IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #38

[rainny03]

IMO and this is just my opinion I honestly believe that this is the work of a serial killer. Is there anyone else that thinks this could be a possibility ? I just think that it's to coincidental that there has been so many other similar crimes not far from this case with similar MO's .. IMO this BG is a very organized killer and had definitely did his homework .. I may be way off and I hope I didn't overstep my boundaries on this thread..

 

[ninij9]

<b>RTV6 (WRTV - Indianapolis) was live.</b><br />
February 14 at 7:58pm · <br />
We're over the search area where two 13-year-old Carroll County girls went missing. Two bodies have been found in the area, but not yet positively identified as the girls<br />
<br />
35 minute aerial video of the crime scene

Hi all. I have major suckage with copy and paste on Tapatalk. Hopefully I've done this right. Somewhere someone mentioned divers never made it out there on 03/14. I thought I remembered seeing a lone diver with the walkers in the creek right after they were found. From the live chopper footage. Well after rewinding it a whole bunch, what my eye first caught as a diver looks now upon closer scrutiny to be something caught on a root system sticking out of the water at approx 19:00 to 19:20 in video. There are some searchers nearby just downstream of it. Clothes? Something else? I dunno, but it's something.

This footage is actually pretty Germaine to our threads as it captures the surrounding areas right after the girls are found. I find it fascinating. Note the news chopper has no clue where to shoot until he sees LE chopper low in that area. Ok this is nothing I'm sure, but I've beat every other darn horse to death here.

P.S if I copied it wrong can someone not tech challenged help me pretty please.

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[Yellow Rose]

CARMEL, Ind.&#8211;In light of the recent murders in Delphi, Bulletproof Women is hosting a special Bulletproof Juniors self-defense class.

From 1:00 p.m. to 3:00 p.m. at Cornerstone Lutheran Church in Carmel, young girls and their mothers can learn tactics to protect themselves and have heightened situational awareness.

Leah Severson wrote the book Bulletproof Women in 2015 after collecting articles about teen safety for her two daughters. Like many parents, Severson thought she would talk to her daughters about alcohol poisoning and campus safety before they went to college. But the dangers, Severson says, exist even before young women head off to school.

&#8220;Usually the only safety message parents give to kids is: Don&#8217;t talk to strangers,&#8221; but Severson says children are routinely put in situations with adults they don&#8217;t know. When students go to school, they&#8217;re often confronted with teachers and staff members they&#8217;re unfamiliar with. During the summer, counselors and administrators at summer camps are virtual strangers.

&#8220;We don&#8217;t really teach our kids how to communicate with strangers and talk to people in a way where they can develop their intuition and sense of knowing when a conversation feels weird and a little bit off, or when it&#8217;s right,&#8221; Severson added.

http://fox59.com/2017/03/26/self-defense-for-teens-after-delphi-murders/

So sad but Libby would have definitely signed up for something like this. She did sign up and attended something similar

 

[Deleted member 278]

One of the most puzzling things to me is how quickly the perp managed to get the girls out of sight. The woman who was on the bridge not long after Libby posted Abby's picture said she didn't see anything unusual and didn't see the girls at all. It's like they vanished into thin air.

Personally, I don't consider heavy.com to be reputable. And, as it says in the article, it was posted on FB. All FB posts are considered rumor here.

JMO

 

[BoggLed in Ohio]

IMO and this is just my opinion I honestly believe that this is the work of a serial killer. Is there anyone else that thinks this could be a possibility ? I just think that it's to coincidental that there has been so many other similar crimes not far from this case with similar MO's .. IMO this BG is a very organized killer and had definitely did his homework .. I may be way off and I hope I didn't overstep my boundaries on this thread..

Ive teetered back and forth on this but yes i do think SK possible if not likely...i don't think a tweaked out meth head or run of the mill vagrant could vanish so successfully.

 

[MistyWaters]

No. You are misunderstanding me. If a tipster called in a tip about someone in their own family because of the photo and voice, I am thinking that the person who called it in would know if LE interviewed the family member.

