Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #96

[mtnlites]

I'd imagine the search that night involved lots of shouting their names and hoping for one of them to shout back but probably no in-depth looking at undergrowth or anything else.

I think the most they expected to be wrong was that one to the girls had slipped and hurt themselves and that the phone had run out of battery.

No way would they have expected that in that short space of time two teenage girls would be murdered.

I can just imagine the optimism at that point. Yes worried they were missing and likely to be out in the cold and dark all night but not really thinking any real harm had come to them, certainly nothing sinister.

Must have been horrific the next day.

Right. At that time they were searching for living girls who'd only gotten lost or hurt. They weren't looking for dead bodies. :-(

 

[Yvettea]

Regarding the newest PC, I want to share an observation and am curious to hear your thoughts - If you watch Sheriff Leazenby who is standing behind Carter, he is pretty stoic the entire time - except when Superintendent Carter says "...or works here" when describing the killer. The Sheriff has a visible reaction. It of course may be nothing, but if you watch his face through the entire speech, he seems to swallow once when Carter is asking people to look at the mannerisms of BG, and then at the "...or works here" part, he very noticeably reacts. I find it very interesting.

Link please.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Link please.

Page 1 of this thread.

 

[Steffannieg]

Does this work? It’s the PC video from page one. Sorry, I’m new to this forum!

Edited to add: The moment I am referring to is around the 3:30 mark.

 

[MistyWaters]

Agreed personally I feel early searches were exclusively focused on the trail and very close to the bridge

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the search didn't expand out to a grid style search and surrounding area until the next day

And in fact I think thats exactly what happened

JMO

This is what was reported by the family in the past as well, that people walked throughout the trail system, calling out their names.

I’ve always been very impressed by the fact the families had the foresight to report them missing as quickly as they did, within about 2 hours. That’s always demonstrated for me the girls were known to be responsible and reliable. I think many other parents/grandparents of teenagers would say if their teenagers show up 2 hours late the kids consider it on time, what’s the big deal.

 

[NancyDrew3]

I don’t know if this is allowed. In addition to the man shot & killed this week in Indiana while jogging, a young woman has been shot & killed in Iowa while driving today. Both cases as of today appear to be random shootings/ killings by an unidentified stranger. Iowa and Indiana, both states with unsolved murders of two girls on the 13th of a month. Within a week of the recent Delphi PC. Coincidence or related?

A 25-year-old Iowa woman was shot and killed while driving home from work - CNN

Correction: Indiana man April 29th early morning. Iowa woman April 28th early morning.

 

[Hatfield]

Right. At that time they were searching for living girls who'd only gotten lost or hurt. They weren't looking for dead bodies. :-(

Right. I am sure there was even an assumption made that the girls may have voluntarily left the bridge area on their own or by another friend's vehicle and could show back up at their houses later that evening.

It was only as the evening got later with no contact with the girls that reality started to set in that something bad may have indeed happened. And by then I am sure a decision was made for the safety of the searchers to regroup at first light.

 

[Skigh]

Agreed personally I feel early searches were exclusively focused on the trail and very close to the bridge

I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the search didn't expand out to a grid style search and
surrounding area until the next day
And in fact I think thats exactly what happened

JMO[QUOTE

I think they would not at that stage have considered the girls would have crossed the creek.

 

[Boxer]

I think the same thing.

MOO from police wanted poster "BG last seen 2:30.- I have assumed that is
the time stamp from the phone video.

MOO again, DP actively calling on cell 3:00, physically on trail (IIRC 3:11 ) and presumably near to yelling his head off for them soon after.

MOO I am speculating that with so little time, BG was interrupted, killed his victims to prevent identification and slipped away using his thorough knowledge of the bridge and surrounding area.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Correction: Indiana man April 29th early morning. Iowa woman April 28th early morning.

Deleted

 

[MistyWaters]

Yes. By the time the search started it would have been dusk. And I'm sure you start at the "center" of the disappearance and fan out. Their bodies were half a mile away.

Only in hindsight. It’s easy for us to say now but the automatic assumption is not that every missing person is a homicide victim. The early focus is also trying to determine where they are, presuming they’re alive.

 

[carbuff]

Right. I am sure there was even an assumption made that the girls may have voluntarily left the bridge area on their own or by another friend's vehicle and could show back up at their houses later that evening.

It was only as the evening got later with no contact with the girls that reality started to set in that something bad may have indeed happened. And by then I am sure a decision was made for the safety of the searchers to regroup at first light.

Right. And hanging there between, "I'm going to ground her for a week when she gets home for pulling a trick like this" and "I'm really worried."

