If you agree or disagree with the verdict, let us know why

[cityslick]

For the umteenthousandth time, the state proved their case. The jurors were inept and either ignored the choices they had or didn't understand the choices they had. The jurors wanted to do home...it was 4th of July weekend.
THAT JURY DID NOT CARE ABOUT A PROPER VERDICT. NOR DID THEY CARE THAT CAYLEE GOT JUSTICE.

The jury is not there for the victim and their justice. They are there to decide a defendants guilt or innocence based on evidence presented during the trial. If the jury was there to only get justice for Caylee, why have a trial at all, just render a verdict on day one?

 

[kelian36]

The jury is not there for the victim and their justice. They are there to decide a defendants guilt or innocence based on evidence presented during the trial. If the jury was there to only get justice for Caylee, why have a trial at all, just render a verdict on day one?

Should have been a bench trial because that would have been the verdict.

They jury got it wrong-WRONG. The state proved their case. Ignore it as the jurors did. :innocent:

 

[thedeviledadvocate]

The drowning theory does NOT have to float. It is the job of the DT to raise reasonable doubt, which they did. Thirty-one days? That proves nothing, nor does lack of remorse - neither proves murder. I don't see KC lying about the "accident", her lawyer did, supposedly, operative word, with her blessing or some such, but who really knows.

The law is NOT about justice, and I believe this is where many people are going wrong. The law is about interpretation of the law, the best spin wins - almost sounds like a carnival, doesn't it? Sad but true, that's what the law is all about.

'Course this is only my opinion

As much as I want to believe this is wrong, I can't. This is correct, in many cases it comes down to "the best spin wins".

It doesn't matter how the defense did what they did, the bottom line is that KC is a free woman. It doesn't matter how well the prosecution did what they did, the bottom line is that KC is a free woman

In this thread, if we were a jury, we would have ended up being a hung jury. No one on this thread, be they pro or against the verdict is willing to give one iota. We all believe what we believe. We have made no headway whatsoever since the verdict was announced.

If 12 of us were sequestered, 6 pro 6 against, armed only with what was said by witnesses and lawyers at trial, and with the 400ish pieces of evidence in front of us, I believe we may get one person to change one way or the other, but there is no way we could come to a unanimous verdict.

For the most part, we understand where the opposing view is coming from, we just totally disagree with their opinions, and vica versa. For the most part, we have respected one another here, cuz if we didn't, Kimster would put us in the naughty corner for a day or two.

Our good friend Albert E defines insanity as doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. LOL well, in this thread, I may be repeating my opinion over and over, but I am definately not expecting any different results from those postings LOL.

This thread is very interesting, and you have to admit, we are a stubborn bunch. LOL

If KC did what so many think she did, and if Karma exists, she will indeed get whats coming to her, and even if Karma doesn't exist, we all know Caylee is safe now, and again, if KC did what so many think she did, she will eventually and ultimately get whats coming to her.

Does anyone have any idea what LA meant when he said what someone posted a little earlier that he said
IS THIS LIKE THE LAST TIME????
I don't recall that. TIA

As always, my entire post is my opinion only.

 

[onewick]

I actually see the bolded statement quite differently (imagine that :crazy


Either that excited her to be in that much trouble, or she just didn't realize what was going on around her because she was out of touch with reality. :twocents:

OR.... She was arrogant, conniving and calculating enough to believe she could lie her way out of that too! And it worked!!! she got away with murder!!!

 

[Leah0107]

As much as I want to believe this is wrong, I can't. This is correct, in many cases it comes down to "the best spin wins".

It doesn't matter how the defense did what they did, the bottom line is that KC is a free woman. It doesn't matter how well the prosecution did what they did, the bottom line is that KC is a free woman

In this thread, if we were a jury, we would have ended up being a hung jury. No one on this thread, be they pro or against the verdict is willing to give one iota. We all believe what we believe. We have made no headway whatsoever since the verdict was announced.

If 12 of us were sequestered, 6 pro 6 against, armed only with what was said by witnesses and lawyers at trial, and with the 400ish pieces of evidence in front of us, I believe we may get one person to change one way or the other, but there is no way we could come to a unanimous verdict.

