Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #123

[rosesfromangels]

This topic of MO vs Signature is a very interesting one, and all of you have made intriguing points to ponder deeply.

How the children were left will speak loudly. Were they “on display” in some gruesome manner as a warning or payback? Were there any indication of remorse at the crime scene?

How these girls were left has likely informed LE’s profile a lot.

amateur opinion and speculation

 

[Charlot123]

Charlot, (I can't reply atm)
I think, he is collecting victims and he is interested to follow the LE/FBI and media and social media at least, day and night, when travelling, when he can't sleep, all.the.time. He is certainly euphoric, when reading all the thousands of statements and opinions and speculations (!!!) about a mystery killer, who escaped unseen like a ghost.
I think, he doesn't think of himself as a loser, but of someone, who always got too little respect from others. As a killer he has everything under control and as a "loser" in people's eyes, who murdered, he afterwards gets the (ridiculous) "RESPECT" because of his ability to escape. Nobody knows his face (he thinks), his stature (he thinks), his voice (he thinks), the respective vehicle (he thinks). One day he has to wake up. Soon, I hope.

To compare him to a collector of pearls: Victims of a young age maybe his Tahitian pearls, victims of another age, beyond teens are maybe his Japanese pearls. Then there are the South Sea pearls, which are the pairs of females.* - Of course Idk, if there are males also in the collection. IMO MOO

*I'm too lazy to look for the value of pearls (re the order).

South Seas are pretty expensive, but it all depends on individual pearls. But see, you, too, are speaking about sets.

What about an online club? Imagine several guys playing, and they need to collect that many different victims. Including a pair. Then, the Evansdale pair might belong to another killer, but from the same club. Don’t you think they may exist? Dark Web, who knows?

This is where one needs to write a certain program for a victims’ (including disappeared ones) database and see if some “trophy hunting” patterns pop out.

P.S. in a very complicated case, animals might also be included. (These abducted mutilated cats in Olympia, for example, and someone else kills a deer in Indiana, and then they both proceed to the next trophy).

As to the Delphi killer, he might feel not so much a loser (he is not) but feel that he is too nice to people and they take him for a pushover and use him. MOO.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Refreshing:
Police release all-new sketch, video and audio of Delphi double murder suspect

The last paragraph I don't remember to have known.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

What about an online club? Imagine several guys playing, and they need to collect that many different victims. Including a pair. Then, the Evansdale pair might belong to another killer, but from the same club. Don’t you think they may exist? Dark Web, who knows?

That's indeed worse than 1 sk, terrible imagination! Objections: They can't all be equally successful with leaving the crime scene unseen, without witnesses. And: they can't all have the same prerequisites, for example having the opportunity to "come around very quick", even from state to state, made possible by a corresponding job. (Or do you think of one club, each member killing in "his" state?)

 

[Jax49]

Refreshing:
Police release all-new sketch, video and audio of Delphi double murder suspect

The last paragraph I don't remember to have known.

Thank you. It is new to me also.

 

[Sincerely]

I don’t recall this either.

Refreshing:
Police release all-new sketch, video and audio of Delphi double murder suspect

The last paragraph I don't remember to have known.

 

[pearl]

Refreshing:
Police release all-new sketch, video and audio of Delphi double murder suspect

The last paragraph I don't remember to have known.

I do not remember the information in that paragraph either.

 

[Marzipan]

I do not remember the information in that paragraph either.

I thought that was an error that was corrected later, building abandoned, not vehicle. Vehicle seen but long gone by the time bodies found, right?
BTW, was it ever confirmed to be a car? I think I’ve heard car or even sedan but not so sure LE ever used those terms. Any chance it was a motorcycle?

 

[MistyWaters]

Refreshing:
Police release all-new sketch, video and audio of Delphi double murder suspect

The last paragraph I don't remember to have known.

I would bet this came about regarding the confusing interpretation of Carter’s words during the PC - was the vehicle abandoned or was the welfare building abandoned? It was later clarified by ISP it was the CPS/DCS welfare building that was abandoned.