 

[slashkiss]

Regarding the newest PC, I want to share an observation and am curious to hear your thoughts - If you watch Sheriff Leazenby who is standing behind Carter, he is pretty stoic the entire time - except when Superintendent Carter says "...or works here" when describing the killer. The Sheriff has a visible reaction. It of course may be nothing, but if you watch his face through the entire speech, he seems to swallow once when Carter is asking people to look at the mannerisms of BG, and then at the "...or works here" part, he very noticeably reacts. I find it very interesting.

OMG! I watched the entire PC on mute just staring at him so I wouldn't be biased by anything and sure enough he definitely had a negative reaction right after he says "or works here". I watched until I saw a reaction I deemed was negative and then re-winded and turned it off mute and there it was! He looks down almost in shame. Based on that reaction I strongly believe they have a very good idea if not positive who it is and are ashamed (maybe because they missed him initially or because it is someone trusted).

 

[CSIDreamer]

Only in hindsight. It’s easy for us to say now but the automatic assumption is not that a missing person is a homicide victim. The focus is on where might they have gone.

Right. But there was an official search going on. For all they knew, they were hurt or lost. I'm assuming a search is a search. Unless we're talking about 2 different things and not realizing it.

 

[ocgrad]

And as Libby’s dad would’ve walked to the bridge from where he parked at 3:14, we don’t know what time he sighted people near the bridge but it would’ve been later than that. He probably waited in the parking lot for awhile as well. So hypothetically only, if the murders occurred at 2:45pm and DG didn’t see these people until 3:45pm the murderer would’ve been long before any of them were nearby.

And DG didn't go to the bridge, he saw FS and then turned to go to the creek. Then he turned to walk toware Freedom bridge.

 

[MistyWaters]

MOO from police wanted poster "BG last seen 2:30.- I have assumed that is
the time stamp from the phone video.

MOO again, DP actively calling on cell 3:00, physically on trail 3:11 amd presumably near to yelling his head off for them soon after.

MOO I am speculating that with so little time BG was interrupted, killed his victims to prevent identification and slipped away using his thorough knowledge of the bridge and surrounding area.

If anyone’s interested, a GH video, info provided by BP.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Praying the suspect is caught or turns himself in before the two weeks period is up. I imagine that was what LE was hoping for by asking the press not to contact family for two weeks.

I suspect the murderer will not turn himself in.

 

[Hatfield]

MOO from police wanted poster "BG last seen 2:30.- I have assumed that is
the time stamp from the phone video.

MOO again, DP actively calling on cell 3:00, physically on trail 3:11 amd presumably near to yelling his head off for them soon after.

MOO I am speculating that with so little time BG was interrupted, killed his victims to prevent identification and slipped away using his thorough knowledge of the bridge and surrounding area.

JMO
That got me wondering about the exit BG took to get out of the area.

If BG was still with the alive girls and he started to hear people shout for the girls names then I agree that he may have panicked and killed them quickly to avoid them identifying him. Maybe he quickly covers their bodies with leaves and then his direction of travel would be one of two ways to avoid the commotion at the bridge area.

He would either cut through the back of L's property and end up on that road north of L's property. You know, the paths we saw that can get you out to a road behind L's property.

Or the only other escape route he had was to stay in the creekbed and walk it down the creek a ways to get farther away from the bridge area before coming up out of the creek.

I may have to take another look at the creek to see what exit points he could have taken if he stayed in the creek and just kept walking away from the bridge area. At some point he would have to come up out of the creek and so maybe he headed for a certain exit area. If he stayed in the creek and walked far enough away he may have had a good exit plan that put him somewhere where he could hide out for a day or so for things to quiet down.

Maybe even way past the cemetary area.

 

[MistyWaters]

And DG didn't go to the bridge, he saw FS and then turned to go to the creek. Then he turned to walk toware Freedom bridge.

I don’t remember for sure when the 2:07pm Snapchat photo brought attention to the bridge but it seems to me it was quite a bit later in the evening.

Anyone remember anything about that? I also don’t recall knowing who captured the shot of it, other than somebody posted it on FB. But perhaps that’s only the time the media/the public became aware of it.

 

[Spy Versus Spy]

Thought the depth of anger , shame and betrayal shown by DC at the PC could only come from someone linked to the Church and/or LE. MOO

Has any scenario been considered where the girls didnt actually go 'Down the Hill' when instructed?

 

[Wild Rose]

Wow, something just hit me when you asked why would BG be louder than any noise from the girls. Maybe he DID see Libby's phone and maybe he took her phone and shoved it in HIS pocket which would make his voice easier to hear. Everyone wonders why BG didn't take the phone, and assumes he did not take the phone off of Libby. Well maybe he did and maybe that is why we hear him fairly well. I personally have dropped my phone out of my pocket just walking in the woods and have to back track to find it, and this is just with normal walking. This killer was marching girls, possibly struggling with girls, who knows what else. Maybe the phone was dropped near the crime scene as he left and he did not realize it fell out. Or maybe the information went into the cloud and he kept the phone.

This makes so much sense! Thx!