Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #129

[3blue1pink]

IDK ... if there we’re other passers by I’d think they’d have come forward and tell LE what they saw . Even if video guy wasn’t BG ( which I believe he was ) why wouldnt he come forward as seeing the girls on the bridge . I think Libby’s 6th sense was tingling and that’s why she took the video .

 

[TexLil]

Welcome to the thread. No presser this year .

I wish that LE would do a presser today and give an overview to the citizens of the area focusing on

• THIS is the face of the person we believe killed the girls
• THIS is the walk of the person we believe killed the girls
• THIS is the voice of the person we believe killed the girls.

Use technology to put it all together. Ask again for help from community.

I highly respect LE. I trust they are doing all THEY can do but I want them to help the community help them. MOO there still is confusion on OBG and NBG. Put that confusion to bed. Today.

Thinking of the girls' loved ones today and always. Friends, family, teachers, neighbors. You are in my heart.

 

[steeltowngirl]

This prompts the same unanswered questions in my mind. So they have DNA or we can assume from some LE comments, is it a complete profile or enough of one to identify the killer or do a familial search? Or, if complete, do we have more than one unidentified DNA profile? Assuming a complete profile and Indiana labs don't do familial searches, has LE reached out to the FBI? Or a private group that has done this before? It's too late to submit questions, but if someone like myself has these questions then others must have the same questions as well. I hope they got submitted. Of course, the next step would be for LE to answer them and we've all had our speculations on that probability.

Back in 2017, they said they had DNA and it was being fast tracked.
Carroll County sheriff discusses Delphi murder investigation, says DNA evidence ‘fast-tracked’ | Fox 59

In 2018, they said they were using the same technology as used in April Tinsley’s case - Parabon, a private organization.
Delphi murder investigators using same DNA tech that led to Fort Wayne cold case arrest

Investigation ongoing two-years after murders of Abby Williams, Libby German in Delphi | WTTV CBS4Indy

 

[MistyWaters]

Maybe posts they had on Facebook or pictures on their FB would yield clues of someone’s suspicious behavior or their weird comments and postings about Valentines Day the night of when the girls bodies were found.

Do you really believe somebody’s suspicious behaviour that’s unrecognizable to people who personally know him including family, coworkers or friends would drop clues all over FB for strangers to spot? FB is very well known for games people play. It’s more apt FB yields false leads by those sorts of players who thrill at leading people on just for a lark. This killer has evaded police investigative teams for four years on so just my opinion - doubtful he’s quite so stupid as to give his identity away on FB.

 

[Lmustang89]

HLN Sunday (tomorrow) 10pm eastern time will have Delphi murders

 

[MistyWaters]

Carter and the rest of the ISP are all about Public relations. I couldn't believe the things he said during that press conference. They wanted everyone, including the killer to think they were on the door step of this guy, and in the end, he made fools out of LE.
Let's review..
Carter claimed this guy was between 18 and 40. Aren't most criminals?
Carter claimed this guy may be sitting right here in the room, then back pedaled the next day on a talk show saying he may have been close. What's close? 20 miles away having lunch at McDonalds?
Carter claimed that this guy may be from the area, worked in that area, or may frequent that area. Who found that hard to figure out?
A large presentation and an unveiling of a photograph that looks nothing like the first sketch and a message about how the killer didn't think they'd change their strategy. All that did was lower the confidence level the public had in reference to the ISP.
A cliffhanger throughout the presser about how they had new audio that may help crack the case.
"Guys."

Yes, it was a excellent display of Crisis Management. —how to take a negative situation (the highly promoted older guy sketch was not panning out) and change it into an exciting positive - a New Direction! Instead of mass disappointment over the Wrong Direction LE had led the public on, Carter’s dramatics left a sense of awe with the expectation of an impending arrest involving what appeared to be a brilliant LE strategy of outsmarting the known criminal.

Why that’d all be necessary if the culprit was in that very room that day never made any sense but none the less Carter’s performance certainly appeared to increase his fan base.

JMO

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

A few thoughts that are swirling around in my mind:

1. I’m going to assume for just a few minutes that these horrific murders of Abby & Libby, were NOT BG’s first time killing, nor is it his second or even third.
2. LE said that the killer had 3 signatures.
3. I did some research about murders, crimes, serial killers, and reading up on other cases as well.
4. It is to my understanding that the type of killer that has a signature is the “serial killer” type. And signatures do not change. However MO’s can change but never signatures.

Before I did this research I just could not wrap my mind around whyyyy LE didn’t/haven’t released more to the public. But now I have a completely different view on this entire situation.


My guess is that BG is a serial killer, that the FBI knows this as well. And they other cases tied to him. But they don’t want him to know this yet, for whatever reason.

I think that the FBI has coached the local LE about what to say and not say.


And I also believe that his MO has changed. And I believe that the FBI knows this as well. And I believe that there is at the very least one other case that is tied to him, and quite possibly additional single unsolved murders, rather single murders that are unbeknownst to the public, that are also tied to him. Which has been a major factor as to why this case, and others, have had their details not released to the public.


