If Shannan Gilbert was Drugged, this would be the perfect choice

[En Passant]

If SG was taken by the SK/SK's I would think this drug could have been administered AGAIN......Anything is possible since we were not there & all we have to go on are LIES from GC........

I believe they needed to wait for decomposure of SG remains so this drug could not be traced IMO

The fact is they could have used it on her upon finding her Anything is possible....we have what we have which isn't much.

But there are some very caring people that want to bring justice forth.
This is not nonsense, what bothers me was SG was very verbal to LE, banging on doors asking for help & claiming the people she was with (JB, Drifter, MP) were going to kill her was what actually happened & to find 11+ remains tell me SG was unto something.

SG being very verbal makes me wonder if Sux was used again after GC (possibly contacted JB) told of SG JUMPING IN & ZINGING around the community.......MY THOUGHT was SG became silenced forever after that & I am hoping the FBI was monitoring via Satilite & noticed the weather dates that would have made it impossible to see. Than they investagate persons about those specific dates.....after the 48 hour special....they found her which tells me.....that they wanted the nightmare of MG breathing down there necks to let up......Keeping open minds & visiting possiblities is a key to success...."Imagination is more important than knowledge" ..Einstien Quote

Without reliving ....... digesting every person involved, & there actions.....usually it is not complicated & could be VERY Telling......JMO

When I mentioned GC will be next it's because GC holds the winning hand as to who & what IMO....
New thread than the Doc.....now Truth that is your territory.....but I will weigh in too ) Naturally....cuz, Mr. ER is under a microscope.....IMO & Sux is POPULAR in ER

 

[Dwntwnslim]

Forensic Pathology Reviews
Volume 3
Drowning
Edited by Michael Tsokos, MD
© 2005 Humana Press Inc.
999 Riverview Drive, Suite 208
Totowa, New Jersey 07512
http://securimetric.com/library/for...logy-reviews/forensic-pathology-reviews.3.pdf

**WARNING! The PDF linked above contains Graphic Images!

Macroscopical, Microscopical, and
Laboratory Findings in Drowning Victims
A Comprehensive Review*
Philippe Lunetta, MD and Jerome H. Modell, MD,
DSc (Hon)

3.1. Sequence of Events

“In humans, the drowning process has been described as a continuum that
begins when the victim’s airways are located below the surface of the liquid,
which leads to voluntarily breath-holding and then laryngospasm triggered by
the local effects of liquid on the upper airways (22). During this period, the
victim does not breathe, which causes hypoxemia, hypercapnia, and respira-
tory and metabolic acidosis. The victim also may swallow water into the stom-
ach. In human volunteers, the breath-holding breaking point varies from 87
seconds at rest to up to 146 seconds when preceded by hyperventilation (23).
Once breath-holding breaks, the victim breathes and allows liquid to enter his
or her airways. The respiratory efforts intensify, producing more intense nega-
tive airway pressure against a closed glottis, or the liquid column overdistends
and ruptures lung alveoli. At this point, different authors believe one of two
courses can occur. In 85 to 90% of the cases, as the arterial oxygen tension
drops further, laryngospasm abates, and the victim actively inhales a variable
volume of liquid (so-called “wet-drowning”). In the remaining 10 to 15%, the
victim does not present evidence of water aspiration. Some attribute this to
severe laryngospasm causing hypoxia, convulsions, and death before taking a
breath (so-called “dry-drowning”) (16,24). These later cases led some research-
ers to question whether these victims actually die of drowning or of other
causes (25).”

 

[En Passant]

Forensic Pathology Reviews
Volume 3
Drowning
Edited by Michael Tsokos, MD
© 2005 Humana Press Inc.
999 Riverview Drive, Suite 208
Totowa, New Jersey 07512
http://forensicbooks.weebly.com/uploads/3/9/6/9/396948/forensic_pathology_reviews_3.pdf

**WARNING! The PDF linked above contains Graphic Images!

Macroscopical, Microscopical, and
Laboratory Findings in Drowning Victims
A Comprehensive Review*
Philippe Lunetta, MD and Jerome H. Modell, MD,
DSc (Hon)

