Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #158

[Gemmie]

Where was the gas station that KK was connected to?

SBMFF
I believe here:

Marathon Gas · 900 S Washington St, Delphi, IN 46923

âââââ · Gas station

www.google.com

 

[Gemmie]

We're an awesome bunch! Imperfect but awesome lol.

*stands with my fists against my hips, eyes narrowed in @CSIDreamer's direction*

Who you calling imperfect??

 

[LammyTheRobot]

I could be wrong by my first thought when Lammy said "The RL search warrant mentions guns" and scottr said "No No No, there is no public search warrant. " that scottr thought Lammy meant Real Life and not Ron Logan?

Then of course Lammy posts RL's PCA thinking that's what scottr was asking for.

Gosh! It’s an acronym summer salad

Fwiw I was referring to the Logan warrant, which did mention guns. I think a small town like Delphi - you wouldn’t need to be a sleuthed to get wind the police were linking guns to this.

 

[LammyTheRobot]

We're an awesome bunch! Imperfect but awesome lol.

Amen!!

 

[Boxer]

Since when is backing in an odd way to park? I feel like I’m missing something

It is either a habit or the attempt to conceal a plate if plate only back. The parking lot was empty.

 

[Boxer]

Since when is backing in an odd way to park? I feel like I’m missing something

MOO It is either a habit or the attempt to conceal a plate if plate only back. The parking lot was empty.

 

[sleuth_truths]

Ya gotta put your your fingers on a bullet to load it in a magazine.

And the bullet in the chamber is likely the last one you handled, or the second to the last.

That last bullet going in to a magazine, and even the others, are often pushed directly down, and in to position in that magazine, with the thumb.

Assuming that bullet was ejected, unfired, LE may have more than ejector/extractor marks. I wonder if that bullet could have found it's way there in some other fashion

It would be REALLY interesting if somebody else's thumbprint was on that live round they found.

I wonder if RA had range time, either at an actual firing range, or on the rural property of a friend, where a friend may have picked up one of his pre-loaded, cycled, bullets. There's several circumstances where a guy/gal would clear the chamber of a firearm, ejecting a live, unfired, round.

This is an excellent point. You have to push down pretty hard on bullets when loading a magazine -- and thumb prints would definitely be left on them (unless wearing gloves, of course). I hadn't thought about that.

 

[LammyTheRobot]

Just to shake things up:

- Carhartt sold at least two million jackets per year since 1992 (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carhartt);
- Men in the US bought $8bn worth of jeans in 2016 alone (Men's denim market in the United States 2021 | Statista), around 450mn pairs;
- The Sig Sauer P227 is the standard issue sidearm for all Indiana State officers - very close model to the P226 and meaning many people would have had one on them at the crime scene (Sig Sauer P227 Named Duty Weapon for Indiana State Police).

No conclusions drawn, just adding that in.

 

[WildHuncher]

Just to shake things up:

- Carhartt sold at least two million jackets per year since 1992 (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carhartt);
- Men in the US bought $8bn worth of jeans in 2016 alone (Men's denim market in the United States 2021 | Statista), around 450mn pairs;
- The Sig Sauer P227 is the standard issue sidearm for all Indiana State officers - very close model to the P226 and meaning many people would have had one on them at the crime scene (Sig Sauer P227 Named Duty Weapon for Indiana State Police).

No conclusions drawn, just adding that in.

The P227 Indiana bought is in .45 ACP, a very different and much more commonly encountered cartridge from the .40 S&W RA's P226 is chambered for. He'd be in the clear if a cop dropped a .45 cartridge at the CS.

 

[Yvettea]

deleted by me (intended to be private)

 

[sleuth_truths]

I can't get onboard with assumptions that LE has 'botched' the case, etc. Especially considering they have WAY more information and evidence than we do (for example, the bullet revealed in RA's PCA). I don't think it's much of a stretch to believe that the VERY minimum amount of info/evidence was included in the PCA. Just enough to get the judge to approve it. They are, rightfully, keeping as much to the vest as possible (until trial).

...and the Gray Hughes video of the timeline -- wow. Spine-chilling. Our poor, innocent, beautiful girls alone with him for so long.

 

[Quim The Extraordinaire]

Latest episode of the Murder Sheets pod (ep. 150) is reporting that one of the reasons why RA was looked over back in 2017 was:

"We don't have all the answers, but we can provide some information"
"The details we have confirmed sketch out a scenario where it boils down to a clerical error at the hands of a civilian employee of the FBI"
"Basically, it was misfiled"

Murder Sheet

The Murder Sheet is a weekly true crime podcast hosted by journalist Áine Cain and attorney Kevin Greenlee. We take a journalistic approach to covefing true crime. We have broken national news on major cases, like the Delphi murders and the Burger Chef murders. We also cover plenty of other...

art19.com

About the 5 minute mark

edit: link to pod

JMO.

