Deceased/Not Found IL - Yingying Zhang, 26, Urbana, 9 June 2017 #3 *Arrest*

[scadder21]

Could he have lured her with the prospect of an apartment? He would be moving out I presume so it may have been true and then turned sinister. He communicated about the apartment, then looked her up online and thought she would be a good victim. He then followed her and that day, he said, "You are looking for an apartment? wow, such a coincidence but we talked online about MY apartment. Why don't you come see it now??"

That scenario would actually answer alot of questions for me as it would explain why she got in the car. Why she got in the car is what most puzzles me. If he had communicated with her before or if she communicated with him and he had mentioned a wife or girlfriend, she maybe would have gotten in the car.

That actually is a scenario that makes a ton of sense. She gets in to get to the apartment meeting. He mentions that he's leasing his apartment and has moved out and offers to show it to her for her to stay there. She walks right in.

 

[liltexans]

Could he have lured her with the prospect of an apartment? He would be moving out I presume so it may have been true and then turned sinister. He communicated about the apartment, then looked her up online and thought she would be a good victim. He then followed her and that day, he said, "You are looking for an apartment? wow, such a coincidence but we talked online about MY apartment. Why don't you come see it now??"

That scenario would actually answer alot of questions for me as it would explain why she got in the car. Why she got in the car is what most puzzles me. If he had communicated with her before or if she communicated with him and he had mentioned a wife or girlfriend, she maybe would have gotten in the car.

For some reason, I was under the impression the landlord of the apartment Yingying was headed to was female, but now I can't find the link that gave me that impression. I know we were told that the landlord texted Yingying around 2:30 pm that day asking if she was still coming to sign the lease.

Maybe Yingying unfortunately gave too much information to BC when he drove up and he managed to think on the fly and said he was actually the landlord or the landlord's husband or something. We'll really never know the true answer because I don't believe anything BC says and it would be his account of what happened and what his conversation with Yingying was before she got into his car.

 

[liltexans]

No, it wouldn't work.

What wouldn't work?

 

[Yellow]

That actually is a scenario that makes a ton of sense. She gets in to get to the apartment meeting. He mentions that he's leasing his apartment and has moved out and offers to show it to her for her to stay there. She walks right in.

I am not sure how late she was running. If she was late he would have had to convince her it would only be a quick stop on the way (which I don't think it was, but I don't know the geography) or that he would wait for her at the other apartment and show her his later.

It actually would explain too his comment that she panicked in the car. Maybe she agreed to go to his apartment but then panicked when she realized he lied about it being on the way to the first apartment. Usually when people lie there is a grain of truth to the lie. She panicked at some point, he is just lying about when.

 

[Satchie]

Big problem though...BC became inactive on Fetlife about 2 days before the kidnapping.

Interesting. The timing seems potentially significant. I wonder if something happened to turn him off the site, and turn him towards the real thing rather than role play. Or, as the FBI implies, had he learned everything he wanted to know?

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[citigirl]

Yes, I agree, I am not claiming quitting the PhD program was a reason for him to go out and kidnap and murder innocent people. Not at all. What I'm saying is that it appears to be a compounding factor. The news coverage I've seen on the case paints this man as a "former grad student" and in the interview with the program advisor a picture was painted that he went in and informed them of his decision in a more or less calm or rational manner. His lying on his Linked In profile simply goes to his state of mind at the time the murder was committed. By lying about his credentials it shows he felt he was lacking, that he did not accomplish enough to be competitive. It also shows great hubris since a simple phone call by a prospective employer to his program advisor would have revealed his earned a Masters degree and nothing more.

I agree, and I didn't think you were claiming that I am just thinking out loud. I do think his sink into depression is a piece of the puzzle--contributing to self-esteem problems, or addiction issues, and who knows what else. I would like to get a little more insight into his thinking, because it might help in finding YZ. Sometimes our thinking here is helpful to LE. They have told us that. I think you are 100% on target with your interpretation of the lie on his LinkedIn profile.

