If Elizabeth Acted Alone, What Did She Do With Gabriel?

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It's shocking, right! There are lots of places in Phoenix on their list alone.

I got distracted making dinner for the babies, but I meant to post this link as well. It's on that list, and a very short drive into Mexico from Phoenix.

http://www.onemission.us/rockypoint
 
I feel like this may also need to go on the S's thread. It could be someone they know took him there, possibly through Mexico/Loredo/Juarez, or that one of the S's did.
 
Mmm i was just thinking if we should start a whole thread concerning this theory for easy refrence ?
 
This is just a random theory:

I think the fact that EJ knew the name of Raymond Russell Park is significant. I don't think non-natives would know the name of that park. Since it is close to a major attraction, Six Flags, a major freeway and yet isolated it seems like an ideal place to transfer a baby.

Also of consideration is the fact that Laredo is approximately 150 miles away from SA. Is it possible a couple from the interior of Mexico desiring a baby could have taken Gabriel into Mexico to raise as their own? Are birth certificates for babies checked at the border?

Who most likely would know about Raymond Russell park... its rented for large groups...maybe church groups?
 
Do we know anything about who EJ was renting from in Tempe? I wonder if there were any ties there?
 
Okay, now I can not find this JHC in AZ but I'm finding one with the same name in Mercedes Tx. It is 252 miles south of San Antonio and very close to the Mexico border. Not sure if this is the same JHC at EJ's address.
 
Heh, okay, either she just very recently bought it or someone lied. I'll try to find links so I can remember.
Should this have it's own thread?

I could swear it was Logan who said the trailer was in Elizabeth's name. Maybe we assumed he meant purchased and it was actually a lease in her name? I can't find it. I'll keep searching.

I don't know if the trailer needs its own thread. Elizabeth's Background thread sounds like a good candidate for holding that info if we can nail down that it was purchased or rented by her.
 
I could swear it was Logan who said the trailer was in Elizabeth's name. Maybe we assumed he meant purchased and it was actually a lease in her name? I can't find it. I'll keep searching.

I don't know if the trailer needs its own thread. Elizabeth's Background thread sounds like a good candidate for holding that info if we can nail down that it was purchased or rented by her.

I'm just wondering if she did rent the trailer, does she know this person and how, or did she find an ad in the paper? If she had some type of personal relationship with the owner of the trailer. who knows, maybe she found someone through him to give Gabriel to.
 
I'm wondering if when she got to SA, she found an ad in one of the local papers or craig's list for couples wanting to adopt. She could have just met the couple and decided to be done with it and given Gabriel away. There may be couples who are so desperate for a baby that they would consider this and then lay low and hope no one finds out. If EJ was willing to give her baby to the Peters so easily, why wouldnt she just give him to some random couple in SA? EJ is not dealing with a full deck and her main objective was to give Gabriel up and hurt Logan at the same time.
I'm still not totally convinced that Tammi is clean in this part of the scheme, but if LE is saying she is well then.....
 
I know Tammi said she owned it, but not sure about Logan, still link hunting.
 
I know Tammi said she owned it, but not sure about Logan, still link hunting.

Looks like the trailer may have just been sold?

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4774722"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Tips or Suggestions for Logan's trip[/ame]
 
I'm wondering if when she got to SA, she found an ad in one of the local papers or craig's list for couples wanting to adopt. She could have just met the couple and decided to be done with it and given Gabriel away. There may be couples who are so desperate for a baby that they would consider this and then lay low and hope no one finds out. If EJ was willing to give her baby to the Peters so easily, why wouldnt she just give him to some random couple in SA? EJ is not dealing with a full deck and her main objective was to give Gabriel up and hurt Logan at the same time.
I'm still not totally convinced that Tammi is clean in this part of the scheme, but if LE is saying she is well then.....

The thing about couples wanting to adopt, on the internet, it looks like the vast majority want to do things legally. When I was cruising the net looking for somebody to give my imagibaby away to illegally, that's what struck me. Shortly after I started looking, I realized that if I started contacting all these couples, at least one of them was bound to call LE on me for trying to illegally give away my imagibaby.

That made me think that Eliz was likely to have the same experience: the realization that most couples were looking for a legal adoption, and the realization that somebody would call LE if she started contacting these 'legal' people.

It's risky, and Eliz did not want to be found or called in to LE. She knew what she was doing was illegal. She knew a 'legal' couple would need papers from Logan relinquishing his rights.

I think she most likely hit the street looking for somebody seedy to make a connection with.

Unless... she found a way to identify for sure people on the internet looking to take or buy babies illegally. I'm sure it's done. Pedophiles are all over the internet. We need to find a way to find the lowlifes advertising to buy a baby illegally on the net.

Hope this makes sense. I haven't even had my first cup of coffee yet lol.
 
Over in the Sleuthers & Tips thread I've posted more places like Craigslist. If anyone has time to help try to find how - what keywords etc - people advertise that they're looking to take or buy a baby illegally, I'd appreciate it.

One way I became aware of is that babies and children are advertised as Disney items. Because this was found out, though, I wonder if baby traders are likely to be using some other cloaked keywords.

It's so awful to even have to think about these things.
 
The 5 things Elizabeth has said she did with Gabe, courtesy of captdj:


1. Random couple in a park- Smith didnt know them
2. Random couple in the hotel- Smith didnt know them
3. Killed Gabriel put in daiper bag and then the dumspter
4. The Smith set up everything the person, the place and the how but she cant give any detail on how it went down???
5. Then the texting to the Smiths in Miami - that she and Gabriel were "great"

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4738385"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - AZ-Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, MSG 26 Dec 09 thread #17[/ame]

Thank you, captdj!
 
The thing about couples wanting to adopt, on the internet, it looks like the vast majority want to do things legally. When I was cruising the net looking for somebody to give my imagibaby away to illegally, that's what struck me. Shortly after I started looking, I realized that if I started contacting all these couples, at least one of them was bound to call LE on me for trying to illegally give away my imagibaby.

That made me think that Eliz was likely to have the same experience: the realization that most couples were looking for a legal adoption, and the realization that somebody would call LE if she started contacting these 'legal' people.

It's risky, and Eliz did not want to be found or called in to LE. She knew what she was doing was illegal. She knew a 'legal' couple would need papers from Logan relinquishing his rights.

I think she most likely hit the street looking for somebody seedy to make a connection with.

Unless... she found a way to identify for sure people on the internet looking to take or buy babies illegally. I'm sure it's done. Pedophiles are all over the internet. We need to find a way to find the lowlifes advertising to buy a baby illegally on the net.

Hope this makes sense. I haven't even had my first cup of coffee yet lol.

I agree with you on this. If she was trying to find someone online to adopt the baby illegally she would of had to of striked out a few times. The would-be adoptive parents that weren't willing would of come forward by now saying Elizabeth tried to get them to adopt Gabriel illegally. This leads me to believe the Nashville friend of TS set her up with someone, a baby broker.
 
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