This is all just m0o, and speculation.

 

[3blue1pink]

Yes, it was a excellent display of Crisis Management. —how to take a negative situation (the highly promoted older guy sketch was not panning out) and change it into an exciting positive - a New Direction! Instead of mass disappointment over the Wrong Direction LE had led the public on, Carter’s dramatics left a sense of awe with the expectation of an impending arrest involving what appeared to be a brilliant LE strategy of outsmarting the known criminal.

Why that’d all be necessary if the culprit was in that very room that day never made any sense but none the less Carter’s performance certainly appeared to increase his fan base.

JMO

I’d like to know where they got the profile for the sketch of NBG. It couldn’t be from the video it looks nothing like him. So where did they get it ? Could it be from another case they think may be perpetrated by the same BG? This is just taking way too long and they are being too cryptic . It’s time to release at least a few new details obviously the whole ( closed mouth ) thing isn’t working . Time for a new angle .

 

[StarryStarryNight]

Now, tbh, i really like watching and listening to Ives speaking about the case. He has an analytical, if not to say, engineer's, mind, and his speech is very succinct. No excessive emotions, no extra information, just facts.

However, one thing that he says makes me wonder exactly the opposite. He said, there was no doubt that BG was responsible for the murders.

Thinking logically...

All we see is the man on the bridge with an odd gait. Unless the video extends (and we don't know what it shows), I am not a 100% sure that it is the same guy who approached the girls and marched them down the hill.

There were people around, maybe it is a passer-by. (It is another thing that the guy never came forward, but maybe he was an illegal alien from somewhere around?)

Maybe it is a red herring?

Maybe he wore a mask, and maybe one of the descriptions fits this guy (it is interesting how the sketches of the OBG and the NBG differ in the amount of details - really, I'd trust NBG sketch more because this is the same I would remember from a chance meeting with someone I didn't know).

At this point in time, I believe, the ISP has reached two dead ends, with two big cases. Maybe it is the result of being overwhelmed, because they have to do their daily job, too.

Really, it calls for two target groups, who will start from the very beginning. Before the murders.

Maybe I’m not understanding what exactly you’re saying and if I’m not, I apologize.
In order to believe that the guy on the bridge filmed by Libby is NOT the guy who accosted them and probably killed them you would have to think that the video and video still photos we have seen were taken long before the girls ever saw this guy, that he was just some man who happened across the bridge, said hello and left, before the real bad guy shows up.
I find that hard to believe. I feel certain LE has seen enough of that video to know that is the guy who confronts the girls after crossing the bridge.
Now whether or not there was a second guy waiting at the crime scene that was involved in killing the girls is open for discussion thanks to the inability of LE to make up their minds about this. I think not myself but possible. The guy on the bridge in Libby’s video, bad guy, kidnapper, killer with or without an accomplice.
Just my thoughts.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

I’d like to know where they got the profile for the sketch of NBG. It couldn’t be from the video it looks nothing like him. So where did they get it ? Could it be from another case they think may be perpetrated by the same BG? This is just taking way too long and they are being too cryptic . It’s time to release at least a few new details obviously the whole ( closed mouth ) thing isn’t working . Time for a new angle .

LE stated that the new sketch was done a couple of days after the murders and was initiated by someone who came to LE that had seen “something they felt needed reporting”.
That’s pretty much all we know.

 

[3blue1pink]

LE stated that the new sketch was done a couple of days after the murders and was initiated by someone who came to LE that had seen “something they felt needed reporting”.
That’s pretty much all we know.

So they had this sketch for 3 years before releasing it as the possible perp ? What ?

 

[stattlich1]

"There was so much physical evidence at the crime, and the crime had been found so IMMEDIATELY after it had been committed"

Words from Ives video on page 2 of this thread. I capitalized the word "immediately" because I found it rather odd. I'd never consider the next day, around noon, to be "immediately". More confusing speaking, or a window of truth to an otherwise generally accepted idea of what occurred?

I don't think we know for sure the time of death. I always assumed it to be the day prior to the bodies being found. So it could be as much as 18 hours later that the bodies were found. Is that immediately, in LE speak?

And early on in the same video, he says the FBI came in "extreme numbers", not to mention an outpouring of LE from surrounding counties, etc. etc.

Yet no resolution.

BG is either real good at murder, or REAL lucky.

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

I am 100% convinced that we the public will not really know anything more than we already know atm, until BG is arrested. And even then, I still don’t think LE/FBI will release too many more details. For conviction/trial purposes, it is IMHO, we won’t know much more until after he is in prison. mO0.

 

[UnapologeticallyAspie]

"There was so much physical evidence at the crime, and the crime had been found so IMMEDIATELY after it had been committed"

Words from Ives video on page 2 of this thread. I capitalized the word "immediately" because I found it rather odd. I'd never consider the next day, around noon, to be "immediately". More confusing speaking, or a window of truth to an otherwise generally accepted idea of what occurred?

