IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #37

[BunnyHop]

Once again I'm far behind so apologies if this has already been posted - I'm only on #250! Also, I'm trying to get all of it into one post so as not to take up too much space, lol.

First, here's the link to Sgt. Slocum's interview this morning on WBAT radio:

http://www.wbat.com/episode/tony-slocum/

He recapped the case, pointed out that it's not like TV where cases get solved in an hour, said he's been out to the trail and wouldn't have any worries letting his kids go out there. He says Libby is a hero and how the girls stayed together.

Starting around 6:00 Slocum says LE doesn't know if there were multiple people there. He said LE is not saying the photograph and audio are the same person for sure. He says they believe he was talking to the girls - almost certain from the evidence they have. He says there are 13 people in jail right now due to arrests (not connected to the murders) while checking on tips.

Slocum also talked about the impact of SM on the case. He said the public has overreacted on some things and doesn't want someone going after an innocent person. LE is monitoring SM. He said it's possible that the suspect has left the area but he is positive LE will make an arrest sooner rather than later.

Next, LE has modified the way they are vetting the tips in order to make it more efficient:



http://www.theindychannel.com/news/...w-resources-to-assist-in-delphi-investigation

And finally, here is quote from RL's attorney prior to today's hearing:



http://wishtv.com/2017/03/22/more-t...ation-continues-in-delphi-double-murder-case/

Listening now. First thing I noticed is he emphasized PLURAL- MURDERERS @2:17

http://www.wbat.com/episode/tony-slocum/

@ around 16:00 he mentions Libby's SM.

@ around 18:00 speaks about out of state possible.

@21:00 It doesn't matter how impressive our resources are????

I had to go back to @3:45 where he says, "just let your kids go out and play". <---edited to 3:45

eta: He sounds very "casual" to me.

 

[WebSight]

I think LE enlarged the frame from Libby's video, yes. I should have called it scale factor, as it is the result of the information gathered through data of Libby's cell phone camera ( lens, zoom). The video of the bridge GH is basing his placement of the POI/BG on - as I am too- was taken from a certain distance, with a certain lens/ possible zoom.
When scaling- in the POI/BG pic on the bridge video still (youtube) I had already figured out the bridge walkway width due to Abby's height of 5'4". So when I scaled in the POI, I recreated the opposite side of the POI base on adjusted perspective. I had to move it all further to the left. Then I was able to measure the height. So I was not really worried to know, whether the POI/BG was closer to platform 4 or 5, because a zoom would change it anyway. I only went by a certain width across the feet of the POI/BG.

GH went ahead and found the exact spot on the youtube video of the bridge and scaled in the POI/BG. That's how he saw, where the actual location is.

-Nin

Thank you so much for the detailed explanation. I really do appreciate it. :loveyou:

I still have not been able to watch the video that you posted for me. I am actually glad that I read your response before I do.
Once everyone is tucked for the night I'll watch it then (with the sound turned off - that music, yikes!) :cheers:

 

[MistyWaters]

"He said the public has overreacted on some things and doesn't want someone going after an innocent person."
<snipped from the above link>


It's only my guess but it seems RL might be best kept in jail until the real culprit is arrested, for his own protection. RL is the name and search that's been heavily connected via SM.


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[MsMarple]

Thank you for the update. I'm mostly on phone, and for some reason my "thank you" button hasn't worked on phone for over 4 months! :dunno:

The quotes were excellent to attach, and appear so clean in your post. Just an FYI, with fabulous posts like yours that folks want to reply to, the do not appear when folks respond. Just a note in case others care.... I changed from putting into at and instead put in "......x.x.x.xxxx" quotes so it can be actually pulled forward with quote in a reply. Just a subtlety and nuance of the site fyi as many times I am so and have to backtrack to see the quote on the computer (and CANNOT backtrack when I'm on my phone to see original post)

Until recently I put msm quotes in italics using " " but changed back to using the quote box because some readers didn't understand that they came from news articles. I get what you're saying - when the quoted statement in the msm link doesn't show up in a reply it can get confusing. That's why I stopped using the quote box in the first place, because it doesn't carry over in replies.

When it's something really important if I reply I'll go ahead and copy the info and put it in a quote box and include the link again in order to stay clear but man, it's a PITA.ullhair:

 

[margarita25]

The voice sounds smooth to me, jmo.
(ETA: I hadn't weighed in on his voice yet, figured I might as well.)

