IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #169

[MistyWaters]

or ... was he?

Rozzi's filings yesterday suggest he did agreed to "put something in writing" on the 19th, but that "something" he agreed to put in writing ... was NOT a withdrawal
It was a motion.

moo moo

What motion are you referring to. They were all dated the 25th, were they not?

My point was R admitted the judge forced their withdrawal prior to the hearing on Oct 19th, so a withdrawal letter wouldn’t have made his withdrawal any more official, other than to prove he didn’t follow through. We also know the reason he feels he was “forced” was because the Judge wanted them to appear in open court for what he referred to as “public shaming”.

Therefore it seems to me if we want to blame someone, it’s R and B, not the Judge, who prevented the dismissal from occurring in open court. JMO

 

[zh0r4]

If Rozzi thinks the transcript proves him correct he should appeal this for the record and the judge could face consequences

But he has to accept he is off the case now.

It doesn’t help the defendant for this to go on and he isn’t going to be reinstated unless he makes an emergency appeal. And I can’t see a higher court undoing this, even if Gull acted improperly.

Gull also needs to immediately recuse for the same reasons.

If he doesn’t try to stay on the case, RA won’t get a fair trial at all, which means no real justice to the victims. They might as well just throw him in prison as if he’s already been found guilty….wait.

JMO

EDIT: To include the entire quote of mrjitty

 

[MistyWaters]

I bet those named are not too pleased.

10/27/2023

Order Issued The Court has received requests for media coverage of the October 31, 2023, 9:00 a.m. hearing from the following media outlets: NewsNation, Law and Crime, Court TV, and Channel 13 WTHR. In light of the unauthorized filming and broadcasting of pre-hearing activities in the Courtroom on October 19, 2023, the Court denies these requests in full.

Not sure, you think she is accusing those 3? If so there were no shortage of witnesses to the pretrial hearing activities in the courtroom, whatever they were. But maybe it’s that the 3 named requested cameras on Oct 31st and it just appears the sentences are combined?

 

[MistyWaters]

Defense team chosen in Delphi murders case; judge issues decorum order for next hearing

ALLEN COUNTY, Ind. — Two attorneys have been appointed to defend Richard Allen on two counts of murder in the killings of Abby Williams and Libby German outside of Delphi in 2017. On Friday, the Ca…

fox59.com

Decorum order for Oct. 31​

In addition to identifying Allen’s new counsel and denying camera access for next Tuesday’s hearing, Judge Gull also issued a decorum order for the upcoming proceedings.

Gull said the order, which can be read in full below and includes several guidelines for court attendees, was issued in part due to the “substantial public interest and media attention” that this case has generated.

Some main takeaways from the decorum guidelines include:

• The courthouse will open at 8 a.m.
• All members of the public, including media, will be subject to metal detectors
• Cell phones are permitted but must be turned off and unused
• No one will be permitted to stand in the courtroom

 

[FrostedGlass]

Not sure, you think she is accusing those 3? If so there were no shortage of witnesses to the pretrial hearing activities in the courtroom, whatever they were. But maybe it’s that the 3 named requested cameras on Oct 31st and it just appears the sentences are combined?

Those 4 were probably filming Rozzi taking wife and mother out of the court room and whatever else before JG came out. She's letting others in.

 

[twall]

Scremin I always read as Screamin! He defends some of Allen County's finest. (sarcasm) Here is his latest case-found guilty today.

Verdict: Man found guilty in casino-linked homicide that claimed life of popular local barber

**WARNING: This story contains graphic content not suitable for all readers.** FORT WAYNE, Ind. (WANE) —Friday, a 30-year-old local man accused of ambushing another man for some kind of never…

www.wane.com

 

[FrostedGlass]

I thought I was having a Groundhog Day episode for a minute; still after that transcript.

10/27/2023	Motion to Reconsider Motion to Reconsider Filed By: Allen, Richard M. File Stamp: 10/27/2023
10/27/2023	Praecipe for Transcript Filed Praecipe Filed By: Allen, Richard M. File Stamp: 10/27/2023

 

[FrostedGlass]

I wonder what the ethics are in regard to RA's x-D cooperating with his new team. IIRC, JG said they would cooperate with the new team in the transition, turning over the files, but did not have to share their investigative work with them.

Could Rozzi make a deal to share if the new team agreed to help get some of the motions he wanted put into record?

 

[Emma Peel]

Hmm, anyone want to take a guess what this was about?