I don't know how to make what I'm saying clearer. Sorry and it is JMO anyway.



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Okay, thanks for explaining. If I had good reason to suspect someone and knew they also had opportunity, if not calling the tip in more than once, I'd also file a written report at my local police station.

From what you've explained, I'm assuming the family member doesn't live in the same household. But if they do, and if they're so distrustful to even suspect another person whom they live with is capable of homicide, I'd surely hope they would pursue alternate living arrangements.

 

[FreeRoad]

No. You are misunderstanding me. If a tipster called in a tip about someone in their own family because of the photo and voice, I am thinking that the person who called it in would know if LE interviewed the family member.

I don't know how to make what I'm saying clearer. Sorry and it is JMO anyway.



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Respectfully, I can imagine situations in which a family member would not know if a relative they had reported, were interviewed by LE.

The individuals could be estranged from each other, and not communicating.

The person who was reported, and potentially questioned by LE, may have secrets to hide (from their family) and/or be ashamed, and would not announce that they had been interviewed in relation to a crime.

The person the tip was called in about could be in hiding, even from family. Or to protect family.

Just a few ideas off my cuff, and MOO.

 

[Spellbound]

Where is the confirmation that JW is behind bars?

https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase...tRTBNekF5TnpFMk1qTXdPamd3T0RVd09UUXlPV0k9In19
looks to me he may be out already? Trial scheduled for May. Need someone to look at this and see how it reads to you. Thanks

one snipped area, but there is a lot more at the link provided above

No Contact Order Issued

POR - No Contact Order No Contact Order - Pretrial Release; Issued by: HON MARK D. STONER


Order Signed:
11/22/2016

.

 

[AmateurAnalyst73]

And if a credible tip were called in, the caller wouldn't be likely to broadcast it, either, IMO, because this is obviously an extremely dangerous individual capable of possibly seeking revenge or having associates who might.

Unless you're involved in the investigation you don't know what tips were received.

I don't understand jumping to conclusions based on something LE doesn't say in an ongoing homicide case, particularly if you have no facts relative to the crime and have never investigated a homicide.

 

[ninij9]

IMO and this is just my opinion I honestly believe that this is the work of a serial killer. Is there anyone else that thinks this could be a possibility ? I just think that it's to coincidental that there has been so many other similar crimes not far from this case with similar MO's .. IMO this BG is a very organized killer and had definitely did his homework .. I may be way off and I hope I didn't overstep my boundaries on this thread..

At this point, I would consider almost anything.

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[Bemused]

I agree, LE should have, by now, released a statement. I dont understand the secrecy in this case. Is this normal?

Why should they have? Curious as to your reasoning. They're not prepared to is my guess.

 

[rainny03]

I also find it to be extremely odd that the girls weren't located the evening they went missing ?? Does anyone know the exact distance from where they were last seen to where they were found ? IMO it didn't appear to be that far that a k-9 dog couldn't have located them that evening.. ?? I don't know maybe I'M just over thinking stuff ??

 

[Bemused]

But by now, wouldn't there be enough evidence to let the public know they've got him? It's typically of some importance to not let the public worry about a killer on the loose. Just curious. All moo.

They've said they collected items for testing during the last search warrant and it could be six weeks until results are known.

 

[ninij9]

LE may have the need to continue collecting tips, either because they believe that peripheral individuals are still unknown to them, or because useful pieces of evidence could still be gleaned form additional tips. If they announce any kind of "conclusion" it could have a limiting effect on additional info coming forth from the public.

jmo

Agreed, also now their evidence has to be completely on point and exact because any defense lawyer worth his salt is going to introduce RL as a possible suspect to create reasonable doubt. In other words, LEs own secrecy regarding RL may come back to bite them in their behinds if they don't bring their "A" game. JMO.

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[ReggieHammond]

I never thought for a minute that this could be the case. But if that is what happened, then that may better explain why this case is not really coming up with an arrest... things, such as...