 

[pet friend]

With RL being obviously innocent where do you guy see LE going next?

Have they wasted too too much time by staying too close to the crime scene?

I was was going to ask if anyone knows how this works. Does one team work on searching locally whilst another goes futher afield?

There has been nothing verifying RL is "obviously innocent". LE themselves have stated regarding their search warrant @ po house, is to rule him in or out as a poi. Of course I am waiting until the search warrant is revealed. There is a reason why it is sealed currently. IMHO

 

[atmh]

Listening now. First thing I noticed is he emphasized PLURAL- MURDERERS @2:17

I realize you didn't intend any misleading with this comment, but to clarify (for those who didn't listen to the audio link), he says, "the murder or murderERS...", not just the latter.

 

[BunnyHop]

Once again I'm far behind so apologies if this has already been posted - I'm only on #250! Also, I'm trying to get all of it into one post so as not to take up too much space, lol.

First, here's the link to Sgt. Slocum's interview this morning on WBAT radio:

http://www.wbat.com/episode/tony-slocum/

He recapped the case, pointed out that it's not like TV where cases get solved in an hour, said he's been out to the trail and wouldn't have any worries letting his kids go out there. He says Libby is a hero and how the girls stayed together.

Starting around 6:00 Slocum says LE doesn't know if there were multiple people there. He said LE is not saying the photograph and audio are the same person for sure. He says they believe he was talking to the girls - almost certain from the evidence they have. He says there are 13 people in jail right now due to arrests (not connected to the murders) while checking on tips.

Slocum also talked about the impact of SM on the case. He said the public has overreacted on some things and doesn't want someone going after an innocent person. LE is monitoring SM. He said it's possible that the suspect has left the area but he is positive LE will make an arrest sooner rather than later.

Next, LE has modified the way they are vetting the tips in order to make it more efficient:



http://www.theindychannel.com/news/...w-resources-to-assist-in-delphi-investigation

And finally, here is quote from RL's attorney prior to today's hearing:



http://wishtv.com/2017/03/22/more-t...ation-continues-in-delphi-double-murder-case/

:tyou: :yourock:

 

[BunnyHop]

Listening now. First thing I noticed is he emphasized PLURAL- MURDERERS @2:17

http://www.wbat.com/episode/tony-slocum/

@ around 16:00 he mentions Libby's SM.

@ around 18:00 speaks about out of state possible.

@21:00 It doesn't matter how impressive our resources are????

I had to go back to @3:45 where he says, "just let your kids go out and play". <---edited to 3:45

eta: He sounds very "casual" to me.

Take the time to really listen. Stop it where pertinent. Take notes.

http://www.wbat.com/episode/tony-slocum/

 

[alexwood]

My first post. I have done my best to read every post in this forum regarding the murders of Abby and Libby. I agree with a great deal of the theories, statements and or opinions I have read thus far. I look forward to any feedback. It doesn&#8217;t hurt my feelings to give 2 cents and get change back. I&#8217;m not a believer in coincidences.

&#8220;Coincidence is the word we use when we can't see the levers and pulleys&#8221; &#8211; Emma Bull

The images below were captured from a news media video located at this link [video=youtube;s91Q1WRuN3E]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s91Q1WRuN3E[/video]


Below shows 2 images of RL on February 16, 2017 on his property near the location of the crime scene.

The below image is of the suspect (BG) identified by LE from a video found on Libby German&#8217;s cell phone February 13, 2017.

BG

I am sure most of you are recognizing the resemblances between RL and BG from the above images. Here&#8217;s my questions based on my observations.

1. Are they both are wearing hoodies?
2. Are they both wearing camouflaged baseball style caps?
3. Are they both wearing similar outer jackets over the hoodies?
4. Are they both wearing jeans?
5. Are they both wearing glasses? Maybe transition lens.
6. Are they both displaying the same style of gait?
7. WHY WOULD BG WANT TO PORTRAY HIMSELF AS RL?
a. Is it a coincidence that the suspect is attempting to look like the property owner where he is planning on committing the crime?
b. Do Abby and Libby know RL?
c. If so, would this allow someone to get close to Abby and Libby before they realize it&#8217;s not RL?
d. Did BG know RL and where his property lines were located?
e. Maybe BG had a grudge with RL with so much sophisticated effort in framing him? It sure has taken the attention away from BG.
8. What alarmed Libby to begin recording BG?
a. If Libby or Abby was acquainted with RL did they think it was RL and started recording for fun and then realized it was not RL?
b. Did she realize it was someone else she recognized and then hid her phone?
c. Did Libby think the man was over dressed for the current temperature? Was BG over dressed for the temperature as well as possible concealing a weapon and other items needed in order to commit the pre-planned crime?
d. Notice how Abby is dressed on the bridge in the photo Libby had posted to snap chat. It appears a light jacket with a light shirt. Sun was shining and notice the fall of her shadow on the bridge as does BG&#8217;s shadow in his photo. This is the same time of the day.
9. Was it a coincidence this terrible crime happened on Monday, February 13[SUP]th[/SUP]?
a. Was it public knowledge that there would be no school on this day?
b. How far in advance was it posted and how was this information passed on to the community?
c. Did anyone from either family mention to anyone that Abby and Libby would be going to the trail that day? Did anyone mention to anyone else the time they would be getting dropped off?