Thank you for posting this, @aseph!

The MS hosts also emphasized that there was no malicious intent involved. It could be as something as infuriatingly simple as a feed jam with a document scanner.

This 100% tracks for me and — though there are lessons to be learned — I’m SO grateful to the investigators who found this missing puzzle piece by going back to basics. IMO, they acted with deliberate speed following the rediscovery of the 2017 RA narrative.

JMO.

 

[Prime8]

I cant image having just murdered 2 girls and not at least trying to lay down to hide yourself covered in blood, Not that it didnt happen ,but if it did maybe it was meant to apear as soming different. I dont know but it is odd, the whole him being everywhere so fast ,lead me to think two men were dressed the same and roaming different parts or at least having me considering different things. Like one of the witnesses might have looked like a witness back then to the bridge man but might be a additional suspect since the officers notes are being reveiwed and other possible evidence they have on the still under investigation suspect. How did they know to search the creek again and is the DNA that link him possiblely from a pet? I dunno but lots of clues inbedded in the LE statement and pressers over the time ,that i am looking at from a different view but I do believe they have the correct person .

The area around the old CPS building would not provide much cover if he tried to hide, it's a very open area.

 

[mom2chloe]

DBM totally messed it up! Sorry!

 

[8th Bob-White]

Does anyone else wonder what story he told his wife? 1) Did he tell her he was there & that he talked to the police, but didn't really have any information about the girls? In other words, boy was he lucky to be safe?!? 2) Did he tell his wife that although he didn't see the girls, he had told the police everything he saw & they asked him not to talk about it? He's a hero for not jeopardizing the investigation? 3) Did he never admit to her that he was there that day? Just puttering around the house?!?

 

[LammyTheRobot]

The P227 Indiana bought is in .45 ACP, a very different and much more commonly encountered cartridge from the .40 S&W RA's P226 is chambered for. He'd be in the clear if a cop dropped a .45 cartridge at the CS.

I know that. You know that. But it puts a little niggle of doubt up there.

 

[Prime8]

The problem is Libby’s sister was invited on the walk but she had to work so said no.

If Libby had secret plans to meet a boy she would not of taken her older sister who no doubt would have been furious and told their parents straight away because of the dangers involved.


This is why I don’t believe there was some ulterior motive that afternoon to go and meet a strange boy. Moo

I think there could also be a scenario where they went to the trails because were hoping to see someone, not necessarily have an arranged meet-up. If they were chatting with a catfisher and that person mentioned they were going to hang out at the bridge with some friends (hoping to lure them there), the girls may have thought it would be fun to go see him. If that were the case, it wouldn't have been a big deal if Kelsi was there.

 

[CSIDreamer]

This is all wondering and speculation. I wonder if they were killed in the creek and dragged to where they were found? That would explain the clothes in the creek and him being a muddy/bloodied mess. JMO

 

[MistyWaters]

I can't get onboard with assumptions that LE has 'botched' the case, etc. Especially considering they have WAY more information and evidence than we do (for example, the bullet revealed in RA's PCA). I don't think it's much of a stretch to believe that the VERY minimum amount of info/evidence was included in the PCA. Just enough to get the judge to approve it. They are, rightfully, keeping as much to the vest as possible (until trial).

...and the Gray Hughes video of the timeline -- wow. Spine-chilling. Our poor, innocent, beautiful girls alone with him for so long.

Good point. It was the prosecutor who wanted it sealed so I agree, it probably contained the very minimum amount of information.

On that topic I was thinking about the redacted version released to the public with missing page 8….looking at it closely I’d say it’s a data reprint of the original version. Aside from not being signed, there’s just white space where the names that were redacted originally appeared, nothing is blacked out. Therefore entire sentences or paragraphs could’ve been deleted and the large gaps removed which would cause an empty page 8. JMO

 

[Prime8]

Since when is backing in an odd way to park? I feel like I’m missing something

What I pictured based on the description is that it was parked so close to the building that it stood out as odd and probably not in a manner that seemed normal.

I went to a trail this year, there wasn't proper parking but there was an area that naturally made a good parking lot where cars easily line up. Then one person came, parked no where near anyone else (even though there was plenty of room) and parked up against a chain that was at the head of the trail. It was bizarre and it stood out to me because it seemed like the most illogical way to park given the options. I don't remember any of the other cars that day but I remember that one being a larger red SUV because it was a silly way to park.