Defense team chosen in Delphi murders case; judge issues decorum order for next hearing

ALLEN COUNTY, Ind. — Two attorneys have been appointed to defend Richard Allen on two counts of murder in the killings of Abby Williams and Libby German outside of Delphi in 2017. On Friday, the Ca…

fox59.com

“…..While Gull has still not made a decision on all future court proceedings, the court on Friday did deny all requests from media to film at the next scheduled hearing on Oct. 31. This, the court said, was due to “unauthorized filming and broadcasting of pre-hearing activities” last week….”

it's about control.

also, wrt cameras, I noticed caught the down time pre-gavel when hearing was late and Gull wasn't in the room; on different clips I did see Rizzo escorting RA's family (wife/mom) out/in/out of the courtroom; and the camera caught some of LE on the bench.

So the cameras ran pre-hearing; I feel like that was NOT what was agreed to; and it's her Court, her rules - so good for her to clarify. I do hope she will soften on cameras for future procedings.

 

[Emma Peel]

What motion are you referring to. They were all dated the 25th, were they not?

My point was R admitted the judge forced their withdrawal prior to the hearing on Oct 19th, so a withdrawal letter wouldn’t have made his withdrawal any more official, other than to prove he didn’t follow through. We also know the reason he feels he was “forced” was because the Judge wanted them to appear in open court for what he referred to as “public shaming”.

Therefore it seems to me if we want to blame someone, it’s R and B, not the Judge, who prevented the dismissal from occurring in open court. JMO

This is just
he said; she said.
again.
A game I'm not gonna play.
But I do recommend these two get a room. Perhaps an Appellate Courtroom will do.

 

[zh0r4]

I wonder what the ethics are in regard to RA's x-D cooperating with his new team. IIRC, JG said they would cooperate with the new team in the transition, turning over the files, but did not have to share their investigative work with them.

Could Rozzi make a deal to share if the new team agreed to help get some of the motions he wanted put into record?

According to the article below, Lebrato was suspended from his job last year and part of his reinstatement agreement is that he “refrain from any retaliation” for the suspension.

This likely means that if Lebrato questions the evidence or proceedings, it will be labeled “retaliatory”. I assume most of the issues brought forward in Rozzi’s (and/or Baldwin’s) motions would then be seen as retaliatory and dismissed immediately if Lebrato tried bringing them up? JMO.

The reason for his suspension is listed as unknown in the article.

Defense team chosen in Delphi murders case; judge issues decorum order for next hearing

ALLEN COUNTY, Ind. — Two attorneys have been appointed to defend Richard Allen on two counts of murder in the killings of Abby Williams and Libby German outside of Delphi in 2017. On Friday, the Ca…

fox59.com

 

[abams]

Some judges can't recuse themselves fast enough, others can't be pried off their bench with a crowbar. I'd be surprised if JG went easily.

As a side note, I see RA's new atty (now I'm always gonna want to type screamin) just began a new murder case in Allen Sup 5. He has his work cut out for him. I hope the other atty can step up.

Surely he can't be expected to handle two murder trials at the same time?

 

[MistyWaters]

I thought I was having a Groundhog Day episode for a minute; still after that transcript.

10/27/2023	Motion to Reconsider Motion to Reconsider Filed By: Allen, Richard M. File Stamp: 10/27/2023
10/27/2023	Praecipe for Transcript Filed Praecipe Filed By: Allen, Richard M. File Stamp: 10/27/2023

The two new attorneys are posted on mycase and unless they already regret agreeing to participate in this mess, I doubt they filed the Motion to Reconsider. But why would R still have access I wonder. I notice his earlier motions have not yet been removed despite the judge ordering they be stricken from the record so the simplest explanation is the mycase data person has some catching up to do.

R already filed a motion for a praecipe transcript on the 26th, no need to file it twice. IIRC there’s a time factor involved as it requires a court reporter to type out a transcript from a recorded source.

JMO

 

[abams]

This is just
he said; she said.
again.
A game I'm not gonna play.
But I do recommend these two get a room. Perhaps an Appellate Courtroom will do.

I mean there was a very easy way to avoid this, and it was through holding an actual hearing in open court--not one with a predetermined outcome, either.

 

[O.Incandenza]

The two new attorneys are posted on mycase and unless they already regret agreeing to participate in this mess, I doubt they filed the Motion to Reconsider. But why would R still have access I wonder. I notice his earlier motions have not yet been removed despite the judge ordering they be stricken from the record so the simplest explanation is the mycase data person has some catching up to do.

R already filed a motion for a praecipe transcript on the 26th, no need to file it twice. IIRC there’s a time factor involved as it requires a court reporter to type out a transcript from a recorded source.

JMO

They're RA's attorneys now. If he wants to keep his old attorneys and instructs the new ones to file a motion to reconsider, then they would need to do that. However, I doubt they've had enough time to consult with him and draft a motion.

