Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #121

[BradB]

I love the optimism but I believe this case needs a lucky break.

 

[Marzipan]

My speculation on the 1st sketch released (older looking BG) was that BG or someone covering for him was privy to the initial sketch (which is the current sketch released in April, but drawn shortly after murders) and was able to have some influence on which one to use.
And at 4/19 presser
"You didn't think we would change strategies, but we have"!!!

If BG or someone covering for him has the kind of influence to help LE decide which sketch to show the public for the first two years, that certainly makes things...I’m not even sure what word to use here!

Not sure I think that’s true, but it’s an interesting thought for sure.

 

[Marzipan]

duplicate

 

[Ozoner]

If BG or someone covering for him has the kind of influence to help LE decide which sketch to show the public for the first two years, that certainly makes things...I’m not even sure what word to use here!

Not sure I think that’s true, but it’s an interesting thought for sure.

Here's a quote from Shakespeare's Richard III, one of the best know psychopaths in dramatic literature:
"And this word 'love,' which graybeards call divine,
Be resident in men like one another
And not in me: I am myself alone."
I doubt that anyone is covering for BG; he doesn't have a confidante. Like all psychopaths, he trusts no one; he is himself alone.

 

[somequestions]

The sketch thing is one of those things made worse by LE’s silence about the case. First they release the 1st sketch made from talking with people who saw BG walking around the trails that day. OK. Then they say, forget that sketch. Not the guy. We’re looking for New Sketch guy. Huh? Well, then who did all those people that helped with the first sketch actually see that day? There were two guys walking around the trails that day dressed exactly alike? One happened to be a crazy killer? So whose the other guy whose dressed like that? Has he come forward? This is a big problem I think and since LE releases nothing they can only try to fix it by saying goofy things like he’s between the sketches etc. Hard to think either sketch will lead to an arrest.

I have always thought both sketches were put out there by LE based on a witness statement of a person they could not identify out on the trail that day. So they put out the first one for almost 2 years. This is the first sketch. It does not lead to the bridge guy. So they go back to the beginning of the case and choose another viable person they have not been able to identify from a witness statement. This is the second sketch. And almost a year later it still has not lead to the bridge guy. I think because of the sheer number of tips this case has received and the way so many people want to do side-by-side comparisons that LE thought someone somewhere would eventually submit the tip they need if the killer indeed came from the small town area in or around Delphi, Indiana.

There has been numerous amounts of research that show people are not as observant as they think they are. The person responsible may not look like either sketch and may have walked out of the area without being seen by anyone who can remember him.

A sketch is not a photograph, but putting a sketch next to a video photograph of the bridge guy on the same poster is going to be confusing.

I do not think LE has any idea about who killed Abigail Williams and Liberty German. I think they thought this would be an easy case to solve once they found the man on the bridge. And it did not turn out that way. The one glimmer of hope in this case is the video Liberty German captured on her phone. In my opinion, her video is the truest description of the man on the bridge.

 

[cujenn81]

my thoughts —

BG is a white male between 25-35 years old

BG has likely killed before (probably more than once) and his favorite hunting grounds are wooded parks and/or trails that are frequently visited by locals but are not touristy or very busy

BG lives within 250 miles but not in Delphi

AW & LG were not targeted but were victims of opportunity

BG controlled the girls with a gun but did not kill them with one (cause of death was likely strangulation or blunt force trauma)

This was a thrill killing and somewhat unorganized in nature

However, it was not an impulsive one; he planned to kill that day but didn’t have a specific victim in mind

I believe anyone who has a close relationship with BG would recognize him immediately (from the video clip, at least) due to the mannerisms, clothing, posture, gait, etc.

I believe he‘s an extremely private person/recluse who doesn’t have many close relationships (if any) and that’s why no one has come forward

LE has no clue who BG might be — and I say that because of something said on the last episode of the Down the Hill podcast

LE was asked to clarify why a second sketch that looked nothing like the first was released and the response was something like... (I’m paraphrasing here) “This is Plan B. We tried Plan A and that didn’t work. Now we‘re going to try Plan B.”

IMO and all that... as always.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

my thoughts —

BG is a white male between 25-35 years old

BG has likely killed before (probably more than once) and his favorite hunting grounds are wooded parks and/or trails that are frequently visited by locals but are not touristy or very busy

BG lives within 250 miles but not in Delphi

AW & LG were not targeted but were victims of opportunity

BG controlled the girls with a gun but did not kill them with one (cause of death was likely strangulation or blunt force trauma)

This was a thrill killing and somewhat unorganized in nature

However, it was not an impulsive one; he planned to kill that day but didn’t have a specific victim in mind

I believe anyone who has a close relationship with BG would recognize him immediately (from the video clip, at least) due to the mannerisms, clothing, posture, gait, etc.

I believe he‘s an extremely private person/recluse who doesn’t have many close relationships (if any) and that’s why no one has come forward

LE has no clue who BG might be — and I say that because of something said on the last episode of the Down the Hill podcast

LE was asked to clarify why a second sketch that looked nothing like the first was released and the response was something like... (I’m paraphrasing here) “This is Plan B. We tried Plan A and that didn’t work. Now we‘re going to try Plan B.”