3.1. Sequence of Events

“In humans, the drowning process has been described as a continuum that
begins when the victim’s airways are located below the surface of the liquid,
which leads to voluntarily breath-holding and then laryngospasm triggered by
the local effects of liquid on the upper airways (22). During this period, the
victim does not breathe, which causes hypoxemia, hypercapnia, and respira-
tory and metabolic acidosis. The victim also may swallow water into the stom-
ach. In human volunteers, the breath-holding breaking point varies from 87
seconds at rest to up to 146 seconds when preceded by hyperventilation (23).
Once breath-holding breaks, the victim breathes and allows liquid to enter his
or her airways. The respiratory efforts intensify, producing more intense nega-
tive airway pressure against a closed glottis, or the liquid column overdistends
and ruptures lung alveoli. At this point, different authors believe one of two
courses can occur. In 85 to 90% of the cases, as the arterial oxygen tension
drops further, laryngospasm abates, and the victim actively inhales a variable
volume of liquid (so-called “wet-drowning”). In the remaining 10 to 15%, the
victim does not present evidence of water aspiration. Some attribute this to
severe laryngospasm causing hypoxia, convulsions, and death before taking a
breath (so-called “dry-drowning”) (16,24). These later cases led some research-
ers to question whether these victims actually die of drowning or of other
causes (25).”

I did not see the graphic photo's you mentioned.
The book was written in 2005 & is about opinions & PHD thesis. I see the book was written on forensics. Still about lots of opinions...if written in 2005 than all these thoughts were way before & I tend to stick to up to date factual references. I appreciate your thoughts on this. I also do agree with several of your comments just not this one.

People do write to wikipedia correcting definitions so maybe you can enlighten them.....You do have some good knowledge. TY for sharing

 

[En Passant]

Link looks weird don't know if its working ...hopefully this one works. Sorry it if doesn't

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_drowning"]Dry drowning - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[Dwntwnslim]

I did not see the graphic photo's you mentioned.
The book was written in 2005 & is about opinions & PHD thesis. I see the book was written on forensics. Still about lots of opinions...if written in 2005 than all these thoughts were way before & I tend to stick to up to date factual references. I appreciate your thoughts on this. I also do agree with several of your comments just not this one.

People do write to wikipedia correcting definitions so maybe you can enlighten them.....You do have some good knowledge. TY for sharing

Try this link:

http://securimetric.com/library/for...logy-reviews/forensic-pathology-reviews.3.pdf

 

[En Passant]

Try this link:

http://securimetric.com/library/for...logy-reviews/forensic-pathology-reviews.3.pdf

Again I scrolled down on the link...it was edited in 2004
than again in 2005 to make addions & corrections
than again in 2005 another correction or add on

My point is it is not current as I have tried to point out to you.
This is from 2005 & edited twice due to improper info & revision.

So My Suggestion is go with up dated info & again I did not see disturbing pictures......so the copy & pasted wasn't really necessary IMO...thats all. JMO
Which is important to me, thats it. So clicking on this link I am trying to help so you have updated info...maybe the link isn't working maybe mods can help.

This is current info, try typing in address if link isn't

workinghttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_drowning

Keeping current & noticing the info reference you gave has lots of edites in the same year which tells me it is not relieable & is out of date being 2012 from being published in 2004...lots have changed since then in forensics...DNA uses in court room......methods used in 2012 I am sure is much different than approach in 2004 & earlier since they may have taken 5 or more years to write that book.
Now I am just trying to share the importance of current definition....from 2012. There has been so many monumental break throughs since than, just trying to update your knowledge base to current 2012, because reading something from 8 years ago is a very long time in the world of forensics IMO...No offense like I stated I have agreed with many of your comments ...just think this is WAY outdate. Thanx Though
​

 

[Dwntwnslim]

Again I scrolled down on the link...it was edited in 2004
than again in 2005 to make addions & corrections
than again in 2005 another correction or add on

My point is it is not current as I have tried to point out to you.
This is from 2005 & edited twice due to improper info & revision.

So My Suggestion is go with up dated info & again I did not see disturbing pictures......so the copy & pasted wasn't really necessary IMO...thats all. JMO
Which is important to me, thats it. So clicking on this link I am trying to help so you have updated info...maybe the link isn't working maybe mods can help.

