Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #96

[Charlot123]

Thanks for the response.Good to see you again ocgrad.

Quoting CE from linked source:

“I even walked all the way across the bridge and back. I only (saw) a guy when I first got there and another couple once I got on the bridge,” CME wrote. “I didn’t see the girls at all. I also didn’t take the trail that leads to the right. Only took the trail that lead to the bridge.”

Abigail Williams & Liberty German: 5 Fast Facts You Need to Know | Heavy.com

We have CE an eye witness who mentions seeing a couple during the tight timeline when the girls are first discovered missing. Then Libby’s dad also speaks to still another person at the bridge who mentions seeing a couple in those critical moments. Oh I wish with all my heart that this would help investigators find BG.

Did I phrase this correct? Or am I getting facts confused? I hope this has not already been rehashed on another thread.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

MOO

This “eerie picture” of Abigail from Heavy.com, is there a person or two standing in the back, or merely the trees?

 

[QCD893]

I think it's odd. It's the exact numbers inversed. I'm not saying it means anything but I certainly understand why someone would find that odd.

The mathematical random chance of the two dates match like that is extremely low, in fact. Extremely unlikely it's random, but it's only statistically speaking. It happens, I guess, right, even the chance is almost nothing, but it's not zero ....

But, how about other "coincidences"?

Certainly, very interesting.

 

[moonlessnight]

the trauma response is not one size fits all, and depends on the previous trauma history as well as protective factors. but generally the hippocampus may be smaller in response to severe trauma as in PTSD.

ETA - the difference being in PTSD there is severe experience and dysregulation of emotion, in psychopathy there is no emotion, to oversimplify.

But my understanding is the amygdala shrinks (gets smaller) under stress or trauma?

ETA: Here I am studying brain science, and I agree with you. Don’t know why I thought that. You are right.

 

[Jax49]

And that there were two victims which isn't as common. And that they were killed in a park.

And that they look alike, imho.

 

[MuddyTires]

Let me ask this hypothetical,

Say you were being harassed on your social media by sleuths or whatever but we're innocent. Would you wipe your social media presence and all accounts or would you keep them active and fight back?

The answer is going likely going to depend on the individual and their own circumstances. Some will believe their safety is at risk if people are posting things like that on their SM pages, so they'll take them down. Others will feel more inclined to fight.

 

[Angelcat13]

Reply to Angelcat13, yes it happened in NJ. Sorry I cannot bring over your quote from previous thread.

Not sure if it's the same one I'm thinking of, though, since I thought you said in a reply to someone else that the killer was killed by police. The one I was thinking of was in Evesham (Marlton), Burlington County in 2002. Ronald Pituch was convicted of murdering his mother after she refused to buy him cigarettes. He tied up his 5 y/o niece and fled the scene, attacked an elderly woman he came across who was out for a walk. He then crossed paths with an 11 y/o boy riding his bike through a wooded area on his way to a friend's house and killed him "in a rage".

 

[Jabarn]

the trauma response is not one size fits all, and depends on the previous trauma history as well as protective factors. but generally the hippocampus may be smaller in response to severe trauma as in PTSD.

Maybe that’s what I was thinking, but taking note. Thanks, moonlessnight.

 

[MsBetsy]

Just went back and watched. Good catch! His reaction DOES seem to be in reaction to "...or works here". Makes me wonder just how close "here" is to LE.

I think they mean Delphi. If the killer was in any way close to the case then why would he not know what they know?
He would have first hand information. I doubt it's anyone who has been working on the case. Jmo

 

[gregjrichards]

This “eerie picture” of Abigail from Heavy.com, is there a person or two standing in the back, or merely the trees?

No many of us have studied that photo intensively for a long period and came to the majority conclusion there is nobody else in the photo. Nor is there a vehicle.

 

[Jax49]

No many of us have studied that photo intensively for a long period and came to the majority conclusion there is nobody else in the photo. Nor is there a vehicle.

My memory is fading, but isn't there a sign in that position? And LE responded by saying they'd studied the photo and there was no vehicle or people. moo

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Jane, you are correct.
We are impatient, often wanting more from LE, forgetting the end game, but as you state,
"I’d rather LEO do whatever it takes to convict and punish than leave a loop hole that could cause any doubt and let this person off."

I am so pleased this Creep is now terrified, he will soon be arrested.
Happy times, for everyone then.
Can you imagine how satisfied all those working on the case will be.
MOO.

I keep having to remind myself, that this is a population of a very very small little town of 3,000 people. And therefore, their law enforcement isn't one which can deal with this easily.

 

[steeltowngirl]

Let me ask this hypothetical,

Say you were being harassed on your social media by sleuths or whatever but we're innocent. Would you wipe your social media presence and all accounts or would you keep them active and fight back?

