Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #158

[MntnHiker]

IMO I do not think RA had previously targeted the girls or knew them in any way. I am open to being wrong about this, but here is what I envision.

I do think he went to the trails with possibly the idea of committing a crime in his mind. I mainly say this because of how he parked at the CPS building, backing in as if to conceal his plate. I also was going to add the fact he carried weapons to walk a trail as evidence of this too, but I know some people always carry their gun with them, so I am unsure on that one. I think I'd have to know what was typical for RA. Did he usually leave it at home or bring it with him?

I think he didn't attack or kill the three juveniles he first passed because he felt more exposed in that area and/or three people are a lot more difficult than even two. I believe him concealing his face and walking with his head down, as witnessed by those witnesses, was because he did intend to do something criminal and didn't want witnesses to be able to describe him well. Perhaps something set him off this day and made him angry, so he drives to the trails, where maybe he has gone before to honestly clear his head, but he has had thoughts of doing something like this before and decides today is the day if he can find a suitable victim.

I believe he passed A and L previously before coming up behind them in the video. This could be why A decided to start filming. It would seem odd to pass someone who was headed back towards the trailhead and then all of a sudden, they do an about-face and are coming back at you. And perhaps he looked at them oddly the first time they crossed paths or did something to get their hackles raised. I believe he chose them because no one else was around - I think he looked at this before deciding to turn around and go attack them - and he could quickly get them "down the hill" and away from anyone who might come along soon. This is all just my speculation but I can see it happening this way and not being pre-targeted to these girls.

 

[Zapoleon]

Since when is backing in an odd way to park? I feel like I’m missing something

I think its more of a case of the witness thinking back after knowing murders took place thinking to themselves well that car was kinda oddly parked out of the way.

 

[mickey2942]

Agreeing w/ you Peppery,
A laundry expert would be great.

A veterinary expert too. And a pharmacological one.

What if he didn't go home after murdering the two girls? Instead, what if he had access to his wife's veterinary office? Don't such establishments have large showers? Rooms with floors that slope and which have drains ? He could have washed himself and all his clothing there?

Also, doesn't a vet's office have many surgical implements available: Did RA have access to industrial strength cleaning capabilities, surgery/cutting equipment, etc.?

It always makes me wonder with someone who works in a pharmacy, also, or has a family member who is a Dr./Vet, etc.: What kind of meds can someone obtain? Was RA on some high-grade "speed" or hormone drug that day in 2017 which gave him more strength, energy, or risk-taking aptitude?

So Scary to think about.

I applaud LE on all the work they did on this case. My sense is that...... the trial may have a STAGGERING amount of evidence to show.

MOO.

I have worked in hospitals, but that doesn't mean that my husband had access to come into the surgical processing room to take a shower. I can't imagine any scenario, unless his wife owned the business, that her spouse could come in and have free reign over the place.

As for laundry, this guy is the world's biggest idiot if he still has the same clothes he wore to kill the girls. I have a Carharrt jacket, it looks like that is what he is wearing, it is beast, I have had mine for over a decade, I have washed it, hosed it off, but stuff still stays in the seams, even after doing it at the laundromat, and using those super hot dryers.

 

[girlhasnoname]

Wow, that gave me serious chills. RA spent a lot of time down the embankment with Abby & Libby.

 

[Marzipan]

A Fanny pack of (I forget they worded it but quality material is the gist) was mentioned I. The RL warrant and it noted he owned one.

Thank you—I totally missed that!

 

[Elley Mae]

Agreeing w/ you Peppery,
A laundry expert would be great.

A veterinary expert too. And a pharmacological one.

What if he didn't go home after murdering the two girls? Instead, what if he had access to his wife's veterinary office? Don't such establishments have large showers? Rooms with floors that slope and which have drains ? He could have washed himself and all his clothing there?

Also, doesn't a vet's office have many surgical implements available: Did RA have access to industrial strength cleaning capabilities, surgery/cutting equipment, etc.?

It always makes me wonder with someone who works in a pharmacy, also, or has a family member who is a Dr./Vet, etc.: What kind of meds can someone obtain? Was RA on some high-grade "speed" or hormone drug that day in 2017 which gave him more strength, energy, or risk-taking aptitude?

So Scary to think about.

I applaud LE on all the work they did on this case. My sense is that...... the trial may have a STAGGERING amount of evidence to show.

MOO.

My go to for removing blood is hydrogen peroxide before laundry.

 

[Elley Mae]

I think its more of a case of the witness thinking back after knowing murders took place thinking to themselves well that car was kinda oddly parked out of the way.

Also hides the license plate. Some states only require back plates.

 

[Marzipan]

We need a laundry expert. How long would blood stay on clothing, like how many washes? Would laundry additives deteriorate DNA? I’m honestly shocked that he kept the jacket. And possibly the jeans. If LE can find the girls DNA on his clothing or car, he is dunzo.