This is current info, try typing in address if link isn't

workinghttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dry_drowning

Keeping current & noticing the info reference you gave has lots of edites in the same year which tells me it is not relieable & is out of date being 2012 from being published in 2004...lots have changed since then in forensics...DNA uses in court room......methods used in 2012 I am sure is much different than approach in 2004 & earlier since they may have taken 5 or more years to write that book.
Now I am just trying to share the importance of current definition....from 2012. There has been so many monumental break throughs since than, just trying to update your knowledge base to current 2012, because reading something from 8 years ago is a very long time in the world of forensics IMO...No offense like I stated I have agreed with many of your comments ...just think this is WAY outdate. Thanx Though
​

I'm sorry that you are disappointed by the images and they not being disturbing enough for you. They sure were for me!

"Keeping current & noticing the info reference you gave has lots of edites in the same year which tells me it is not relieable & is out of date being 2012 from being published in 2004...lots have changed since then in forensics..."

Which data are you referring to?

Why is the data not reliable? Please provide links and/or citations that prove this unreliability.

What specific set of data has changed from 2005 to 2012? Please provide links and/or citations.

<modsnip>

Thank you.

 

[En Passant]

I'm sorry that you are disappointed by the images and they not being disturbing enough for you. They sure were for me!

"Keeping current & noticing the info reference you gave has lots of edites in the same year which tells me it is not relieable & is out of date being 2012 from being published in 2004...lots have changed since then in forensics..."

Which data are you referring to?

Why is the data not reliable? Please provide links and/or citations that prove this unreliability.

What specific set of data has changed from 2005 to 2012? Please provide links and/or citations.

<modsnip>?

Thank you.

IMO your material is outdated, self explanatory. I stated I did not SEE ANY IMAGES. I did NOT state that I DID NOT FIND THEM DISTURBING......Did not see anything but the front cover...those were not disturbing. The cover of the book?

I have no intention of getting my feet wet in your pond. It's not productive.

Answer the questions you asked me....my personal business is mine.
Out dated material is what it is...I gave you a new update on definition....take it for what its worth. Everyones opinion matters.....thats mine.
I agree to disagree.

My post explains your questions....

I started a new thread so we have some new topics in this Area of testing etc, I hope you find it more suitable....& Interesting. A good foundation of current testing & new methods used by FBI is interesting. The post has many links & even a video about research & current studies. Peace, just sharing some thoughts thats all.

Light & Fluffy Please, I respond well to that thanx

 

[En Passant]

"Succinylcholine, SUX for short, is a neuromuscular paralytic drug. This means that it works at the junction of the nerves and muscles and causes muscular paralysis. It paralyzes all the muscles of the body, including those used for breathing. Without ventilatory support anyone who receives this drug will die from asphyxia. The bad news is that they will be wide awake while this occurs because SUX causes muscular paralysis but has no sedative effects."



If this drug was administered to SG, she would have never been able to make the 911 call or run through OB!

IMO It is VERY Possible in fact I think it was...JMO I appreciate yours though, If you read up on the links I shared you will see it is very fast acting & metabolizes quickly

 

[En Passant]

<modsnip>

<modsnip> Your infliction was these images are very disturbing....well the front cover images were not disturbing to me I did not see images within the pages I READ.......JUST THE FRONT COVER IMAGE...NO OTHERS, so I am thinking you are refering to some disturbing images inside the pages....The front cover of the book is as disturbing as eating a peanut butter & jelly sandwhich without a glass of milk.

I saw no graphic scenes, no murder scenes etc. which thinking about it I am glad. I do not enjoy any picture that shows a person or animal being tortured. I feel great sadness. So maybe it is good. I didn't like hearing Ripkin talk about killing girls, he enjoyed the fact that he was still creating a joy by explaining the killing & the response from reporter etc.

The SK like BTK, Ridgeway, Ripkin get off on the public dismay, jurors vomiting, looking at the horror in people sitting in court room, it's like the last hoorah. So I do not think they should be allowed in a court room, they should be held in a nearby room so they do not get the joy they feel from witnessing the pain others are feeling over it. They have the right to view whoever is on the stand due to the trial but not allowed to get off & get high on the terrror they shed on the public domain.

