere? I really want to know more about his life than I do.

Consider:

Alex attacked Joe Ryan.
Alex killed Charles Vallow.
Alex is suspected of being involved in the death of Tylee Ryan.
Alex is suspected of being involved in the attempted murder of Brandon Boudreaux.
Alex is suspected of being involved in the death of JJ Ryan.
Alex is suspected of being involved in the death of Tammy Daybell.

Alex was a truck driver.

Anyone else hoping they've run his DNA through CODIS?

Well his family thought he was just a big, giant, goofball who wouldn't hurt a flea. Personally, I think Alex bought into the religious schmuck Chad & Lori were peddling. He likely thought he could elevate his "level" by faithfully doing whatever he was asked to do. Meaning, I'm not concerned that because he was a truck driver and was involved in the deaths and attempts you named. That he was a serial killer. These are isolated to his relationship with his sister Lori, JMO.

The Rexburg police aren't commenting on the call. But Cox and Shiflet want to set the record straight on something else – or rather someone else: their son and brother Alex Cox, Lori's so-called enforcer — the man who shot and killed Charles Vallow.

Jonathan Vigliotti: Is Alex the henchman here?

Summer Shiflet: No [laughs].

Janis Cox: No, he's not.

Summer Shiflet: Alex was the most easygoing, relaxed, hilarious h— type of person. … There's nothing about him that was a hit man...

But we may never know the true story. On December 12, Alex Cox suddenly passed out and later died; an autopsy determined of natural causes.
EXCLUSIVE: 'If something has happened to those children, it is not by her doing'

 

[Dorothy Jane]

Do we know that it hasn't been granted to MM already?

This is what I was wondering!