“They say it was parked at the CPS/DCS welfare building in Delphi between noon to five on February 14, 2017.

It was later found abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North, next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway.”

*******

Here’s another similar quote but it’s still not exactly the words he spoke and how can a vehicle be “abandoned” between noon and 5pm?

“We’re looking for the identity of a driver of a vehicle parked outside the old DCS welfare building,” Carter said. “It was abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North, next to the Hooiser Heartland Highway, between the hours of noon and five p.m. on Feb. 13, 2017.”
ISP: New Information Puts 'New Face' on Delphi Suspect - 93.1FM WIBC

 

[MistyWaters]

From PC -
“We’re seeking the public’s help to identify the driver of a vehicle that was parked at the old CPS/DCS welfare building in the city of Delphi that was abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway between the hours of noon to five on February 14th, 2017 [Note: It has been updated that the date was misspoken- it should be February 13th, not 14th].

If you were parked there or know who was parked there, please contact the officers at the command post at The Delphi City Building.“

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I would bet this came about regarding the confusing interpretation of Carter’s words during the PC - was the vehicle abandoned or was the welfare building abandoned? It was later clarified by ISP it was the CPS/DCS welfare building that was abandoned.

“They say it was parked at the CPS/DCS welfare building in Delphi between noon to five on February 14, 2017.

It was later found abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North, next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway.”

*******

Here’s another similar quote but it’s still not exactly the words he spoke and how can a vehicle be “abandoned” between noon and 5pm?

“We’re looking for the identity of a driver of a vehicle parked outside the old DCS welfare building,” Carter said. “It was abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North, next to the Hooiser Heartland Highway, between the hours of noon and five p.m. on Feb. 13, 2017.”
ISP: New Information Puts 'New Face' on Delphi Suspect - 93.1FM WIBC

Forgetting that LE got the dates wrong at the press conference, these two sentences conjure up different images and impressions to me.

From the PC, I took it to mean LE was looking for the driver of a car parked at the old CPS building and the part “...on the side of County Road 300 North, next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway...” as their describing where exactly the old CPS building was located.

From that article, the sentence “ It was LATER(emphasis is mine) found abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North, next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway” means something entirely different. To me, that would mean a car was at the old CPS building and then sometime later in the day was seen at a different location along County Road 300 North.
I might be looking at it wrong, but if the article is worded correctly I’ve been thinking about this whole piece of information wrong.

 

[Marzipan]

Forgetting that LE got the dates wrong at the press conference, these two sentences conjure up different images and impressions to me.

From the PC, I took it to mean LE was looking for the driver of a car parked at the old CPS building and the part “...on the side of County Road 300 North, next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway...” as their describing where exactly the old CPS building was located.

From that article, the sentence “ It was LATER(emphasis is mine) found abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North, next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway” means something entirely different. To me, that would mean a car was at the old CPS building and then sometime later in the day was seen at a different location along County Road 300 North.
I might be looking at it wrong, but if the article is worded correctly I’ve been thinking about this whole piece of information wrong.

But why do we keep saying "car" when they say "vehicle"? Have they ever said it was a car? Sorry to be a broken record, but I have a person in mind who is not local there but may have been out that way on motorcycle rides.

 

[Charlot123]

That's indeed worse than 1 sk, terrible imagination! Objections: They can't all be equally successful with leaving the crime scene unseen, without witnesses. And: they can't all have the same prerequisites, for example having the opportunity to "come around very quick", even from state to state, made possible by a corresponding job. (Or do you think of one club, each member killing in "his" state?)

I am thinking of an online club. Maybe even different countries.

About “terrible imagination”. When I posted it, at first I thought, here is a free idea for a new crime book.

But having though about everything posted online, about internet communities, I thought, something like this is bound to exists, and for a while, already.