Let's say if a client gets off on pulling a fire alarm his joy is the fireman putting his life on the line to save & not knowing what is going to be in store for him. So a program would be in place where that client does not get to witness the out come of his actions & a non prefered consquence in place, plus a fine of 500.00 cuz thats what it can cost from fire dept for habitual occurrance no matter how Mentally Ill or unstable he is.

Recently in Orleans Ma, a veteran who served his country for many years & has PTSD calls 911. He is taught in military to call for back up if he feels the situation is dangerous. Well he is diagnosed PTSD, state police arrest him & Judge says you served your country honorably for X amount of years & you will be serving your country again for 9 months in the state penitentory. Did not seek Mental health for vet did not excuse behavior due to being habitual, locked him up. A Big Case ..... Honorable Judge Thomas Kirkman.....

http://www.ejfi.org/Courts/Courts-43.htm

My knowledge is from a professional background, so I use current info....if info hasn't changed in all the years than it is still referenced. But if the new definition differs from out of date literiture than IMO, professional opinion it is outdated. So No Offense but just stating protocol. This is the same for most fields. One uses lastest statistics, there are many different approaches to human behavior depends on area of specialty....but one still has knowledge base of others.

 

[En Passant]

I really think shannan was drugged...there is no evidence about that....just my opinion

She could have been drugged after found, she could have been drugged at JB that's why she was. Freaked out....it is my thought....read please my opinion it doesn't matter no one weighs in on this.....so hope you figure out what really happened

Glad Serail Killer is getting injection....he will experience the six .......

So peace & good luck...I want out done with living in a mini hell daily....universe has it now​

 

[En Passant]

Again where is this info on the drugged girl, to my knowledge there is only One other poster here who claims this, Fluke.

I answered that question on several occasions please see my other posts that state this .......digest it ....the post is there. I feel the issue is disclaiming every thought or comment...

<modsnip>

Just take anything I say as my opinion.....because I am entitled to it ..... Regardless of of thoughts of others I have mine.

 

[En Passant]

BBM. Some people.

I agree so frustrating until some1 comes forward it now we are getting very little info....so we have to revert to interviews with CPH JB GC

It's hush ville

I do feel for the innocent I am sure the wives are sick over it possibly being some sadistic wacko who my evolve due to being under a micro scope

I have to say I have respected all your posts & I m full of gratitude for those of you ho still try to get to the bottom of this madness
so just lpassing deep heartfelt grate fullness

You are here still trying like daily...
You rock & have my respect

 

[Seaslug44]

It jas been proven that the screaming drugged prostitute was running down Hempstead turnpike in Nassau County (not Ocean Parkway in Suffolk).

 

[En Passant]

It jas been proven that the screaming drugged prostitute was running down Hempstead turnpike in Nassau County (not Ocean Parkway in Suffolk).

Was she black & was she picked up for a "party"too?
I am not formalist to the area I just know it was in an affluent li community.....didn't, remember all the specifics.....
So thank for info. Do you have link to see if that's what I remember? 7 /8 yrs ago is a long time...but I was 41 42 yrs & it was a few key factors that stuck out....what that can also me is it can be someone around...area....maybe before OB stuff...

I have always been interested in big cases. A close family member worked @ suprem & superior court & we would have lunch & I would sit in on cases. I also would utile law library.......I was just amazed at lawyers focus, & new leeks who helped write decisions......our court house is different that's why the Von Bulow case Dershowitz got the greatest law students studying our laws.....

It is interesting & each chief justice & honorable judge worked or viewed law much differently, even disagreeing with others....

Than the station night club fire trial which I also was very interested in as I was on the scene @ 5am when claiming 1 to two people .....it was a nightmare......I still have nightmares. Helicopters flying low day & night for a couple weeks.....like a war zone.

I think there will be a trial & because of the nature of these crimes IMO every little charge will be enforced to max & new procedures may be brought in....

I don,t know but I think they want this wrapped up fast.....summer is here....

So the drugged issue would have to have an informant......I think changes purposibly created more time under the over......I think if FBI is involved they get creative....new technologies.....bring new standards......