For the most part, we understand where the opposing view is coming from, we just totally disagree with their opinions, and vica versa. For the most part, we have respected one another here, cuz if we didn't, Kimster would put us in the naughty corner for a day or two.

Our good friend Albert E defines insanity as doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. LOL well, in this thread, I may be repeating my opinion over and over, but I am definately not expecting any different results from those postings LOL.

This thread is very interesting, and you have to admit, we are a stubborn bunch. LOL

If KC did what so many think she did, and if Karma exists, she will indeed get whats coming to her, and even if Karma doesn't exist, we all know Caylee is safe now, and again, if KC did what so many think she did, she will eventually and ultimately get whats coming to her.

Does anyone have any idea what LA meant when he said what someone posted a little earlier that he said
IS THIS LIKE THE LAST TIME????
I don't recall that. TIA

As always, my entire post is my opinion only.

Well said!

Regarding LA - IIRC - No hard evidence on this but I believe it was something he supposedly said to FCA when he questioned her about being pregnant and she blew him off. Can't remember if I heard that as direct testimony from him or it was something someone brought up after.

 

[logicalgirl]

If by being out of touch with reality you mean that she could get away with her lies, then we are talking about two different things by the use of that term.

Casey was the sort of person who had a history of getting away with lying. She was good at it and she knew it. That is the kind of person who takes a lie that far.

But do you think she actually believed she worked at Universal Studios?
That would be being out of touch with reality.

:twocents:

And she "forgot" she was "out of touch" with reality when she turned around in the hallway, put her hands in her back pockets and admitted she did not work at Universal.

 

[onewick]

Do you think GA is the only one that ever told the truth in the family? Why do you think that?

No I don't believe I said anything of the sort.

Im simply asking to compare & discuss lies and inconsistencies between GA & CFCA and let's deliberate??? (for the jurors :floorlaugh

 

[HatesSociopaths]

I actually see the bolded statement quite differently (imagine that :crazy

I believe she was so far from reality that she met LE at Universal Studios, took them down some hallway, until she realized that the jig was up, no one was going to believe it.

What kind of person takes a lie that far with LE (of all people)??

She brought them there, they didn't ask to go to her job, if IIRC. She stated she'd meet them there to pick up her Nokia cell from her desk and they could stop at the security podium to see if anyone's seen Caylee.

Either that excited her to be in that much trouble, or she just didn't realize what was going on around her because she was out of touch with reality. :twocents:

Yeah just like those fake emails from Universal. She obviously believed she worked there, and apparently was channeling her boss she knew she had at the time and wrote what she thinks her boss wanted her to wear to work. Is that how your theory goes?

 

[logicalgirl]

1st. There was no evidence that I recall that said that she made didn't want to leave Caylee with George.

2nd. Could be that she didn't return home after Caylee died cause, umm' she couldn't explain why here daughter wasn't with her. Sounds far-fetched I know, but work with me here.

IMO - CFCA would have gladly left Caylee with George if she needed to and could provide him with a good reason why she couldn't care for Caylee herself.

But remember, she didn't need to go home. She had money, which she was stealing from Amy's bank account. She stayed at Tony's because she was apparently welcome there. She didn't need a sitter. And she didn't have to explain any further why she stole thousands from her mother's bank account and hundred's from her Grandfather, and of course there was that pesky question about where was Caylee.

But - to keep her parents off track, she told lie after lie after lie about where and why she and Caylee were not even in Olando. She was stalling for time so she could either move to NYC with Tony or quickly find another mark...

 

[sacrablue]

It all boils down to two camps. Those that want to play law and evidence games and those that want to punish the person that was responsible for a two year old child's death.

 

[Sustained]

As much as I want to believe this is wrong, I can't. This is correct, in many cases it comes down to "the best spin wins".

It doesn't matter how the defense did what they did, the bottom line is that KC is a free woman. It doesn't matter how well the prosecution did what they did, the bottom line is that KC is a free woman

In this thread, if we were a jury, we would have ended up being a hung jury. No one on this thread, be they pro or against the verdict is willing to give one iota. We all believe what we believe. We have made no headway whatsoever since the verdict was announced.