I wonder how many books written about SKs would factor in the Internet. Probably, very few, as SKs databases have accrued over the years. Everyone assumes it is a solo hobby, for the lack of a better term. They studied TB and GRK, and now, GSK, but those people operated a while ago. And what is happening today? Today, I would bet, Internet is uniting all these creeps into communities, and even when they are caught, they must keep silent about “friends online”, if only because they feel that they are the only ones “who understand”.

Anyhow, programs to seek patterns of MO for SKs in huge databases should exist, as i am thinking, it might be not more difficult than the filters that I used yesterday to shop online. But I wonder if anyone had ever considered groups or clubs? In fact, the filters would perfectly cut off the group factor. But they may pick it up as well if the base is huge and divided the right way, I found what I needed in 5 minutes plus the group of similar items.

Someone should do a “group” search. Being neither a criminologist nor a software engineer, I personally would use the same principle as if I were searching, say, for a “trophy hunters” club, and do it internationally.

 

[MistyWaters]

But why do we keep saying "car" when they say "vehicle"? Have they ever said it was a car? Sorry to be a broken record, but I have a person in mind who is not local there but may have been out that way on motorcycle rides.

Because the clarification mentioned “a car”. But it was also never officially stated that driver was believed to have been the suspect - that’s the conclusion people have drawn. That Carter asked that the driver “please” get in touch with LE if he was also believed to be the killer would seem to be well beyond wishful thinking IMO. There’s other reasons LE might have used the PC as an opportunity to reach out to anyone known to have parked there that day, for example if they had no other means of contact to a certain person who had earlier provided information to LE.

Indiana State Police release new sketch of Delphi murder suspect | Carroll County Calendar
UPDATE FROM INDIANA STATE POLICE ON APRIL 23, 2019:

EDITOR’S NOTE: During the press conference, the Indiana State Police Superintendent said authorities are also seeking the public’s help to identify the driver of a vehicle they say was parked at the old CPS/DCS Welfare Building in Delphi and later abandoned on the east side of CR 300N, next to the Hoosier Heartland Highway between noon and 5 p.m. on February 14, 2017. Police say if you were parked there or know who was, you should contact officers at the command post at the Delphi City Building.

Delphi, IN – The Multi-Agency Task Force is providing the below points of clarification after yesterday’s informational news conference.

• A car was parked in the abandoned CPS building parking lot between the hours of noon and 5:00 p.m. on February 13, 2017
  • We are looking for anyone who could give a description of vehicles that were in the parking lot during the time
• The location of the abandoned CPS building was 6931 West 300 North, Delphi, IN
  • The building has since been demolished and the lot is vacant

 

[Maplesyrup]

That's indeed worse than 1 sk, terrible imagination! Objections: They can't all be equally successful with leaving the crime scene unseen, without witnesses. And: they can't all have the same prerequisites, for example having the opportunity to "come around very quick", even from state to state, made possible by a corresponding job. (Or do you think of one club, each member killing in "his" state?)

This sounds very believable. These predators are not like us. They lack empathy and compassion and yes, they may belong to a club and want to "keep up" with each other. I would say it is safe to assume that they would take photos of what they have done. This stuff may be posted but due to the onion router [TOR]/use of the dark web, finding them is extremely difficult. I would assume LE would have to embed an FBI agent/someone...to slowly get into the "group." It would be painstakingly slow and very challenging. All IMO.

 

[Charlot123]

This sounds very believable. These predators are not like us. They lack empathy and compassion and yes, they may belong to a club and want to "keep up" with each other. I would say it is safe to assume that they would take photos of what they have done. This stuff may be posted but due to the onion router [TOR]/use of the dark web, finding them is extremely difficult. I would assume LE would have to embed an FBI agent/someone...to slowly get into the "group." It would be painstakingly slow and very challenging. All IMO.

(Sorry for answering for the other poster).