-why nobody is reporting BG, at least, not the 'right tip' is coming in on him - people who are involved in that would presumably be less likely to report something that may end up bringing jailtime to themselves;

-it may better explain why there has been no leak of an indication of a sexual component to this crime (because there may not have been one, and if not, then it's troublesome to imagine WHY they would've been killed at all, but that could explain that;

-it may better explain why police aren't sure if there was one perp, or more than one (wouldn't there prob be more than 1 if it were a drug related thing?)

-it may better explain why the DNA thing is kind of a mystery.. we know that LE HAS DNA of some kind, but we don't know if they know if what they have is related to the crime, ie if the girls were not molested, and were instead just shot or something, for being in the wrong place at the wrong time, DNA from the murderer(s) may be difficult to find, or to know if it is related, until after the perp is caught;

-if this type of situation is what happened, then the reward amount is not high enough to entice someone to come forward, imho. LE would, imho, have to offer immunity to the informant that they would not be prosecuted themselves, and the amount would have to be higher perhaps.

People involved in drugs may be less apt to make that call and rat out an associate, as opposed to someone who knows a sex perp. For it to have been worth it to such a perp to kill 2 young girls, the stakes would have had to have been very high. So what would the girls have seen that would have risked such high stakes for such an offender? I doubt if someone was outside in the open making meth on public lands in cold weather? Doubt if the stakes would have been high enough if some guys were just *doing* drugs. If the girls were out in the open, they wouldn't have come upon a huge stash of drugs (who would leave a huge stash of drugs outside?).

So what could they have possibly seen that would have risked so much to the perps that they would rather risk being caught for killing 2 young girls than risk that the girls could report them for?

I do not believe for a second that this had anything to do with drugs.

If this was a "big drug deal" it wouldn't have gone down on a public trail. These things go down in abandoned buildings, in someone's home, or even in an abandoned parking lot. Nobody goes through the trouble of hikinh through the woods to do a drug deal, only to have it go down on a public trail, where anybody can pop up at any time.

Furthermore, I don't understand why anybody who was spotted dealing drugs would go through the trouble of marching the girls through the woods, possibly across a creek, just to execute them. If the offender was so worried about being caught, why not execute them on the bridge, then get away as quickly as possible?

Contrary to popular belief, drug dealers don't want to kill people. They want to sell drugs and make money, and may kill in the event there's a debt owed, or someone may be going to court to testify against them. I honestly don't think it makes too much sense to kill two kids, on a whim, because they saw you selling drugs....you just leave. To go from drug dealing to double murder in this way, makes no sense to me.

As far as tips go, we absolutely have no idea who's called in what, about whom. So it's not fair to assume BG hasn't been ratted out yet. As far as COD, we don't know. LE has not released this information yet, so we have no idea whether there was or wasn't a sexual component to this case. Even if there was, DNA is something that may not be readily available. There are "non-secreters" that exist in the population, and although a minority, they are out there.

In cases like this, the most simple explanations are usually the best. Either BG knew the girls, in some way, or he didn't, and they ran into a dangerous pervert out there in the woods that day. He has a predilection for young girls, and saw an opportunity and decided to act. Whether or not he's done it before is debatable..but what's not is the distinct possibility that he'll do it again.

Sorry for rambling, but the drug thing makes no sense. Of course, there has been no evidence released to support my theory either, so I can be 100% off.

Everything above is MOO.

 

[Blythe]

Prolly my last post here. Or not.

We say we want justice. And we do. Yet I know that is not enough for me.

I am saying that ultimately I will want to know how this homicide happened. Who did this? How? Why?

I want to know how to foresee this. How to identify a psychopath without fearing everyone. I want to send my children out for typical experiences without needing to instill fear or destroy their imagination with too much caution or even my constant presence.

I want to know how we can become a more observant community for each other. How we can encourage and support community members to be aware, to see, to notice, to question and to engage.