 

[MistyWaters]

According to the article below, Lebrato was suspended from his job last year and part of his reinstatement agreement is that he “refrain from any retaliation” for the suspension.

This likely means that if Lebrato questions the evidence or proceedings, it will be labeled “retaliatory”. I assume most of the issues brought forward in Rozzi’s (and/or Baldwin’s) motions would then be seen as retaliatory and dismissed immediately if Lebrato tried bringing them up? JMO.

The reason for his suspension is listed as unknown in the article.

Defense team chosen in Delphi murders case; judge issues decorum order for next hearing

ALLEN COUNTY, Ind. — Two attorneys have been appointed to defend Richard Allen on two counts of murder in the killings of Abby Williams and Libby German outside of Delphi in 2017. On Friday, the Ca…

fox59.com

Nope, this has no bearing on Lebrato defending RA whatever. <modsnip:>

You left off the rest of the sentence which reads - “he refrain from any retaliation against any public defender or staff member who participated in our investigation,” . (ie investigation which led to his suspension)

Allen County’s chief public defender reinstated after weeks long suspension

Lebrato has been the chief public defender since January, 2020.

www.wane.com

 

[MistyWaters]

They're RA's attorneys now. If he wants to keep his old attorneys and instructs the new ones to file a motion to reconsider, then they would need to do that. However, I doubt they've had enough time to consult with him and draft a motion.

I doubt they would agree to do that. RA can’t keep his old attorneys even if he wanted to.

 

[Emma Peel]

I thought I was having a Groundhog Day episode for a minute; still after that transcript.

10/27/2023	Motion to Reconsider Motion to Reconsider Filed By: Allen, Richard M. File Stamp: 10/27/2023
10/27/2023	Praecipe for Transcript Filed Praecipe Filed By: Allen, Richard M. File Stamp: 10/27/2023

I have no idea.

Could speculate that it's RA asking his new D attorneys to petition on his behalf for the return of his old D attorney(s)?

Maybe that would be too weird. Nevemind.

 

[FrostedGlass]

The two new attorneys are posted on mycase and unless they already regret agreeing to participate in this mess, I doubt they filed the Motion to Reconsider. But why would R still have access I wonder. I notice his earlier motions have not yet been removed despite the judge ordering they be stricken from the record so the simplest explanation is the mycase data person has some catching up to do.

R already filed a motion for a praecipe transcript on the 26th, no need to file it twice. IIRC there’s a time factor involved as it requires a court reporter to type out a transcript from a recorded source.

JMO

They are listed officially now. Also, she now has 2 entries about RA's xD; here's the first one, then the second which has 2 dates

10/27/2023

Order Issued Court notes filings by former Attorney Rozzi on October 25, 2023, and takes no action. Attorney Rozzi withdrew from this matter on October 19, 2023, and is no longer counsel of record. These filings, therefore, are ordered stricken from the record. Clerk of the Court ordered to remove the pleadings from the electronic case file and the Chronological Case Summary as being filed in error. Noticed: McLeland, Nicholas Charles Noticed: Allen, Richard M. Order Signed: 10/27/2023

10/27/2023

Order Issued Court notes filings by former Attorney Rozzi on October 25 and 26, 2023, and takes no action. Attorney Rozzi withdrew from this matter on October 19, 2023, and is no longer counsel of record. These filings, therefore, are ordered stricken from the record. Clerk of the Court ordered to remove the pleadings from the electronic case file and the Chronological Case Summary as being filed in error. Judicial Officer: Gull, Frances -SJ Noticed: McLeland, Nicholas Charles Noticed: Allen, Richard M. Order Signed: 10/27/2023

Rozzi's 2 latest motions appear after the above entry.

Parties to the Case​

Hide all party details

	Defendant	Allen, Richard M.
	Attorney Robert Cliff Scremin #3109902, Lead, Court Appointed Attorney address 116 E Berry ST STE 1200 Fort Wayne, IN 46802 Attorney phone 260-494-0606(W) Attorney William Santino Lebrato #2170702, Court Appointed Attorney address 116 E Berry ST STE 500 Fort Wayne, IN 46802

 

[Emma Peel]

The two new attorneys are posted on mycase and unless they already regret agreeing to participate in this mess, I doubt they filed the Motion to Reconsider. But why would R still have access I wonder. I notice his earlier motions have not yet been removed despite the judge ordering they be stricken from the record so the simplest explanation is the mycase data person has some catching up to do.

R already filed a motion for a praecipe transcript on the 26th, no need to file it twice. IIRC there’s a time factor involved as it requires a court reporter to type out a transcript from a recorded source.

JMO

Hennessey filed an appearance; wondering if he's still on the docket?

(Upthread someone posted a quote from him ... where he said he was going to file yet another motion today.)

moo