 

[dizzychick]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/suspect-illinois-kidnap-case-1st-051054740.html

I don't guess anyone could get a pic of him since its federal court?

 

[Satchie]

Deleted

 

[Yvettea]

What wouldn't work?

If BC lured her online it would show in her browser history which FBI would have checked by now, probably for an answer to that very question, "Did YZ and BC have online contact?"

 

[choocha]

Interesting. The timing seems potentially significant. I wonder if something happened to turn him off the site, and turn him towards the real thing rather than role play. Or, as the FBI implies, had he learned everything he wanted to know?

What matters in this implication is how often he was visiting the site. If he was only a casual user, then the fact he wasn't on there every day wouldn't be a surprise. I also think you're reaching on the FBI implication. According to the complaint, he visited that specific thread on April 19th. There's no mention of him accessing that particular thread any other date other than that date and I imagine had it been more recent, they'd have used the more recent date in the complaint. That's more than 2 months before Zhang's abduction. It's unknown how often he returned to the site after that, how often he referred to the Abduction 101 thread, and the only thing verifiable is that we know he was there 2 days before hand, but not his activity then. He could've just have easily been responding to a message or having a browse the last time he was on there. Without more information of his use of that site, there's no way to draw any conclusion other than guessing. His visit of the Abduction 101 thread may have only been 1 time for 2 minutes. He could've gathered information on how to abduct elsewhere that we don't know about as well.

We should have more tangible information today (Wednesday). He's scheduled for a bond hearing and the prosecution will have to show evidence as to why he shouldn't be granted bail and I would assume we'll get more than just what's in the complaint/already out there. If the authorities know that she is dead and have proof she is dead, today could be the day they reveal that.

 

[choocha]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/suspect-illinois-kidnap-case-1st-051054740.html

I don't guess anyone could get a pic of him since its federal court?

No cameras allowed in federal court.

 

[liltexans]

Apparently, the FBI has been known to go undercover on FetLife. Maybe that's what happened here.

http://www.wtma.com/news/what-we-know-about-the-fetlife-fetish-site/

The Illinois case is not the first time FetLife has been mentioned in a criminal investigation.

A Haverhill, New York man was charged in April with making and distributing child *advertiser censored*. Authorities say an undercover FBI task force officer first came into contact with the man on FetLife.

 

[liltexans]

online contact?"
If BC lured her online it would show in her browser history which FBI would have checked by now, probably for an answer to that very question, "Did YZ and BC have online contact?"

Yes, that's what I was saying. I think we're on the same page here. The FBI has commented that they won't comment as to whether BC and YZ had any prior contact or knew each other in person or online before June 9th.

 

[Yellow]

His whole story about the car ride is odd. Why would he paint himself in a negative light? He contends she panicked when he drove down a wrong street and he let here out. He’s admitting he did something that made her uncomfortable. Why even say that? Why not just say, “hey, she got in my car, she realized she forgot something or she realized she dropped her cell phone so I let her out.” His story is just odd. Why did he want to only admit to her being in the car a very short period of time?

I wonder too if there were any cameras on places where he was driving. Too bad this isn’t London- they have cameras everywhere.

I’m glad he did this but it was pretty stupid to even talk to the cops. Probably speaks to his hubris. He could have argued someone stole his car or he let someone borrow the car instead of admitting he was the car driver.

 

[Satchie]

I don't think the FBI fudged.

I mean in terms of the FBI invoking the Fetlife account as a reason to claim federal jurisdiction on the kidnapping.

22. Pursuant to the search warrant, a forensic examination was conducted on the SUBJECT PHONE. The forensic examination of the SUBJECT PHONE indicated, in part, that on or about April 19, 2017, the user of the SUBJECT PHONE visited a forum on the website FetLife entitled Abduction 101, to include subthreads Perfect abduction fantasy and Planning a kidnapping. This phone, a means, facility, and instrumentality of Interstate Commerce, was therefore used in committing and in furtherance of the commission of this offense.