If 12 of us were sequestered, 6 pro 6 against, armed only with what was said by witnesses and lawyers at trial, and with the 400ish pieces of evidence in front of us, I believe we may get one person to change one way or the other, but there is no way we could come to a unanimous verdict.

For the most part, we understand where the opposing view is coming from, we just totally disagree with their opinions, and vica versa. For the most part, we have respected one another here, cuz if we didn't, Kimster would put us in the naughty corner for a day or two.

Our good friend Albert E defines insanity as doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. LOL well, in this thread, I may be repeating my opinion over and over, but I am definately not expecting any different results from those postings LOL.

This thread is very interesting, and you have to admit, we are a stubborn bunch. LOL

If KC did what so many think she did, and if Karma exists, she will indeed get whats coming to her, and even if Karma doesn't exist, we all know Caylee is safe now, and again, if KC did what so many think she did, she will eventually and ultimately get whats coming to her.

Does anyone have any idea what LA meant when he said what someone posted a little earlier that he said
IS THIS LIKE THE LAST TIME????
I don't recall that. TIA

As always, my entire post is my opinion only.

A mistrial would have been better than we ended up ... this thread was a continuation of a poll "Did the jury get it wrong" in which ~82% of those WS members who voted believed the jury was wrong. If we extrapolate those votes to the general public and thus to another future jury, I think the odds would be pretty good of getting the 2nd jury to convict.

 

[sacrablue]

Now would I feel guilty putting Casey behind bars? Not in the least...but I would sentence her for 20 years no parole with one option. If Casey wants to tell the truth and fess up to what happened, I would cut her time in halph no mater what happened. Otherwise I through the key away for 20 years.

You ask "what if it was a pool accident?" Casey already had that chance.

 

[logicalgirl]

It all boils down to two camps. Those that want to play law and evidence games and those that want to punish the person that was responsible for a two year old child's death.

I understand arguing about whether or not the evidence fit the crime - but I do not understand why the actual evidence is being argued. The SA had to face stringent court rules to even be admitted, and most was admitted after expert evidence given after the Frye hearings.

To argue that Dr. Vass was some unknown guy who did questionable lab experiments is laughable. The defense expert was someone who wasn't even in his league are far as credentials were concerned, let alone experience. He was a professor who claimed credit for submissions his students did, and his work certainly wasn't peer reviewed and accepted within the scientific community. Dr. Haskell, the bug expert, is revered throughout the world. His student, Dr. Huntington conducted his first experiment to argue against Dr. Haskell's expert testimony using conditions not even close to the real conditions and in the end conceded those facts. The list goes on and on. And then we have the plant expert "Dr Jane" who had never studies plants in Florida, and suggested the bones were under the leaves because a coyote buried them. I understand the expert testimony was boring and perhaps people didn't pay it a lot of attention. but in terms of fact- it is unchallengeable.

 

[beccalecca1]

But<modsnip> he was not the only witness or the only evidence against her. Her own actions were more incriminating then ANY of the witnesses or evidence. She was the only one who has access to all of the items at the crime scene. I ask you, why did she borrow the shovel? Why did she refuse to speak to the FBI when her father begged her to? Why did search for "How To Make Chloroform"? Why did she lie to the police? Why did not cooperate with the authorities? I could go on and on. My point is all of her actions were to either to plan,commit or cover her crime.

No, he was not the only witness, but IMO he was an important one, if not the most important one since he was the last to see the 2 of them leave the house.

 

[logicalgirl]

My next answer to anyone who questions the evidence is: kindly define a Frye Hearing, which the SA's experts had to pass before submitting evidence.

 

[annalia]

A mistrial would have been better than we ended up ... this thread was a continuation of a poll "Did the jury get it wrong" in which ~82% of those WS members who voted believed the jury was wrong. If we extrapolate those votes to the general public and thus to another future jury, I think the odds would be pretty good of getting the 2nd jury to convict.

ITA a hung jury would have been better than acquittal.

How can it be possible that six jurors changes all of their votes so quickly, what did it take in total, less than a day to go from 6-6 to unanimous NG?

Something hinky went on inside the jury room.

JMHO

 

[Sustained]

I understand arguing about whether or not the evidence fit the crime - but I do not understand why the actual evidence is being argued. The SA had to face stringent court rules to even be admitted, and most was admitted after expert evidence given after the Frye hearings.