IMO, This problem may be happening because the PC took on the tone of chasing a serial killer. Religious overtones. Saying he might be in this room. It set a fever pitch.

So to answer your question, if hypothetically I had a brother that looked like the sketch and lived near where this is, here is what I’d tell him:

Everyone’s innocent. Except someone’s not. Go to the police station, get cleared, prove where you were that day, give a swab. Chalk it up to a bad day. But, try to understand that it’s not about you. It’s about trying to catch this guy. You lost your Facebook. Two young girls lost their lives. Be part of the solution. Do what you must to get cleared. Then move on.

 

[ocgrad]

I'm still wondering what compelled Doug Carter to make this statement: "For more than two years you never thought we would shift gears to a different investigative strategy, [insert pause for dramatic effect] ... but we have." Huh? How absurd. I feel like I'm watching the pilot episode of a failed TV series.

It seems every word was written by a profiler for an effect. Maybe he was speaking to a gear head, a mechanic or someone whose hobby is cars or motorcycles, someone who loves riding or driving or speed.

 

[Stratocaster]

In still absorbing all the known evidence because I'm new to the case.

<modsnipped rumor is not allowed>

 

[neesaki]

YES! I got this feeling, too. The press conference with the focus of change in strategy...the strong words of “you thought we wouldn’t change our strategy....well, we did.” I wonder if this is LE putting the heat on BG in a new way.

This is just my own personal impression and opinion.....so, JMO.
LE has possibly had some sort of input from or interaction with the person, either directly or indirectly, that is in opposition to what is going on now....
Iow, they are saying in this PR that they now know the suspect was, either overtly or covertly attempting to mislead the investigation.
As I said, it’s all Jmo.

 

[acutename]

I wonder if anyone in Delphi is acting strange? Dyed hair, grew a beard, changed their appearance drastically or disappeared, moved away, didn't return from college after all or took a sudden trip out of the country. In a town of 3,000, there's bound to be local chatter.

sold a vehicle Feb 14,2017; or painted a vehicle or stopped registering a vehicle that suddenly became a pile of parts....

 

[Onaliv]

For a couple of days I have held off posting as I found myself travelling into some dark sleuthing corners I never expected to travel and have had some sleepless nights thinking about this case. I think I know the transcripts from the last presser almost verbatim.

Now I need to put my jumbled thoughts down and hope they make sense to you all.

Let me preface what I am about to write with JMO to get that out of the way.

LE knows who did this, but did not have this suspect in their vision until a couple of months ago.

The key is that they only eliminated the person in sketch number one recently.

Since the 2 year anniversary press conference, I had been wondering why they never displayed BG's sketch and it bugged me to no end. (Please correct me if I am wrong, but I am certain there was no sketch #1 on display on February 13th 2019.)

I believe that right around that time is when they had to dismiss him (Sketch #1) as their primary suspect, he was cleared of Abby and Libby's murders, and they COULDN'T display it anymore.

I believe that one they realized that he wasn't their guy, they had to go back to the start of their investigation. That's when they realized that the guy in sketch #2 is their guy. "We are just now beginning..."

I think that the witness(es)? who described the person in sketch #2 (BG) also described several other people to the sketch artist that day. When the person in sketch #2 was described, he was dismissed immediately as there was no room for consideration for him to be a suspect. I believe that there were several other sketches of many people that were there that were done within days of the crime taking place. I believe that this guy had a big part in providing the details for sketch #1. "We believe you are hiding in plain sight. For more than two years you never thought we would shift gears to a different investigative strategy but we have. We likely have interviewed you or someone close to you. "

The guy in sketch #1 was always their focus almost from day #1 because he fit the puzzle so perfectly. (I am NOT in any way criticizing LE for this, they did everything they could to eliminate him as their suspect as quickly as they could.)

The vehicle is now the key.
The reason why LE was so vague about the colour, make and model of the vehicle is that they need BG to know that they know who he is. They need him to be looking over his shoulder. They need him to wonder how much they know...because that's what is going to break him.

"...you want to know what we know. And one day you will."

I believe that someone interacted with him that day BEFORE THE TRAIL and before the girls were even dropped off.

"We're seeking the public's help to identify the driver of a vehicle that was parked at the old CPS DCS welfare building in the city of Delphi that was abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North next to the Hoosier Heartland highway between the hours of noon to 5:00 on February 13th 2017. "

LE needs that person to have the 'lightbulb' moment and realize that they did, in fact, interact with the driver (BG aka the man in sketch #2) earlier that day, and once that person comes forward, the rest is going to fall into place.

Superintendent Carter is a remarkable man who did an amazing thing last Monday. I think that he showed so much courage at that Presser.

(But not nearly as much courage as our hero Libby did on the trail that day when she began filming and putting the first nail in BG's coffin.)

