If you agree or disagree with the verdict, let us know why

[beccalecca1]

And I am shocked at the admittedly few posts that repeat over and over that the defense didn't need to prove anything. I think we all agree the law does not require the defense to prove anything. But if members are going to base their opinion of the verdict on the DT's OS, (accidental drowning, GA's involvement) then they should be prepared to back it up with facts and evidence that supports their opinion. This isn't a courtroom, it's a message board. If you think KC is innocent, explain your position with facts and evidence.

I was specifically asked what "facts" proved that the DT's OS was fabrication. Well, first and foremost, the OS is not evidence (though some appear to believe otherwise). There was never any evidence provided to support the DT's OS, which one would hope they would have provided if they had it. Regardless, whether they needed to show it or not, it was never admitted as evidence. Therefore anyone basing their opinion of the verdict on the OS is not basing their opinion on actual evidence.

The prosecution did prove guilt. The facts prove guilt. The evidence supports guilt. The only people who don't agree seem to be ones who are going with the DT's OS which, I repeat, is not evidence.

FWIW, GA should be presumed innocent too, ya know. What facts were presented that so few seem so willing to convict him on?

BBM


I'm not sure if you're directing this at me, but since I fall into the "GA had something to do with it group" I figured I'd respond.

In the previous thread, from about page 8 and on I have many posts that point towards evidence of the drowning theory. Specifically a home video of the A's in the backyard, not swimming, but the pool ladder is attached. The picture of Caylee at the sliding door, that even though she may not have opened it, she could get out it (that on top of Tracy McLaughlin's statements that the A's left the door open all the time for the dogs). The fact that the A's didn't childproof the house to prevent access to the back yard, by CA's testimony. And, the fact that not only did Caylee loved to swim, but she was able to climb the ladder a year prior to this incident.

In my book, this shows evidence that it was indeed possible she drowned.

As far as GA is concerned, I provided evidence in this thread of his evasiveness with questions, and how argumentative he was on the stand... I also provided evidence of how he was with JA during the same questions (he behaved the same way). To me, that shows deceit. And, that's just one part of the whole reason I don't believe GA and believe he had something to do with this.

 

[gladiatorqueen]

Those of us who have questioned the jury's decision and hate it--- The vast majority of us have not insulted the jury or wished them ill. I have seen nothing that we have posted that supports your statement that we are just expressing our anger or resorting to insulting the jury. We are not angry, ignorant rabble with proverbial pitchforks in our hands. My (and others WSers') postings that have said we disagree, don't understand, etc. AND have consistently presented our reasons why we were convinced by the evidence by the State. JMO

Yes, I shouldn't have generalized that all posters who disagree also insult the jury. I am specifically refering to posts that refer to the jurors as being disinterested, irresponsible, lazy, stupid, etc. and not those who simply disagree and provide their reasons why. Cheers.

 

[annalia]

BBM


I'm not sure if you're directing this at me, but since I fall into the "GA had something to do with it group" I figured I'd respond.

In the previous thread, from about page 8 and on I have many posts that point towards evidence of the drowning theory. Specifically a home video of the A's in the backyard, not swimming, but the pool ladder is attached. The picture of Caylee at the sliding door, that even though she may not have opened it, she could get out it (that on top of Tracy McLaughlin's statements that the A's left the door open all the time for the dogs). The fact that the A's didn't childproof the house to prevent access to the back yard, by CA's testimony. And, the fact that not only did Caylee loved to swim, but she was able to climb the ladder a year prior to this incident.

In my book, this shows evidence that it was indeed possible she drowned.

As far as GA is concerned, I provided evidence in this thread of his evasiveness with questions, and how argumentative he was on the stand... I also provided evidence of how he was with JA during the same questions (he behaved the same way). To me, that shows deceit. And, that's just one part of the whole reason I don't believe GA and believe he had something to do with this.

With all due respect, none of that is evidence.

 

[beccalecca1]

Please be so kind as to point out the testimony where he said he bought new gas cans after 8/1 and also where he said there less than an inch of gas in the mower. I can only assume that FCA returned the stolen gas cans empty on 6/24. Did anyone ever ask George if he had gotten gas and put it in a different container ?

http://www.baynews9.com/uploadedfiles/Stories/Local/080509 George Anthony Depo Pgs 151 - 200.pdf

I'll direct you to his deposition, which is a sworn statement under oath.