To argue that Dr. Vass was some unknown guy who did questionable lab experiments is laughable. The defense expert was someone who wasn't even in his league are far as credentials were concerned, let alone experience. He was a professor who claimed credit for submissions his students did, and his work certainly wasn't peer reviewed and accepted within the scientific community. Dr. Haskell, the bug expert, is revered throughout the world. His student, Dr. Huntington conducted his first experiment to argue against Dr. Haskell's expert testimony using conditions not even close to the real conditions and in the end conceded those facts. The list goes on and on. And then we have the plant expert "Dr Jane" who had never studies plants in Florida, and suggested the bones were under the leaves because a coyote buried them. I understand the expert testimony was boring and perhaps people didn't pay it a lot of attention. but in terms of fact- it is unchallengeable.

And don't forget Dr. Spitz, who couldn't remember an interview he did 3 or 4 days earlier and did 60,000 autopsies in his career which someone did the math on and found the number a bit excessive.

 

[Sustained]

ITA a hung jury would have been better than acquittal.

How can it be possible that six jurors changes all of their votes so quickly, what did it take in total, less than a day to go from 6-6 to unanimous NG?

Something hinky went on inside the jury room.

JMHO

LOL, it's called "We're deadlocked on the aggravated manslaughter charge ... raise your hands if you like the Prosecution team <counts no votes> .... and now the defense team <no need to count votes>... ok, looks like we're not deadlocked anymore.

 

[sacrablue]

I understand arguing about whether or not the evidence fit the crime - but I do not understand why the actual evidence is being argued. The SA had to face stringent court rules to even be admitted, and most was admitted after expert evidence given after the Frye hearings.

To argue that Dr. Vass was some unknown guy who did questionable lab experiments is laughable. The defense expert was someone who wasn't even in his league are far as credentials were concerned, let alone experience. He was a professor who claimed credit for submissions his students did, and his work certainly wasn't peer reviewed and accepted within the scientific community. Dr. Haskell, the bug expert, is revered throughout the world. His student, Dr. Huntington conducted his first experiment to argue against Dr. Haskell's expert testimony using conditions not even close to the real conditions and in the end conceded those facts. The list goes on and on. And then we have the plant expert "Dr Jane" who had never studies plants in Florida, and suggested the bones were under the leaves because a coyote buried them. I understand the expert testimony was boring and perhaps people didn't pay it a lot of attention. but in terms of fact- it is unchallengeable.

I will never understand the expert witness presentations. The prosecution on the most part was clean and precise and understandable. Baez's experts were a joke. Just awful. I wonder some times if it is really necessary to be so precise. If you are not going to play by the rules why bother?

 

[gxm]

I'm going to disagree with you on the bolded.

If they loved Caylee they would not have left her alone with Casey. They KNEW Casey was not right, call it what you want, but Casey's personality was off the charts COO COO. She'd been lying, stealing, partying and <modsnip> it up for YEARS.. how do you think Caylee came about. After the first time she had s#x?

Cindy was an enabler that allowed Casey to get away with her bad behavior.
George was a <modsnip> for not forcing Cindy to face the truth and stopping the charade.

The grandparents , Cindy and Geroge, put that precious baby in harms way EVERY TIME THE LEFT HER WITH CASEY. They knew better. That's not love.

sorry for the rant.

This post breaks my heart. And I apologize in advance if I come across combative. It's not directed at you personally. But I have firsthand experience with having a DIL who is alarmingly like KC. Luckily, my son can fight for custody so if fate is kind to us, we'll be able to get my grandson out of harm's way. I just want to emphasize that grandparents have no rights. My DIL told the police that we "kidnapped" our grandson because he wandered upstairs (they live on our lower level) while his mom was passed out asleep. We had an appointment so I called my son at work to let him know we were taking the little guy with us. What were we supposed to do? Leave a toddler alone in a house while his mother slept off another bender? Well, according to my DIL, that's kidnapping. Of course the police didn't see it that way, but still what a mess. Until you have been in this incredibly painful position, you don't understand how difficult it is to navigate.

Again, not directed at you, eleni777. Just trying to shed light on CA and GA's catch 22 predicament.