I was thinking about teenage groups who view "mutilation". They are more common than you'd think and VERY concerning given their age and the fact that their brains has not fully developed. When I asked myself, for how long the killing "club" or the "community" might exist, I thought of two extreme forms of control, homicide and suicide... should have formed at the same time for the two, just logically, because, human behavior. So, one can have a guess. Definitely with AOL I think, so, beginning of 2000es?

There might be different ways to find them out. Give the job to someone logical. But I am thinking, that if, just if, BG belongs to one of such groups, he does not need to be too smart nor needs to have special knowledge. He might get all necessary ideas from the club, including helping with the planning. I am thinking about it more and more.

Has he killed before? I don't know, but the planning shows some knowledge. Either, a genius, or, got some advises. Probably. I bet, some animals, and not in a nice way.

Has he killed after? SKs escalate in their behavior, because, as I suspect, there is a strong OCD component in it. But a collector's behavior, while being similar to OCD, in fact, a form of OCD, is different - people can wait for a very long time to find what they want, while constantly searching. So, one thing, he really got burned with the photo, video and recording, another one, he might be in the process of looking.

Think of this. Collectors have private clubs, Facebooks, IGs, any media. But something "cheaper", or just "parts" of their collection, they might post online for everyone to see. What do you think SK could post openly without being afraid of getting caught? I have two ideas. Places. And tools.

Think of this cretin, this moron, who found a group to kill for him in AK. None of the participants was a genius, and yet, a girl was killed. And he looked like a nice guy!

 

[Tiger Stripes]

But why do we keep saying "car" when they say "vehicle"? Have they ever said it was a car? Sorry to be a broken record, but I have a person in mind who is not local there but may have been out that way on motorcycle rides.

This is probably all just "me", @Marzipan (love your name, btw; *so* yummy! ), but am fairly sure that, back in the spring of 2017 when I heard the scanner threads (and specifically the one mentioning an abandoned vehicle at the CPS building -- this, before the CPS building was torn down), that LE did indeed say "vehicle" or "car" -- and they actually gave the make/model of it, and to whom it was registered [per TOS will *not* put that info here]).

So nope -- definitely did *not* hear them identify a *motorcycle* (though that definitely raises a whole new set of interesting possibilities in this case).

 

[Marzipan]

This is probably all just "me", @Marzipan (love your name, btw; *so* yummy! ), but am fairly sure that, back in the spring of 2017 when I heard the scanner threads (and specifically the one mentioning an abandoned vehicle at the CPS building -- this, before the CPS building was torn down), that LE did indeed say "vehicle" or "car" -- and they actually gave the make/model of it, and to whom it was registered [per TOS will *not* put that info here]).

So nope -- definitely did *not* hear them identify a *motorcycle* (though that definitely raises a whole new set of interesting possibilities in this case).

Thanks! Someone once told me that Marzipan is a band name too, but I of course just named myself after almonds and sugar. I'm grateful to you and to @MistyWaters and @StarryStarryNight for setting me straight. I didn't follow this case early on--not until last November, I think. I'm happy if I can possibly scratch motorcycle off my list, although I understand they are not saying the owner or driver of the car was necessarily the killer. I'm very, very surprised to hear that it was once public knowledge who the car was registered to. I just tried a quick search and it does seem that info has been scrubbed from the web. I wish I knew, but again, it perhaps doesn't matter. What I really wish is for another press conference with updates on the case, but gotta trust they are being well advised on what to share or not share. We just knew so much more in the Jacob Wetterling case, Kyron Horman case, and any other case I can think of.

 

[BNA]

The use of the word "abandoned" is confusing. Abandoned is abandoned. Parked is parked. Why use the word abandoned?

 

[Laughing]

The use of the word "abandoned" is confusing. Abandoned is abandoned. Parked is parked. Why use the word abandoned?

The building is vacant & has been for several years -- maybe the word was applied to the building & someone overgeneralized to the vehicle?

I'm still leaning toward a service van -- cable TV, phone company, we 'see' those vehicles so often that we often don't process the information thoroughly, IMHO.

JMHO YMMV LRR