I don't think we know for sure the time of death. I always assumed it to be the day prior to the bodies being found. So it could be as much as 18 hours later that the bodies were found. Is that immediately, in LE speak?

And early on in the same video, he says the FBI came in "extreme numbers", not to mention an outpouring of LE from surrounding counties, etc. etc.

Yet no resolution.

BG is either real good at murder, or REAL lucky.

Ever since I watched one of the interviews on YT of Libby’s mom, (paraphrasing here) saying something about one of the girls being possibly alive had LE searched later than midnight and/or perhaps earlier than 10am, that there was a possibility of one of girls still being alive, really through me.
I now wonder if she was coached to say this or was this something that happened off the cuff.

 

[StarryStarryNight]

So they had this sketch for 3 years before releasing it as the possible perp ? What ?

Apparently.
Pretty shocking. It’s a head scratcher for sure.

 

[Rocky1]

Yet this article from 2018 says familial DNA was used in the April Tinsley case. Did the law change since that time? Would the technique possibly still be available to use, but results not legally admissible in court?

Delphi detectives working closely with investigators who cracked Fort Wayne cold case | Fox 59

From what I read, using familial DNA is not legal in Indiana.
The suspect in the April Tinsley case confessed, so I don't think the DNA was entered into evidence.

Ever since I watched one of the interviews on YT of Libby’s mom, (paraphrasing here) saying something about one of the girls being possibly alive had LE searched later than midnight and/or perhaps earlier than 10am, that there was a possibility of one of girls still being alive, really through me.
I now wonder if she was coached to say this or was this something that happened off the cuff.

It's been a while, and I haven't followed this thread in a long time, but if I remember right, someone from the ISP was asked that question, but wouldn't comment.

 

[sandy_80]

Apparently.
Pretty shocking. It’s a head scratcher for sure.

not really...it doesnt look like the male in the video and wasnt directly connected with the crime...( a witness that saw something that looked suspicious ) is not ( a witness identifying bg ) .

 

[MistyWaters]

not really...it doesnt look like the male in the video and wasnt directly connected with the crime...( a witness that saw something that looked suspicious ) is not ( a witness identifying bg ) .

Huh? Yes when the younger-guy sketch was released April/19, LE emphatically stated he was the suspect. LE have never stated they now believe the person depicted in the sketch wasn’t directly connected, as well that sketch is still featured on the FBI posters. The video shows a man looking downward, impossible to determine his age IMO.

“According to an ISP release, the new sketch of the clean-shaven man “is representative of the face of the person captured in the video on Liberty German’s cell phone as he was walking on the high bridge.”..”
Delphi murders: New suspect sketch not same man as in old sketch, ISP clarifies

 

[3blue1pink]

I listened to a podcast today I think it was called “Down the hill” . A woman interviewed the COP and his responses to her questions were extremely vague at best . It was almost as if he was trying to hide something . It wasnt like “ no comment “ or a firm yes or no . It was more like to the best of my knowledge, or I don’t believe so kind of responses . If I were one of the girls parents/guardians Id be calling him every single day . This wishy washy IDK maybe stuff is exudes incompetence. I’m sorry I have full respect for LE , heck I was a police dispatcher for a city of 70k people for years . What I hear when he blows off the questions is somebody told me to keep quiet and that’s what I’m going to do .

 

[FrostedGlass]

"There was so much physical evidence at the crime, and the crime had been found so IMMEDIATELY after it had been committed"

Words from Ives video on page 2 of this thread. I capitalized the word "immediately" because I found it rather odd. I'd never consider the next day, around noon, to be "immediately". More confusing speaking, or a window of truth to an otherwise generally accepted idea of what occurred?

I don't think we know for sure the time of death. I always assumed it to be the day prior to the bodies being found. So it could be as much as 18 hours later that the bodies were found. Is that immediately, in LE speak?

And early on in the same video, he says the FBI came in "extreme numbers", not to mention an outpouring of LE from surrounding counties, etc. etc.

Yet no resolution.

BG is either real good at murder, or REAL lucky.

We had a lot of discussion in the beginning as to if the girls were taken away and brought back later. Most thought that wasn't likely. Someone could have parked on the private road under the bridge, threw them in the car and drove away. They could have been somewhere watching the news on tv and listening to the search on Broadcastify.

It was so dark in the woods, I don't know if anyone would have seen them bringing the girls back. Or, if they did, they might have thought they were searchers. They could have parked in the cemetery, dumped the bodies down the hill and then been gone.

I've always wondered why the girls stayed at the end of the bridge. It's so narrow and steep on either side; it just seems like they would have walked further south just that little way to the farmer's field. Or maybe they did go down that first little hill to the road, thinking he would keep going to the farmer's field. However, after all this time, none of the scenarios fit well.