I don&#8217;t find it much of a coincidence at all that BG went out of his way to portray RL as a ruse for getting close to the girls and to allow anyone else in the area to believe he was RL with just a quick glance. I don&#8217;t find it a coincidence the bodies were found on RL&#8217;s property. BG gathered intel and conducted recons of the area and rehearsed the phases to commit these killings. It&#8217;s not a coincident he was aware of the exact time window he had to complete the crime and flee the area before a search party would be on scene saturating the woods searching for the girls.

IMO known facts instead of assumptions: BG was totally unaware Libby had a cell phone much less had already recorded him and was continuously recording. If Libby&#8217;s phone was found on her person or in her clothing BG never searched for the phone or if the phone was found tossed away from the scene Libby deliberately cached the phone for LE to recover.

Confusion: Was the area of the crime scene searched by volunteers the night of February 13[SUP]th[/SUP]? Is there a chance the bodies were overlooked in the dark or are they certain the bodies were not there during the initial search? I have read where there was a theory the bodies could have been brought back to the crime scene between 2:00 &#8211; 9:30 am.

Excellent Post, Savoy, and welcome to Websleuths! I can tell that much thought went into this. Appreciate your insight.
(Love that little doggie!)

 

[FrostedGlass]

For those who are not from Indiana our weather can be a little strange. We can go for weeks and the temp not get out of the teens. Then jump to the 50's for a day or two and back to the teens. I went back and looked at the temps for the days prior to 2/13. On 2/9 the high was 24. On 2/10 it was 43. On 2/11 it was 59. On 2/12 it was 50. Then on 2/13 it was 43. So it does not surprise me to see Abby in a spring like jacket. And IIRC Libby in a t-shirt and sweats. I am assuming that around 2-3 would be the warmest part of the day. I could see BG wearing what he is wearing in the picture early in the morning but MOO he is over dressed for this time of day. Again MOO.

For a while, I imagined him just getting off work at the packing plant; still dressed for working in the cold area, still had his safety goggles hanging around his neck. But then, I couldn't get that scenario to play out in any way that made sense so I gave it up.

Men often tolerate the cold better than women so I'm assuming he didn't have any place to leave his coat as the day warmed up.

 

[liltexans]

Police investigating the murders of Delphi teenagers Libby German and Abby Williams called for help Thursday and got it.

Scores of officers from across the state showed up to follow-up on a backlog of tips and leads.


The number of police actively working the double homicide has fallen from 200 to two dozen. What happened Thursday showed detectives that if they need help, it&#8217;s only a few phone calls away.

100 officers from 20 different departments helped catch up on a backlog of 2,400. Detectives looking for the person or persons who killed Libby German and Abby Williams have, according to state police Sgt. Kim Riley, been busy.

&#8220;We looked at over 300 people. We have a few we are still looking at hard,&#8221; he said.

http://www.wthr.com/article/delphi-investigators-get-help-with-backlog-of-tips

 

[liltexans]

Dozens of police departments that initially sent officers to help with the investigation have called them back home.

Some might see it as an indication that the importance of this investigation is diminishing. &#8220;Well, they are going to be completely wrong.&#8221; Riley said.

&#8220;We are not going to stop working," Riley said. "This is an important case. We want to put resolution to this and put a stop to this person or persons that are involved with this.&#8221;

http://www.wthr.com/article/delphi-investigators-get-help-with-backlog-of-tips

 

[liltexans]

It&#8217;s been almost a week since investigators searched the home of Ron Logan, the man who owns the property were Abby and Libby were found. Although it doesn&#8217;t appear as if they found any significant evidence, items removed from the home and farm outbuildings are still being evaluated, according to Riley.