 

[Sustained]

http://www.baynews9.com/uploadedfiles/Stories/Local/080509 George Anthony Depo Pgs 151 - 200.pdf

I'll direct you to his deposition, which is a sworn statement under oath.

Thanks, I'll have a read amd I know what a deposition is ...

 

[blots]

I never insinuated GA murdered Caylee. In fact, I have posted here specifically that I don't believe anyone harmed Caylee. I'm sorry that is what you've gotten from my posts, but that is not what I stated at all.

Sorry to be so blunt but she is dead. If you want to believe that Caylee was solely responsible for her own demise, say by drowning, and that it is all right for someone to ignore the possibility of CPR reviving her, then I guess no one harmed her as you say and Caylee is responsible for this whole debacle. Never mind she was a baby. She should have known better and called 911 herself before she went for a swim. Pfft.:waitasec:

 

[gladiatorqueen]

With all due respect, none of that is evidence.

How is it not evidence?

 

[beccalecca1]

OK, then someone explain to me that if Caylee drowned in the swimming pool and either GA/FCA/both were home at the time, why 911 was not called ? Theories are fine - go ahead and give it your best shot.

I'll give you my theory, even if it opens the room for insults in my direction

Since GA and CA were rebuilding their relationship, he didn't want something bad to happen to Caylee on his watch, it would reflect upon him and being a bad grandparent.

GA threw Casey into the mix because it would also reflect her as a bad parent for not paying attention to Caylee.

And, maybe neither one of them wanted to cause so much pain to CA by telling her what truly happened, maybe they both were afraid she'd lose it. But, it would be a lot easier for someone in their shoes to believe that if it was covered up maybe it'll go over more smoothly. That would take their personal responsibility out of the equation and they could blame someone else for it.

MOO.

 

[Baznme]

It amazes me as I read the posts how much doubt the DT was able to create with the pool pic's and GA's hedging at times, being combative with Baez, etc. CA had to have been the one to provide those pic's to the DT as ICA didn't have access to them being in jail. The little girl at the door, IMO isn't Caylee but that's just MOO. GA was between a rock and a hard place from the start. He's the one that went to the grand jury and told the truth as he knew it. He's the one that gave his depo to LE stating the smell from the car WAS decomp. He's the one that was asked the questions "did you molest your daughter"....."did you dispose of your grandaughter's body".....is it any wonder he would be combative? Careful how he chose his words? If he was guilty of anything, it was being too passive with his daughter's behavior and not pushing for resolution of the problems in that house with Casey. He's aged ten years in three. His only grandaughter is dead. If it was an accident, why wouldn't he have called 911, LE, the next door neighbor, instructed Casey to do that while he administered CPR? He was ex-LE, he knew what to do! I'm a grandmother six times but I remember when the first born was the only one. I cannot imagine what it would be like to lose that child, even though there were five after her. I see the pain in his face, his voice and above all, I do not believe he had an inkling of exactly when Caylee died until the opening defense team comments. It's only my opinion, but after 60+ years of life experience, I think I can read a grandparents heart pretty well.

 

[TexasLori]

My take is that people who agree with the verdict ARE and HAVE BEEN consistently presenting their reasons for why they were not convinced by the evidence presented by the State. It seems to me that those who disagree either may want express their anger at that or resort to insulting the jury, which inevitably means insulting those who agree with that jury. Just my two cents.

While there may be those who do this, please do not insinuate we all do. I do disagree with the verdict, and I don't respect the way the jury came to it (going by what some of the jurors have stated in the press) but I have not insulted any jurors or other posters.

 

[annalia]

molestation is pretty darn hard to prove EVER! The perp doesn't usually get on the stand and say Why yes, I did. and, Victims rarely tell.

As far as the drowning theory, the pictures helped to infer it could have happened.

All my own opinion.

Of course it is and that's exactly why the DT used it, they knew it could never be "disproven". Throw dad under the bus and there will be those who believe it because george "looked" like he could have done it.