This has hit him and the rest of his team hard and he is going to nail this guy to the floor. Mark my words here and now.
"Never in my career have I stood in front of something like this. Please be patient with us. Please. We're just beginning."

I have many reasons for all of the above thoughts, but in the interest of keeping my membership here, I am going to leave this post without elaborating any more than I have.

You all are amazing here. A dedicated group with hearts of platinum. Many of you have brought tears to my eyes with your written thoughts of compassion as well as your determination.

I know many of you go to sleep thinking about these girls and wake up thinking about them....I do too.

Great post

 

[ocgrad]

For a couple of days I have held off posting as I found myself travelling into some dark sleuthing corners I never expected to travel and have had some sleepless nights thinking about this case. I think I know the transcripts from the last presser almost verbatim.

Now I need to put my jumbled thoughts down and hope they make sense to you all.

Let me preface what I am about to write with JMO to get that out of the way.

LE knows who did this, but did not have this suspect in their vision until a couple of months ago.

The key is that they only eliminated the person in sketch number one recently.

Since the 2 year anniversary press conference, I had been wondering why they never displayed BG's sketch and it bugged me to no end. (Please correct me if I am wrong, but I am certain there was no sketch #1 on display on February 13th 2019.)

I believe that right around that time is when they had to dismiss him (Sketch #1) as their primary suspect, he was cleared of Abby and Libby's murders, and they COULDN'T display it anymore.

I believe that one they realized that he wasn't their guy, they had to go back to the start of their investigation. That's when they realized that the guy in sketch #2 is their guy. "We are just now beginning..."

I think that the witness(es)? who described the person in sketch #2 (BG) also described several other people to the sketch artist that day. When the person in sketch #2 was described, he was dismissed immediately as there was no room for consideration for him to be a suspect. I believe that there were several other sketches of many people that were there that were done within days of the crime taking place. I believe that this guy had a big part in providing the details for sketch #1. "We believe you are hiding in plain sight. For more than two years you never thought we would shift gears to a different investigative strategy but we have. We likely have interviewed you or someone close to you. "

The guy in sketch #1 was always their focus almost from day #1 because he fit the puzzle so perfectly. (I am NOT in any way criticizing LE for this, they did everything they could to eliminate him as their suspect as quickly as they could.)

The vehicle is now the key.
The reason why LE was so vague about the colour, make and model of the vehicle is that they need BG to know that they know who he is. They need him to be looking over his shoulder. They need him to wonder how much they know...because that's what is going to break him.

"...you want to know what we know. And one day you will."

I believe that someone interacted with him that day BEFORE THE TRAIL and before the girls were even dropped off.

"We're seeking the public's help to identify the driver of a vehicle that was parked at the old CPS DCS welfare building in the city of Delphi that was abandoned on the east side of County Road 300 North next to the Hoosier Heartland highway between the hours of noon to 5:00 on February 13th 2017. "

LE needs that person to have the 'lightbulb' moment and realize that they did, in fact, interact with the driver (BG aka the man in sketch #2) earlier that day, and once that person comes forward, the rest is going to fall into place.

Superintendent Carter is a remarkable man who did an amazing thing last Monday. I think that he showed so much courage at that Presser.

(But not nearly as much courage as our hero Libby did on the trail that day when she began filming and putting the first nail in BG's coffin.)

This has hit him and the rest of his team hard and he is going to nail this guy to the floor. Mark my words here and now.
"Never in my career have I stood in front of something like this. Please be patient with us. Please. We're just beginning."

I have many reasons for all of the above thoughts, but in the interest of keeping my membership here, I am going to leave this post without elaborating any more than I have.

You all are amazing here. A dedicated group with hearts of platinum. Many of you have brought tears to my eyes with your written thoughts of compassion as well as your determination.

I know many of you go to sleep thinking about these girls and wake up thinking about them....I do too.

Great post!!

 

[Angelcat13]

abduction vs non abduction, if the if you add the dates ofeach crime, they come to the same number but numerology is nonsense. The Iowa girls were taken, killed elsewhere then dumped and hidden. The Delphi girls were not taken outside of the crime scene, body's not hidden there are very few actual similarity's

Unless he got interrupted in Delphi and didn't have the chance to remove them from the area and, if he had, maybe they would have been missing for a lot longer.

 

[neesaki]

I missed it I guess and didn't see it in any of the articles I read, but re: the SO, CE, who was arrested and cleared of being BG, did LE state how he was cleared ? Was it with DNA ? TIA

I hate to quote my own post, but in lieu of no response does that mean we don’t know how they ruled out CE as BG? As in, we don’t know if it was by DNA?
I was really hoping DNA, which would make it more likely, I think, that they also would have DNA on the real killer.