Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #112

[ScumbagTrav]

Im drawing a blank...

Do we know if Libby's phone was recovered? And if so, where?

Or do we just know video was recovered from her phone?

 

[Spartygirl]

Im drawing a blank...

Do we know if Libby's phone was recovered? And if so, where?

Or do we just know video was recovered from her phone?

According to LE, her phone was recovered

 

[Falcon500]

Do I understand you correctly in that you do not think the guy in the video is the killer? Fascinating.

I’ve said it before.

 

[ScumbagTrav]

According to LE, her phone was recovered

Thanks!!

I wish the reporter would have included the quote of Sgt Holeman actually saying that, instead of the reporter stating he said that....if that makes sense?

 

[Imvp2]

Yes, but what if the photo was made before? On another day? Is it possible? I have tons of photos I can put on my FB today.

The girls were presumably dressed in the clothes Libby 's sister dropped them off in.

 

[Steph8angels]

Do I understand you correctly in that you do not think the guy in the video is the killer? Fascinating.

I’ve said it before.

A twist perhaps?
MOO

 

[moonlessnight]

KG stated that Cody took her past the bridge and onto the roads on the same side of the creek, but directly across the creek from the bodies around 5pm on 2/13. they didn't see the girls that day.

I cant directly answer your question.
but from what I can tell, as the crow flies the girls where very very close to the end of the bridge straight across the river however as you would walk/track it actually wouldn't be obvious or direct because being winter nobody would have assumed they would have waded through that icy water at any crossing point.


moo

 

[moonlessnight]

yes, and they used to wait 24-48 hours on missing children, which they have learned is not best practice anymore.

I hear you. Thanks for the inside view of things. But let me ask you this. Isn’t it old school for LE to say let’s wait for so and so hours?

For example it used to be when there was a mass shooting LE would wait before entering a building, rather hoping that they can negotiate with the shooter. Now the protocol is to enter the building immediately to eliminate the shooter and save as many life’s as possible.

What I’m saying is that that night the girls went missing they should at a minimum had search dogs out there. I think the cost for a search dog would be easy to reconcile and provide the best results.

Truly asking your expert opinion on this. TIA

 

[moonlessnight]

yes - there was a movement to save the bridge and to get grants to pay for it. I wondered if someone didn't want money going to the bridge bc they wanted it for something else and tried to ruin the bridge's reputation to destroy interest in saving it.

Sponsor, donors sought to turn trestle into trail crossing

“Delphi historic trail”, hiking area, a FB “help save Monon high bridge”.

 

[steeltowngirl]

Do I understand you correctly in that you do not think the guy in the video is the killer? Fascinating.

I’ve said it before.

How does LE know that the guy in the video killed them? He could have led them to the killer. Been an accessory.

I just do not get how they are so sure? Unless the murder was on tape, how could they really know??

 

[Boxer]

The case didn’t come close to meeting the criteria for an Amber Alert.

True, but they tried. Meaning they had cause for an alert just no vehicle description.

 

[ScumbagTrav]

How does LE know that the guy in the video killed them? He could have led them to the killer. Been an accessory.

I just do not get how they are so sure? Unless the murder was on tape, how could they really know??

There was obviously something on that recording that removed any doubt in the minds of LE that BG is their killer. Like you said, the murder could have been captured. Or the beginning of an attack...or other evidence/details that only LE knows. I have a feeling that what happened to those poor girls is more horrific than we already imagine.

 

[Boxer]

We don't know that though because no one was monitoring it at all. So someone asked at 6.30 p.m. to search RL's land and didn't bother till midday the next day? That's crazy IMO.

They know the fellow that asked, I think it was neighbor MS. At about dark. Are you thinking a searcher accidentally disturbed evidence?

They know the time of death and whether bodies were moved.

 

[Charlot123]

yes - there was a movement to save the bridge and to get grants to pay for it. I wondered if someone didn't want money going to the bridge bc they wanted it for something else and tried to ruin the bridge's reputation to destroy interest in saving it.

Sponsor, donors sought to turn trestle into trail crossing

Interestingly, today, when I saw Go Fund Me on that FB, i, too, felt it was about the money. But human psychology is predictable, it will turn into a touristy place instead.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

How does LE know that the guy in the video killed them? He could have led them to the killer. Been an accessory.

I just do not get how they are so sure? Unless the murder was on tape, how could they really know??

My guess is there is something on Libby’s cellphone recording that confirms it for LE.
Also, initially, when LE first released the picture of the BG, they said only that they wanted to talk with him. He was considered a possible witness. He never came forward to talk with police, and a few days later he was named a suspect. In my view, if he was innocent, he would have shown up to explain things and to try and help the police find the killer. That and the cellphone info I think is why he is the suspect. Just my opinion.