It seems to me the discussion has become preoccupied with imagining how the crime could have directly involved Fetlife, in order to make the federal charges a better fit.



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[Deleted member 102539]

All I can think of is that it is in a place where they do not want the public to go, and yet is still difficult to find. I think WSers who are suggested the landfill might be on the right track.

I don't know to find the link now but in his online-profile he mentioned his "fear of dump sites" (or similar wording). I noticed that a lot.

 

[Elainera]

If he liked to make home movies it would be odd if he hadn't recorded YZ. This must have been a hugely important moment for him. I'm pretty sure he recorded her and that's why LE knows she's no longer alive. It might even be so graphic that they don't even need the body to prove murder.

Reminds me of that British banker in Hongkong, Rurik Jutting. He took young local prostitutes to his apartment, then tortured, raped and killed them. He was into kinky stuff as well iirc. He killed two women and filmed most of it. When LE got to him one woman was still stuffed in a suitcase on his balcony. He was sentenced to life last year.

 

[Yellow]

I mean in terms of the FBI invoking the Fetlife account as a reason to claim federal jurisdiction on the kidnapping.



It seems to me the discussion has become preoccupied with imagining how the crime could have directly involved Fetlife, in order to make the federal charges a better fit.



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Yeah that is probably the case. The feds have to know keeping jxn in this case could be iffy if thats all they have so they stretch it a little with the Fetlife site. They either don't want to reveal a better connection or that's all they have or they want to make a splash and it's a calculated move to expand jxn beyond what is typical. Usually complaints have a separate jurisdiction section which clearly states why they have jurisdiction. They don't have that, they just refer to it vaguely in another part of the complaint.

 

[dove28]

Does anyone here have a Ph.D. in the sciences? The one I am working on is in social sciences, which requires all coursework completed, comprehensives taken and passed, and half your dissertation written in the form of a proposal and approved by a committee. Many years ago I pursued a Humanities doctorate, which required all coursework taken and comprehensives passed.

I am assuming the sciences follow the same pattern as the social sciences, because approval would be necessary. I don't think most people would leave a sciences doctorate undone once they got to the stage of getting their research approved?

Science PhD here. At least at my school, you would refer to yourself as a candidate after taking your qualifying/preliminary exam and passing (typically in your 3rd year at my school, in the 2nd year at some other schools). You take your quals or prelims after you have done your coursework and are in a lab. This exam varies by department, but usually includes a proposal for your research, and an oral or written component that tests general knowledge. Your proposal is approved by your thesis committee. Most people who drop out of a PhD do so before quals or if they can't pass their quals (I think in my year 4 out of 35 people left, all before the qualifying exam), and the fact that BC dropped out so late is odd. However, I would be surprised if he hadn't finished his quals yet, and I do think it highly likely he was a PhD candidate and not PhD student.

 

[citigirl]

Science PhD here. At least at my school, you would refer to yourself as a candidate after taking your qualifying/preliminary exam and passing (typically in your 3rd year at my school, in the 2nd year at some other schools). You take your quals or prelims after you have done your coursework and are in a lab. This exam varies by department, but usually includes a proposal for your research, and an oral or written component that tests general knowledge. Your proposal is approved by your thesis committee. Most people who drop out of a PhD do so before quals or if they can't pass their quals (I think in my year 4 out of 35 people left, all before the qualifying exam), and the fact that BC dropped out so late is odd. However, I would be surprised if he hadn't finished his quals yet, and I do think it highly likely he was a PhD candidate and not PhD student.

Yes, I agree, it would be odd for him to drop out so late. Which is why I question that he is a candidate...especially because the dept. spokesman says he took more courses after telling them he wanted to drop out.

If he did this crime, he is a kidnapper and a murderer, so it doesn't seem far-fetched to me that he is also a liar.