&#8220;He is still a subject of interest," said Riley. There are 50 or 60 people who are subjects of interest.&#8221;

http://www.wthr.com/article/delphi-investigators-get-help-with-backlog-of-tips

 

[kellala]

Whenever I see a smaill time frame I tbink of Gabby Doolin

Remember Ted Buddy? How many women he seriously injured and sexually assault in 15 min?


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[FriscoKid]

Thanks for this. I'm not trying to nit pick so please don't take it that way, but then you do believe BG is a serial killer. Also, do you think he had a gun in his coat? I happen to think I see one, but different people see different things.

Don't know about him being an SK but seems to me he would have had a lot of nerve for it to have been his first time. A gun is one of the very few things I can think of that could be used to control two able-bodied teenagers - especially ones who had the forethought to record the guy.


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[apples12]

I listened to Tony Slocum's interview and, in addition to the points mentioned by BunnyHop about what stood out, I would add the following. He stressed that the girls "were doing all the right things", therefore I might conclude that they are not suspecting a cat fishing scenario (meeting a boy without telling the parents). Second, after being asked, "Do you monitor social media?", Slocum says, "yes, thats a starting point" and later..."that's how we got the video on the cellphone". Makes me wonder again about The Cloud.

 

[Confusion]

What is your theory? What is your simple answer?...please share. It might give all of us some new direction or idea of what happened. TIA

I know you weren't asking me, but I'm going to answer anyway. The simplest answer I see is:
BG saw the sister drop the girls off and decided to check them out. He found a place to park, walked the trail, watched them for a while, and planned out his attack. During that time the friends passed him and waved to the girls on the other side of the bridge. He left and went back to his vehicle, and he added the extra clothes (possibly to look like RL from a distance if he knows him, or just to avoid messing up what he was wearing). He then went back and crossed the bridge as the girls were headed back north on it. Libby may have realized he was the same guy in different clothes and thought it was odd. Just to be safe, she videoed him from a distance to show her grandparents when she got home.

After they passed each other on the bridge and the girls got a little ahead of him, he turned around and followed them back which made Libby suspicious enough to turn the recorder on and put the phone in her pocket. They got off the bridge and started to run toward RL's house, but he caught them by the cemetery and brought them down to where they were found. After the girls were dead, he checked again for witnesses and left. When the interviewed woman arrived, he was just leaving, and the couple arrived after he was gone.

I don't think it had anything to do with drug deals, revenge on someone else, or any of the other common motives in movies and tv shows. I believe it was just an unsavory man and two innocent girls in the same lace under the right circumstances for a tragedy. MOO

 

[myzzy]

We are getting closer. Something is about to "fit" into place. I can feel it.


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[kstephens98]

Here is my analysis of the state of the investigation up to this point. <modsnip>

IMO, I think LE believes they know exactly who the perp is. I believe initially LE didn&#8217;t think he was involved, but after checking his alibi they found he was not being truthful. At some point LE also scrutinized the video and audio evidence they have and determined the this person is a very close match and could not be excluded.
<modsnip>
I think LE has not officially named this person as a POI or Suspect yet. There could be various reasons why, but my best guess is that they do not have DNA evidence of the murderer and they are looking for/compiling evidence that ties this man directly to the crime.

I may or may not be correct in my analysis. But IF I am, it still leaves me with unanswered questions.

1. COD &#8211; My thoughts are that there is a high likelihood that a gun was used. The person LE has in custody does not have any outward signs of defensive wounds. This leads me to believe that these were not &#8220;up close and personal&#8221; murders. In addition, I think for one person to control and kill two people it would have to occur very quickly. I am not completely sold on this, however, because guns are very loud and no one that I know of has reported hearing gunshots. But to me, use of a gun is the most likely.
2. How and Why? &#8211; I think he confronted them on the bridge and marched them to the spot where they were found and murdered them there. I don&#8217;t know if he intended to commit murder or if the situation escalated before getting out of control. There is simply not enough information available for me to have any reasonable supposition regarding what took place during the crime. Once the murders happened, I think it&#8217;s possible the perp did some staging at the crime scene by hiding the bodies and/or making it appear something else may have happened. After that I think he left the immediate area in a vehicle that was parked very close. While enroute, he disposed of incriminating evidence. <modsnip>.


<modsnip>

All MOO.