IMO and all that... as always.

I pretty much agree with all of this.
I wonder how long it will be before they go to Plan C?

 

[cujenn81]

I'm thinking about cyclical behavior this morning.
To the best of knowledge, we haven't seen another attack that seems closely similar since the children were murdered in 2017.

For those of you who have studied SK's, have the experts observed particular patterns of behavior as far as frequency, timing, triggers, geographic patterns, etc.? Are these Perp's random killing machines, or have we learned anything about predictive modeling/triggers?

I'm wondering what the Perp has been doing since 2017. Has he continued to offend at some level such as assaults, or other criminal behaviors? Is he traveling around assaulting, or staying in a particular region?

If any of you have studied this, please chime in. I'll see if I can find anything about predictive modeling of SK's. I'm interested in this for another case I am following as well, where the POI is known, but seems to be acting like a choir boy.

Amateur opinion and speculation

I haven’t studied SKs, per se, but I’ve read a lot of books about them. I‘ve also read the autobiography of Pee Wee Gaskins—Final Truth. If you can find a copy and can tolerate reading highly graphic descriptions of sexual violence, I highly recommend it. It’s equally as fascinating as it is horrifying to get a glimpse of a mind that evil.

Gaskins was a rather unique serial killer—his crimes were a mix of thrill killings (that he referred to as “weekend recreation“), the murders of people he knew personally (or those he referred to as “serious killings”), and victims that he was hired to kill. He killed strangers (both men and women), a 15-year-old niece and her best friend, a pregnant woman who considered Gaskins to be a friend and her two year old daughter, and people he felt had slighted him in some way.

While I believe murders committed by serial killers usually follow a specific pattern, I also think the methods can vary widely and often evolve over time.

 

[distracted]

I haven’t studied SKs, per se, but I’ve read a lot of books about them. I‘ve also read the autobiography of Pee Wee Gaskins—Final Truth. If you can find a copy and can tolerate reading highly graphic descriptions of sexual violence, I highly recommend it. It’s equally as fascinating as it is horrifying to get a glimpse of a mind that evil.

Gaskins was a rather unique serial killer—his crimes were a mix of thrill killings (that he referred to as “weekend recreation“), the murders of people he knew personally (or those he referred to as “serious killings”), and victims that he was hired to kill. He killed strangers (both men and women), a 15-year-old niece and her best friend, a pregnant woman who considered Gaskins to be a friend and her two year old daughter, and people he felt had slighted him in some way.

While I believe murders committed by serial killers usually follow a specific pattern, I also think the methods can vary widely and often evolve over time.

GSK didn't follow much of a pattern either. He killed both men and women of various ages, committed rape, vandalism, burglary and more during the decades he walked free.

If there's any pattern, it would be a pattern of inflicting terror. If not for DNA testing, I believe he would have continued to terrorize. As a cop, however, he knew he risked capture if he continued.

If BG's intent was to inflict terror, he was successful, at least for a time. I often wonder if BG had been in law enforcement at some point in his life as well.

 

[Ozoner]

GSK didn't follow much of a pattern either. He killed both men and women of various ages, committed rape, vandalism, burglary and more during the decades he walked free.

If there's any pattern, it would be a pattern of inflicting terror. If not for DNA testing, I believe he would have continued to terrorize. As a cop, however, he knew he risked capture if he continued.

If BG's intent was to inflict terror, he was successful, at least for a time. I often wonder if BG had been in law enforcement at some point in his life as well.

BBM
He could've been.
Do you think he'd have had complaints against him for being too aggressive? Would he have gotten kicked off the force?

 

[Cryptic]

Definitely hill. I think most people I know would do the same.

I agree, the use of the term 'hill' is in the majority with only two people reporting knowledge / usage of either the formal word or specialized slang terms.

Just out of curiosity, I am presuming that your are female, but what is your socio economic background? Also, have you ever heard friends and family members using the formal word or specialized slang?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Gaskins was a rather unique serial killer—his crimes were a mix of thrill killings (that he referred to as “weekend recreation“), the murders of people he knew personally (or those he referred to as “serious killings”), and victims that he was hired to kill. He killed strangers (both men and women), a 15-year-old niece and her best friend, a pregnant woman who considered Gaskins to be a friend and her two year old daughter, and people he felt had slighted him in some way.

bbm
I've thought of that also in case Abby/Libby or in cases, we don't know of, but were BG killed before. A reason, to think of a hired murderer, doesn't have to do with these girls, but only with the person, BG might be and with the well organized escape after the double murder.

Btw: Profession, the killer might have (have had in the past or would have liked to have): Air marshal. Of course, he wouldn't have said "guys" to whomever. (Our hanger was the term "guys".) Perhaps he was/is/would be able to run a job like that?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I believe he‘s an extremely private person/recluse who doesn’t have many close relationships (if any) and that’s why no one has come forward

I would word like that: an extremely private person in private life, but with very close friends; seemingly outgoing as required in business life. Something like that, IMO, MOO.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Welcome to WS and to this thread.