We as civilians need to do something. NYC has initiatives for tax credits to private property owners who install surveillance cameras, as well as, opportunities for shops to be vetted as safe places for children to go for help.
I realize these are urban solutions but are examples of what I mean. *(Leiby's Law and Leiby's Initiative)

Enough is enough. Justice is not enough. MOO but mostly my own sentiment.

 

[Bemused]

I also find it to be extremely odd that the girls weren't located the evening they went missing ?? Does anyone know the exact distance from where they were last seen to where they were found ? IMO it didn't appear to be that far that a k-9 dog couldn't have located them that evening.. ?? I don't know maybe I'M just over thinking stuff ??

There is a lot of information in the media thread so maybe that will help. I'm not familiar with the distances or orientation of the land and points of interest.

 

[Spellbound]

I also find it to be extremely odd that the girls weren't located the evening they went missing ?? Does anyone know the exact distance from where they were last seen to where they were found ? IMO it didn't appear to be that far that a k-9 dog couldn't have located them that evening.. ?? I don't know maybe I'M just over thinking stuff ??

They were not looking for bodies, but for live girls ... lost, runaways, went off somewhere, maybe they fell and were hurt, etc. They had nothing to indicate an abduction or murder had taken place. Once it got dark, it would have been nearly impossible to continue searching the wooded areas.

 

[skibaboo]

RTV6 (WRTV - Indianapolis) was live.
February 14 at 7:58pm ·
We're over the search area where two 13-year-old Carroll County girls went missing. Two bodies have been found in the area, but not yet positively identified as the girls

35 minute aerial video of the crime scene

Hi all. I have major suckage with copy and paste on Tapatalk. Hopefully I've done this right. Somewhere someone mentioned divers never made it out there on 03/14. I thought I remembered seeing a lone diver with the walkers in the creek right after they were found. From the live chopper footage. Well after rewinding it a whole bunch, what my eye first caught as a diver looks now upon closer scrutiny to be something caught on a root system sticking out of the water at approx 19:00 to 19:20 in video. There are some searchers nearby just downstream of it. Clothes? Something else? I dunno, but it's something.

This footage is actually pretty Germaine to our threads as it captures the surrounding areas right after the girls are found. I find it fascinating. Note the news chopper has no clue where to shoot until he sees LE chopper low in that area. Ok this is nothing I'm sure, but I've beat every other darn horse to death here.

P.S if I copied it wrong can someone not tech challenged help me pretty please.

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Ok you've triggered a memory. A day or 2 after the girls were found, was there not a dive team and boat back at the creek? Or have I imagined that/got confused with another case? :thinking:


ETA: Found this

Tuesday, Feb. 14, 2017

Tuesday morning: The search resumes with teams of volunteers and police officers. The effort also includes K-9 units and dive teams.

 

[ninij9]

Prolly my last post here. Or not.

We say we want justice. And we do. Yet I know that is not enough for me.

I am saying that ultimately I will want to know how this homicide happened. Who did this? How? Why?

I want to know how to foresee this. How to identify a psychopath without fearing everyone. I want to send my children out for typical experiences without needing to instill fear or destroy their imagination with too much caution or even my constant presence.

I want to know how we can become a more observant community for each other. How we can encourage and support community members to be aware, to see, to notice, to question and to engage.

We as civilians need to do something. NYC has initiatives for tax credits to private property owners who install surveillance cameras, as well as, opportunities for shops to be vetted as safe places for children to go for help.
I realize these are urban solutions but are examples of what I mean. *(Leiby's Law and Leiby's Initiative)

Enough is enough. Justice is not enough. MOO but mostly my own sentiment.

I agree with you. If we could learn from each case we could be better prepared, or could we? I really don't know. I didn't know New Yorkers are given a tax credit for CCTV systems placed outside home. I will have to get on that for next year as I spent a chunk doing so. Good to know.

I'm going to be honest and agree that I want to know all of the details as well. It's my nature. I always have to know everything. Drives my family nuts. Wish I could put my nosy nose to some good use. Anyway, just wanted to say I get what you are posting. Hopefully the FBI benefits from what they learn from these crimes.

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