 

[Charlot123]

My guess is there is something on Libby’s cellphone recording that confirms it for LE.
Also, initially, when LE first released the picture of the BG, they said only that they wanted to talk with him. He was considered a possible witness. He never came forward to talk with police, and a few days later he was named a suspect. In my view, if he was innocent, he would have shown up to explain things and to try and help the police find the killer. That and the cellphone info I think is why he is the suspect. Just my opinion.

OK, LE said he was the suspect, but was he the only suspect? Who said he was acting alone?

I wonder. The girls were good and smart, A students, but the area is not so great. Could it be so that, indeed, the murder was the revenge to one of the girls because she refused the advances of some local mafia-type meth peddler? Who knows what these guys might do? The fact that the DNA is not in CODIS speaks against it, but the whole issue of DNA is so unclear in this case.

ETA: DC said that the witnesses were afraid of coming forward.

Who would they be afraid of? Some local Godfather. It is possible. The girls were probably coquettish like most budding teenagers are, but they both understood that their future lied outside of Delphi. They would not get hooked with the same old, druggies and more druggies. And what do we know about anger of local macho criminals, alpha-males who hate being rejected?

MOO x 3

 

[gregjrichards]

yes - there was a movement to save the bridge and to get grants to pay for it. I wondered if someone didn't want money going to the bridge bc they wanted it for something else and tried to ruin the bridge's reputation to destroy interest in saving it.

Sponsor, donors sought to turn trestle into trail crossing

The bridge should be demolished it is in a shocking state of disrepair.

 

[Charlot123]

I wonder if there is something on Libby’s cell, threats from that guy, or something else. But no one can arrest him because he used a hired hand to kill the girls.

That could explain why there was no warning about the danger. The person is very dangerous, but not a serial killer. He is merely dangerous to young women bold enough to reject his love.

 

[ScumbagTrav]

OK, LE said he was the suspect, but was he the only suspect? Who said he was acting alone?

I wonder. The girls were good and smart, A students, but the area is not so great. Could it be so that, indeed, the murder was the revenge to one of the girls because she refused the advances of some local mafia-type meth peddler? Who knows what these guys might do? The fact that the DNA is not in CODIS speaks against it, but the whole issue of DNA is so unclear in this case.

ETA: DC said that the witnesses were afraid of coming forward.

Who would they be afraid of? Some local Godfather. It is possible. The girls were probably coquettish like most budding teenagers are, but they both understood that their future lied outside of Delphi. They would not get hooked with the same old, druggies and more druggies. And what do we know about anger of local macho criminals, alpha-males who hate being rejected?

MOO x 3

Going to add some specifics in hopes it may answer some of those questions...

- Feb 15, 2017 LE released the image of who is now known as BG. Police do not call the man in the photo a suspect but say they would like to talk with him.

"Investigators want to talk with him about what he may have seen. They would also like to speak with anyone who was parked at High Bridge Trail Head on Feb. 13, between 1 p.m. and 5 p.m."

Police ask for assistance in identifying man seen walking on trail where Delphi teens went missing

- Feb 19, 2017 LE announce that the man in the photo released on February 15 was now a suspect.

"During the course of the investigation, preliminary evidence has led investigators to believe the person, in the distributed photo, is suspected of having participated in the murders of Abigail Williams and Liberty German," said state police in a press release."

Also

"Sgt. Tony Slocum said the person pictured is “our suspect we are considering at this time" and police would like to arrest him."

ISP: Man in photo considered Delphi suspect

- Feb 22, 2017 LE release audio that was captured on Libby's phone. LE leave open possibility of other suspects and indicate uncertainty over whether or not the voice on the audio belongs to the man in the bridge photo.

"During the news conference. Sgt. Tony Slocum said the search continued for a man seen in a photo. Investigators revealed that the photo also came from Liberty German's phone. They said it's possible the voice in the recording is that of the man in the photo. They also acknowledged that it's possible more than one person may be involved."

Slain Delphi teen recorded audio, video of man wanted in homicide investigation, police say

- April 22, 2019 LE releases new sketch and says voice on audio is that of man in the photo.

"Please keep in mind that the person talking is one person and is the person on the bridge with the girls" Carter said. "This is not two people speaking. Please listen to it very, very carefully."

ISP says new audio, video and sketch shows Delphi killer


I have seen no public explanation as to why the change in certainty/confidence that it is all the same individual.

 

[tresir2012]

They know the fellow that asked, I think it was neighbor MS. At about dark. Are you thinking a searcher accidentally disturbed evidence?

They know the time of death and whether bodies were moved.

Well that is what isn't known isn't it? Only the killer knows that.