JMHO

 

[beccalecca1]

With all due respect, none of that is evidence.

With all due respect, I completely disagree. The pictures were introduced as evidence. The testimony of CA was introduced as evidence. The statements of GA's lies were introduced into evidence.

The only things I stated that were not evidence is Tracy's interviews and the home video. But, everything else was evidence and entered into the trial.

 

[gladiatorqueen]

While there may be those who do this, please do not insinuate we all do.

Yes, I agree, and I've already corrected myself on that one. Cheers.

 

[Nova24]

GA had nothing to do with Caylee's death. There was also no accidental drowning. She killed that baby and is happy she's dead. Now it's money and fun time for ICA. Justice will come her way one day with God.

 

[RR0004]

It's in this particular thread, pages back. I'd have to go back and re-read the thread to direct you there, and I just feel that I shouldn't have to.. honestly

Just thought that a link may be provided...see that it's somewhere in this thread so I will go back and read.

 

[TexasLori]

I never insinuated GA murdered Caylee. In fact, I have posted here specifically that I don't believe anyone harmed Caylee. I'm sorry that is what you've gotten from my posts, but that is not what I stated at all.

I'm sorry, you don't believe anyone harmed Caylee? She was found decomposed in a swamp. Is that not indicative of harm?

 

[grandmaj]

WE have repeatedly warned that you are to make your opinon in a post without dragging in other posters and talking about other posters. Now this is your warning. Stop the snark and talking about other posters! FINAL WARNING and then TO's start. And if you are not a moderator don't tell other posters how they can or should post!

 

[cluciano63]

Maybe the State should have included charges of not reporting a death.
Or maybe they should have outlined scenarios in which an accidental death could still be manslaughter, due to negligence.
But they only wanted to keep jurors thinking about premediated first-degree murder, IMO. The other charges were there, but the state did not want them to make use of them.

I really do believe Casey is guilty, all by herself, but I also really believe that from the trial alone, other sources notwithstanding, I couldn't feel comfortable convicting her. Nothing to do with the opening statement, because I have no idea if she drowned, tripped and fell, or was killed by her mother on purpose. Casey not calling 911 does not prove anything to me except that she is an exception to every rule, which I did gather from the trial.

 

[hollyblue]

IMO...the case was lost before the trial even began. IF LE would have investigated the August finding of Kronk there might have been more evidence to convict..along with the overcharges brought against her. If there would have been other charges to choose from, things might have been different. imo They didn't have the hard evidence to back up the murder charge . She knows what happen to little Caylee--how and why she died, but there was no direct link (from evidence) to link her to murder. The testimony of the chloroform testing...could not be quantified, so why even bother bringing it in? I'd be looking up chloroform if my bf posted on his website what her bf did. I believe CA is ultimately responsible for what happened, but just don't know, by the evidence, who, when, why or how. I can't help but think, if her little body was found in August, the answers may have been there.

As far as George and Cindy. I think they both fell on the sword for CA and it was all part of the defense. The charade of G & C not having any contact and there being a big split, it just that...a charade. G & C know exactly where CA is and exactly what is going on....basically it's now how to stay safe and rack in the money. I truly believe that...and it's all part of PR for the bigger end reward. Sadly I think there will be many that will be buying into it all. I know I won't, and I pray she not have another child. Also, don't agree she doesn't have any psychiatric problems....yeah right!

JFYI, I didn't follow her case closely and dropped it after the Kronk fiasco...so I saw it (the case) much the same as the jury. I felt it was all BS after that and everyone from both the prosecution and the defense scrambled "trying" to piece together a case. Orlando made a fortune and milked it for all it was worth. IMO, JMO, MOO.

 

[cuppy199]

With all due respect, I completely disagree. The pictures were introduced as evidence. The testimony of CA was introduced as evidence. The statements of GA's lies were introduced into evidence.

The only things I stated that were not evidence is Tracy's interviews and the home video. But, everything else was evidence and entered into the trial.

Im curious on what so called lies of GA that were introduced as evidence? The only lies were entered into evidence that Im aware of was from KA and they were caught on tape.