Glad to hear that the town folks are as confused about the new sketch as we are. Sometimes I wish LE had never introduced either sketch and had just kept pushing the still shot from the video and the audio clip out into the public eye.

I believe, the sketches helped in some way, even if they aren't from the same person. They are very similar to one another, but not the same. One day in the future it's going to be worth it, MOO.
I don't think of twins, but very similar blood relatives. One the killer, one the accomplice. Or both the killers, might be. MOO

 

[Cryptic]

Do you think he'd have had complaints against him for being too aggressive? Would he have gotten kicked off the force?

Either that, or such an individual might become a "tramp cop".

"Tramp cops" have a trail of discipline actions brought on by poor performance, including un needed aggression. This leads to resignations ahead of terminations. As their offenses are not severe, they are eligible for re-hire in a different department.

Usually, the rehiring involves a department of less prestige and less salary than their previous one. Since small town departments often lack resources for truly comprehensive background checks, they can attract 'tramps' who have a pattern of resignations and relocations.

As a side note, Texas will revoke the license of any law enforcement officer terminated on three occasions (including resignations in lieu of termination) for cause. The law is based on a rouge 'tramp cop' who befriended, dated, then stalked and eventually murdered a woman that he was supposed to protect.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

LIBERTY GERMAN — FBI

The FBI poster says a hoodie.

He has a hoodie, but laying on his coach jacket around his neck. It doesn't mean, the hoodie is on his head.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

A hoodie makes sense as it provides additional pockets for murder equipment.

it looks like it has a lot of white string in the hood unlike like most that have color matching strings. I have seen this before on American Apparel Hoodies, ( they went out of biz). but maybe other brands also have this white cord inside the hood.

other wise it's rope or it is holding something he is wearing around his neck.

some have seen a go pro camera in the image ( if not allowed I apologize).

some see a shot gun in his pant leg.

he's like a photographic Rorschach test. is it a hat? is it a wig? does he have a puppy in his jacket?


it's almost like he was moving in a bubble that concealed him, like all of evil just conspired to help him out .

He is a ghoul and a loser. mOO

Ghoul means "an undead monster" (I googled it ) - yes, might be applicable.

 

[cujenn81]

If BG's intent was to inflict terror, he was successful, at least for a time. I often wonder if BG had been in law enforcement at some point in his life as well.

I wouldn’t be surprised to learn that BG is some form of LE either. He’s probably not an investigator or highway patrolman... but maybe a game warden or something similar.

 

[JnRyan]

my thoughts —

BG is a white male between 25-35 years old

BG has likely killed before (probably more than once) and his favorite hunting grounds are wooded parks and/or trails that are frequently visited by locals but are not touristy or very busy

BG lives within 250 miles but not in Delphi

AW & LG were not targeted but were victims of opportunity

BG controlled the girls with a gun but did not kill them with one (cause of death was likely strangulation or blunt force trauma)

This was a thrill killing and somewhat unorganized in nature

However, it was not an impulsive one; he planned to kill that day but didn’t have a specific victim in mind

I believe anyone who has a close relationship with BG would recognize him immediately (from the video clip, at least) due to the mannerisms, clothing, posture, gait, etc.

I believe he‘s an extremely private person/recluse who doesn’t have many close relationships (if any) and that’s why no one has come forward

LE has no clue who BG might be — and I say that because of something said on the last episode of the Down the Hill podcast

LE was asked to clarify why a second sketch that looked nothing like the first was released and the response was something like... (I’m paraphrasing here) “This is Plan B. We tried Plan A and that didn’t work. Now we‘re going to try Plan B.”

IMO and all that... as always.

I believe all are VERY likely.

 

[watcher9]

The sketch thing is one of those things made worse by LE’s silence about the case. First they release the 1st sketch made from talking with people who saw BG walking around the trails that day. OK. Then they say, forget that sketch. Not the guy. We’re looking for New Sketch guy. Huh? Well, then who did all those people that helped with the first sketch actually see that day? There were two guys walking around the trails that day dressed exactly alike? One happened to be a crazy killer? So whose the other guy whose dressed like that? Has he come forward? This is a big problem I think and since LE releases nothing they can only try to fix it by saying goofy things like he’s between the sketches etc. Hard to think either sketch will lead to an arrest.

You brought up something that startled me.

What if both of the sketches were drawn before the video clip shot was released and none of the witnesses had seen their guy in the BG clothes.

Maybe each sketch was drawn of just someone they remembered but had never been seen before on the trail. I wonder how the first sketch was compiled with several witnesses. Did each one have a separate sketch drawn and LE compiled them together into a single sketch or did they show the first one's sketch to other people who added their own opinion to alter the original sketch?

On TV I saw a new facial recognition program that is out now. I wonder if LE has ever tried to utilize it with the video clip shot?