If there is an informant ........ Than that will create a roller coaster
I just what to know if they went over all Eric records for CPH & how many times he used sux.......more than usual etc.......just my opinions

 

[dcgrumpy]

Was she black & was she picked up for a "party"too?
I am not formalist to the area I just know it was in an affluent li community.....didn't, remember all the specifics.....
So thank for info. Do you have link to see if that's what I remember? 7 /8 yrs ago is a long time...but I was 41 42 yrs & it was a few key factors that stuck out....what that can also me is it can be someone around...area....maybe before OB stuff...

I have always been interested in big cases. A close family member worked @ suprem & superior court & we would have lunch & I would sit in on cases. I also would utile law library.......I was just amazed at lawyers focus, & new leeks who helped write decisions......our court house is different that's why the Von Bulow case Dershowitz got the greatest law students studying our laws.....

It is interesting & each chief justice & honorable judge worked or viewed law much differently, even disagreeing with others....

Than the station night club fire trial which I also was very interested in as I was on the scene @ 5am when claiming 1 to two people .....it was a nightmare......I still have nightmares. Helicopters flying low day & night for a couple weeks.....like a war zone.

I think there will be a trial & because of the nature of these crimes IMO every little charge will be enforced to max & new procedures may be brought in....

I don,t know but I think they want this wrapped up fast.....summer is here....

So the drugged issue would have to have an informant......I think changes purposibly created more time under the over......I think if FBI is involved they get creative....new technologies.....bring new standards......

If there is an informant ........ Than that will create a roller coaster
I just what to know if they went over all Eric records for CPH & how many times he used sux.......more than usual etc.......just my opinions

Yes. quietgirl posted a link but it was deleted for some reason.

How did you hear about the story if you're not from the area? A prostitute running down the street isn't the kind of thing that makes the national news.

 

[En Passant]

Yes. quietgirl posted a link but it was deleted for some reason.

How did you hear about the story if you're not from the area? A prostitute running down the street isn't the kind of thing that makes the national news.

Seriously I stated several times......so look at posts....
I heard....apparently I did as you noticed.......you claim to be from the area you should know.

Last question I reanswered for you.

<modsnip>

 

[the quiet girl]

I answered that question on several occasions please see my other posts that state this .......digest it ....the post is there. I feel the issue is disclaiming every thought or comment...

Just take anything I say as my opinion.....because I am entitled to it ..... Regardless of of thoughts of others I have mine.

No you are wrong, you stated you saw this on the news then in another post you back track and say you are not from there.
My only agenda is to read facts and posts from legit posters that work hard on helping this case.
<modsnip>

 

[En Passant]

No you are wrong, you stated you saw this on the news then in another post you back track and say you are not from there.
My only agenda is to read facts and posts from legit posters that work hard on helping this case.
<modsnip>

<modsnip>
Question answered already no digging needed here my friend.
My energy is used to bring the victims justice, THE deceased, Tortured, Dismembered Human beings & a baby swaddled in a blanket. I am not as interesting as the person that is going around killing young girls by using Craigs list as JB used to hire SG or for JB to offer a large sum of money to have victim travel to OB IMO just like the other victims.

The thread is about being drugged & my POI is JB who has been mentioned in many articles as John wo hired SG & there were comments that CPH stated he administered SG a seditive.

I think he administered a drug more like Sux than a seditive as SG would not have Jumped & zinged around OB...

I continue to focus on Murdered Tortured Victims & the fact that there is a Sadistic Killer in LI killing VERY Young Adults , that I still view as children Girls, ASAIN young Men & a baby. Personal attacks that are distasteful & create a circus are not in my realm. Thanx but no thanx

I just wonder if GC may have helped JB, CPH & in what capacity......I wonder why GC would have left family alone when MP who seemed very scary & mad.....why did GC feel safe being at the gate instead of taking care of his wife.

I wonder if she was questioned....Does any1 know if EC was Questioned because GC is in every interview why not wife if she was in home when SG was claiming she was going to be killed?

To many things do not add up & I wonder if GC tried to make SG stay till JB got there. Many questions, GC doesn't make any sense each time he opens his mouth.

Nor did CPH about giving seditive or calling MG saying SG was in rehab.

I think the justice system needs to change, if story isn't consistant & there is clear deception they should hold criminals until evidence proves how they are not involved, because they chose to involve themselves.

 

[En Passant]

I think SG was drugged & had help with CPH & possibly GC, simplified now....still keeping the same 3 MAIN players in question