Good idea to have a laundry expert. Some kind of interdisciplinary student at the intersection of home economics and CSI.
You know, a really devious perp could discard the jacket and buy a very close but not exact replacement. Enough to fool his wife he still had it, but sans the bodily fluids/evidence and maybe one detail off from what can be seen on the video.

 

[LeBlack]

If I had tried to kidnap them and I failed? I’d stage it to look like an accident or something other than a murder. How? No idea. Maybe try to make it seem like the kids killed each other somehow? They had a fight and knocked each other out?

The scene didn’t look like a murder had just happened there. So I’m not sure why not or how not if they lost a lot of blood at the scene. But that’s what police have said.

But then police were fast to say they thought foul play too so maybe he didn’t do this?

His car wasn’t far away but no way he’d have got them there without being seen so surely that wasn’t the plan?

MOO
A scenario:
Just one girl was his target.
He quickly killed the other IN the creek (stabbed/slit throat) to send a message to the target to comply (there was not signs of a fight) - basically bloodless scene.
He did what he wanted to his compliant target, strangling her before leaving.
All JMO

 

[LeBlack]

Wow, that gave me serious chills. RA spent a lot of time down the embankment with Abby & Libby.

I wish it had shown when Libby's father showed up and any other people on the trails that interacted with him.

 

[raja]

I still think the girls were close to the creek and covered in mud which is why the blood was not first noticed. If he had mud on him then he would have been in mud. There is no way he would not have left muddy footprints. Jmho

 

[TL4S]

Something that bothers me is what is not in the PCA. They never say that they saw RA's vehicle leave, right (or did I miss it)? They saw it driving west on W 300 N at 1:27pm, but they never say they saw it going back east around 4pm or at all. I wonder what direction he left. It still strikes me that he was driving west past Hoosier Harvestore, since that is more of a rural, back way from his house. Yet muddy and bloody, he didn't go back the same rural, back way? It really makes me curious if he was coming from somewhere else than his house in the afternoon. Or, possibly, if he went somewhere else afterwards. Perhaps this is a factor in LE thinking someone else was involved?

 

[scottr]

https://interactive.wthr.com/pdfs/logan-warrrant.pdf

Submitted sworn and signed by an FBI agent.

That's the one for RL, not the one for RA like I was referring to...

 

[LammyTheRobot]

This is a random picture of a 2016 Black FF kind of parked like witnesses described seeing it at the CPS building.


View attachment 383900

Absolutely nothing like a SMART car IMO. A teenage girl might be more au fair with a trendy newish car like a Smart. It might stand out to her more than a middle aged person

This looks nothing like the tiny little Smart car, which that witness was quite specific about.

 

[CSIDreamer]

That's the one for RL, not the one for RA like I was referring to...

I think the confusion is you replied "no no no there is no public search warrant" to a poster who was speaking about the RL search warrant. Maybe you missed the initials? We've all done it. JMO

 

[LammyTheRobot]

Re-reading this, doesn't it seem like they had more concrete details for a search warrant on RL compared to the details they provided for an ARREST of RA?

Yes! My thoughts exactly. And look how that went.

 

[Gemmie]

I think the confusion is you replied "no no no there is no public search warrant" to a poster who was speaking about the RL search warrant. Maybe you missed the initials? We've all done it. JMO

I could be wrong by my first thought when Lammy said "The RL search warrant mentions guns" and scottr said "No No No, there is no public search warrant. " that scottr thought Lammy meant Real Life and not Ron Logan?

Then of course Lammy posts RL's PCA thinking that's what scottr was asking for.

 

[Derph]

This is great and really lays out all the things we know at this point in regards to witnesses and locations of all the principles so far. 2 things stick out for me:

1. He was alone with the girls for a pretty long time before returning to his car.

2. And this is the most striking, he had a pretty loooong walk back to his car. Taking the road doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me. One would think to keep in cover for as long as possible. Walking on a public road covered in blood and mud for what a mile or more, seems stupid. He had all those woods to use and even he used the trail, he could have ducked into cover if he saw anyone approaching. The sight lines on the path were pretty long giving him plenty of time to hide. He's far more likely to have people see him on the road than the path. This screams that he didn't really have a plan to me. OR
--and this is 100% pure speculation here!! He was expecting someone to pick him up! Where was the gas station that KK was connected to?

 

[CSIDreamer]

I could be wrong by my first thought when Lammy said "The RL search warrant mentions guns" and scottr said "No No No, there is no public search warrant. " that scottr thought Lammy meant Real Life and not Ron Logan?

Then of course Lammy posts RL's PCA thinking that's what scottr was asking for.

We're an awesome bunch! Imperfect but awesome lol.

 

[Boxer]

Just to be clear, since I haven't been following for months. They still haven't released Cause Of Death? The reason I ask is because if they were shot, then ballistics would pretty much seal the deal on RA.

MOO kidnapping is a felony, it ended in death - meaning it becomes felony murder.
Good charge.